9mm (9x19) minor PF open gun

[Pro-Pain]

I am debating building a dedicated open blaster (comp'd and dot'd) purely to shoot steel. I was going to run minor PF, as this is all I would need to knock over steel. For price, was going to keep it in 9x19, as it's only going to be used for steel and ad that, a few times a year.

Is there enough chamber pressure for the comp to work right when shooting at minor PF? Was considering 147 gr. bullets, and therefore a lower powder charge. Would 115/124's be better to cause a little more "oomph" and for more gases to be diverted?

I only go to a few steel shoots a year, and run L and Prd, so don't need a full-blown open gun as well, just a steel tack driver.

Any ideas/suggestions?

[flack jacket]

Pro,

My steel challenge 9mm loads are usually between 900-1000 fps. moving a 115 -124 gr bullet. (your preference)

Enough gas pressure to get the comp to work( I only have a 2 port titanium on mine) but not as efficient as Major ammunition with efficient comp.

Spring rates will need to be determined if your pistol will run on the lower power loads.

Hope it helps!

[Joe4d]

What is your production gun ? There are extended ported barrels available that nearly drop in for quite a few different guns, Also in steel the super high capacity of STI's isnt really needed. Take a 5 inch M&P add an extended ported barrel and a slide ride Cmore STS or delta point, respring and load 115 gr bullets to about 1000 fps with HS6. Your doing alot less double tapping in most steel matches than you would do in USPSA, and with the mouse fart load you wouldnt need a hole lot of comp efficiency.

[Seth]

I had a STI Trubor with the 2 port comp. It was a RIOT to shoot WWB through. It ran very reliably with factory 9mm and the comp DID make a substantial difference. I made no changes between the major load and WWB... just plopped in different ammo and the gun ran. The beauty of it was the dot just kind of jiggled in the glass.

I say go for it. Its fun and can be extremely reliable.

[Chris Keen]

for your particular application I have to agree with what joe said.

[Hi-Power Jack]

When I first bought my STI TruBor, I intended to

shoot only 9mm factory ammo, and I did for

four or five months.

It ran 99.9% when it was clean, and I had very

little recoil/muzzle lift. With some tweaking,

probably could have made it 100% reliable. The

brass was just dribbling out of the gun (springs

were a little too heavy).

I never tried 147 grains (or even 124's) - I

stuck with 115 factory ammo, and it worked

very well - I suspect the lighter loads would

be better than the heavier bullets, but I've

never tried them.

Lot of fun to shoot it - but then I found some

good major loads, and I shoot them now for

IPSC:) Since I'm reloading now, if I need a

steel load, I just reload some lighter loads.

An Open Gun is an awful lot of fun, and very

versatile - it will spoil you:)

Jack

[soaringf22]

I am debating building a dedicated open blaster (comp'd and dot'd) purely to shoot steel. I was going to run minor PF, as this is all I would need to knock over steel. For price, was going to keep it in 9x19, as it's only going to be used for steel and ad that, a few times a year.

Is there enough chamber pressure for the comp to work right when shooting at minor PF? Was considering 147 gr. bullets, and therefore a lower powder charge. Would 115/124's be better to cause a little more "oomph" and for more gases to be diverted?

I only go to a few steel shoots a year, and run L and Prd, so don't need a full-blown open gun as well, just a steel tack driver.

Any ideas/suggestions?

I wouldnt use 147's bigger bullets dont "generally" use more powder in fact they use the same or less. for example when running a common powder like titegroup in 115s hodgdon says to run 4.5-4.8 gr but for the 147s they say to run 3.2-3.6

In this sport we generally dont go exactly by the reloading manual but I know that is where I start my loads anyway.

in my .45 i shoot 4.2gr of wst for both 185s and 230, my 230 make major at 753fps, my 185 load is running along at 780 fps. just a little Food for thought when picking a bullet.

p.s. shooting open for steel will make you want to shoot it for everything, enjoy.

[Aircooled6racer]

Hello: If you don't want to shoot Open then I would put a dot on your production pistoL. I would use a 121 Montana Gold bullet with 4.2 grains of Tite Group at 1.140" OAL. That is a flat shooting load that will knock down steel. Will this shoot as well as a real Open pistol----no. It will give you an idea if you like open division or not. I built a Glock open pistol to shoot steel and plink around with. It was fun but I could do the same with a 22 and a C-More. When I bought a used Open STI 2011 and shot it, I was hooked. That STI using 95 grain bullets was like shooting the 22's. I am not sure it would have knocked down steel though. On your production open pistol they should make a conversion piece that slides into the rear sight slot so you can add the dot easier. That is how I did my Glock with a slide mounted J-Point but you could use a C-More,Leapold or Burris. Thanks, Eric

[OpenDot]

If you have a stock of 9mm 147's, I would build the open gun to major specs so you can do minor and major...then start playing with powder charges with the 147's to get the comp to work. 147's sit deep in the case and OAL may be the determining factor here but you can still get min PF no problem. Comp may not be as functional unless you hotten the load.

I've noticed on 147's... the Crimp spec and OAL is where you control the game

[PaulW]

I use my IPSC Bedell open gun, 5 lb spring and a load at 130pf and it works awesome!

[Pro-Pain]

Thanks for the tips/suggestions everyone. I'm still debating on building this, as I have a lot of ammo that needs bought to practice with, but was debating building a "fun gun."

I like the idea of the barrel, going with a comped/ported barrel. That was one idea I had.

As far as platform, I'm not sure yet. Debating on the Glock, as I use that for Production, and parts/extras/mags are somewhat cheap and readily available. Didn't want to dump a lot of money into it, at least not yet, so not looking for a full STI open race gun.

Was also thinking that with a big honkin' comp on the end, even if their wasn't enough gas to divert and take the full advantage of the compensation, it still makes a slick barrel weight to help slow down muzzle flip.

[Bansheex]

I had Springer build me a 9mm XDM open gun for Steel and USPSA. It works great shooting 124gr MT gold fmj with 6.5grs of Autocomp @ 114.0 oal. Power factor is around 148

[CiDirkona]

I switched from HP38 to PowerPistol, and at the same velocity got much better use of the comp with the slower PowerPistol powder.

[40S&W]

Have an STI. Have two different 5" comp'ed top ends. One is for 38SC shooting both minor & major 115 gr., all I do is change the springs, 10# for major, & 8# for minor. The other top end is for 9mm minor. Shoot 115 gr. 1200 fps with an 8# spring. The scope is a Aimpoint Comp XD 10 MOA. I shoot 38SC major in USPSA & 38SC minor or 9mm minor for steel plate. Shooting 9mm minor 1200 fps 115 gr. will knock down any steel and is more than enough for static steel. The gun with either top end runs 100%. As for mags I run 170mm (29+1) and 140mm (22+1) in either 38SC or 9mm and only change the mag guts. No hitches with the mags either.

[Aircooled6racer]

Hello: A real cheap open pistol is using a Glock 34 and get another barrel with some holes drilled in it and install a dot in the rear sight slot. I have a friend who is using one for steel and shooting Open minor. He shoots for pure enjoyment since he has bad knees and doesn't see very well. He doesn't win any matches but he doesn't finish last either Thanks, Eric

[Pro-Pain]

Hello: A real cheap open pistol is using a Glock 34 and get another barrel with some holes drilled in it and install a dot in the rear sight slot. I have a friend who is using one for steel and shooting Open minor. He shoots for pure enjoyment since he has bad knees and doesn't see very well. He doesn't win any matches but he doesn't finish last either Thanks, Eric

I run a 34 in Prod. and was considering just putting an extended/ported barrel, or even a little screw on comp. I was also debating building a dedicated 17 upper, and just running the same lower between the 2.

Like I said, only going to use 1-3 matches a year, and practice, but wanted to plink around with it too.

Thanks for all the great info everyone, keep it coming and help me spend my money!

[Bansheex]

I'm building a open gun for my girlfriend. I got a great deal on a Glock 31 in 357sig. I ordered a Wolf 9mm threaded barrel and comp, stainless steel guide rod with 11lb spring, 3 1/2 trigger bar, and a extended slide release.

Need to decide what sights to go with. She likes the red dot on her 22 open steel gun.

Edited April 9, 2011 by Bansheex

[Ross Carter]

To the original question, I have done extensive testing with the 9mm and light loads in my work with Bianchi guns. A compensator makes a definite difference in muzzle rise in my tests against an old style pin barrel that looks like a compensator but with no ports, 6 inch bull barrel both with and without magnaporting on a 5 inch slide, and others, checking to see if I could detect any accuracy improvement or muzzle rise difference. I the Nowlin comp with 3 slanted ports using a bushing barrel is my favorite, a two port with larger ports works good too, any compensator without too many ports and light in weight should work.

For the steel challenge since you shot one target per target, muzzle rise is not as important but it is not a bad thing for your pistol to stay flatter.

[Pro-Pain]

.... any compensator without too many ports and light in weight should work.

For the steel challenge since you shot one target per target, muzzle rise is not as important but it is not a bad thing for your pistol to stay flatter.

Would a heavier compensator work as a makeshift "barrel weight" to help reduce muzzle flip?

Thanks for the tip, that's what I was looking for. I'm sure it's not as great as running a rip-roaring .38 SC set to major, but as bad as I shoot, I need every little edge I can get

[steviesterno]

Pro-Pain,

I would say you should do one in 22 first, see if you like it. It's stupid cheap, and really fun. I have a wilson combat 1911 upper on a build frame, with a nice red dot sitting on top. When it was running, it was the most fun thing I've shot. However, I'm having ejection issues so it's back at the shop. I'd say shoot something fun in 22 (buckmark, ruger, etc) and see how you like it, and you can build an open gun based on how you enjoy it.

I was actually going to scope a 1911 for PSA, but decided irons would be better practice

[Pro-Pain]

I actually have a dedicated 1911 in .22, with the Wilson combat upper I use to play around with, as well as a Mark III 22/45.

for Palmyra, the other shooters I go with shoot their production guns in the stock, and run the limited guns in the open division. I was going to bring my LTD gun for that, but may be at a disadvantage: It's a p-14 running major loads, and all the 9mm I'm loading, I don't think I'm going to have time to develop a nice minor steel load for it, test it, and mass produce. Also, I only have 4 mags, so at 40 roudns I'm worried i may not finish a course or 2, especially if there's a Texas star or :gasp: a Polish plate rack.

Also, I'm not looking to rig/buy a gun and run it in a few weeks, I'm looking for the earliest next year, something I can tweak out and get running right before I take it to a match..