CZ 75 Shadow or STI Trojan 9mm?

[ck1]

blindbat, I'm not cheap, but think I get what you mean... maybe just used to Glocks and $400 pretty much gets you a whole new gun with those... that, and that I'm not new to CZ's at all, I agree with you about the awesomeness of Angus' competition hammer and have my fair share of conversions and upgrades to them and that's what makes me feel the way I do about it.

Guess what I was trying to say is that in this particular case the 75 Shadow is pretty much just a 75B SA with no FPB, lighter springs, and a competition hammer installed... so the $400 premium is pretty steep considering there's not nearly the amount of hand-fitting and such that's going on into putting a good 1911 together, and that I or anyone else familiar with CZ's could put pretty much exactly the same gun together for less than $600 if removing the FPB from a CZ-75B SA was allowed within the IDPA rules, in fact, Angus himself has mentioned on another forum that they're not true "custom shop" guns, they're just assembled from components here in the US, I gathered his point being that they're not cherry-picked or blessed with the same attention to fitting and such as their other custom shop models.

Point is that in the CZ's case the price-tag has more to do the models exclusivity of having the NO-FPB slide which satisfies certain gun-game rules over really anything else, whereas in the Trojan's case most of the time I only hear praise of how well-fit they are when compared to guns costing $3K and such... just an observation. If the 75 Shadow cost maybe $700+ like it probably should then I'd buy two of them, "Value" is a consideration, that's all.

Since you've got both guns I'm looking at, which do you like better and/or which has given you less trouble?

Thanks.

Edited January 12, 2011 by ck1

[ck1]

Anyone else out there who owns both a Shadow and a Trojan 9 who could share their opinion?

Edited January 12, 2011 by ck1

[ck1]

Ended up going with the Trojan... jury is still out on whether I made the right choice, put 250rds through it tonight and while accurate as hell it ran like complete s**t... I did springs and installed an Aftec before the first round was fired, didn't expect the curveball that my support-hand thumb resting against the slide slows down the slide enough to cause feeding issues, that, and loading from slide-lock worked correctly exactly twice.

I'm going to give it another chance, see if i can adapt my grip a little maybe and hope for the issues to work themselves out, but I'm already considering letting it go, taking a bit of a loss and getting a Shadow...I ran 6000rds through my old SP-01 without a single hiccup, the 9mm 1911 has me feeling pretty underwhelmed at this point.

[G34 CORDY]

I dont have a Trojan but I do have a custom shop Shadow and mine has been 100% reliable and right now it's the most accurate gun I have. Completely happy with mine and would buy another in a heart beat if I had to. Sorry to hear your having problems with the Trojan. Look how many votes you had for the shadow that should of tipped you off. Hope everything works out.

[ck1]

Turns out I may have just botched the Aftec install/tune so I'm going to give the Trojan some time to win me over...

The CZs are indeed probably a lot less drama like I and others have known all along, just figured for what they both cost it'd be a lot easier to sell the Trojan to pick up the CZ than vice-versa if I changed my mind... I'll see how it goes, this Trojan is definitely a nice gun though and after reinstalling the stock extractor I can already tell by hand cycling it that'd run WAY better, the poorly-tuned Aftec I put in could've been the whole problem giving me the bad first impression.

[ChristianHE]

Turns out I may have just botched the Aftec install/tune so I'm going to give the Trojan some time to win me over...

The CZs are indeed probably a lot less drama like I and others have known all along, just figured for what they both cost it'd be a lot easier to sell the Trojan to pick up the CZ than vice-versa if I changed my mind... I'll see how it goes, this Trojan is definitely a nice gun though and after reinstalling the stock extractor I can already tell by hand cycling it that'd run WAY better, the poorly-tuned Aftec I put in could've been the whole problem giving me the bad first impression.

Man, I was gonna say... I know you're talking 9mm, but glad you caught the extractor issue. I just got a Trojan .45 and have put 400 thru it with ZERO failures of any kind, no mods of any kind, using the stock Italian magazine and some Wilson 47Ds. I used 100 Winchester White box, 100 of the same reloads I make and use in my XD .45, 100 Georgia Arms reloads and some old 185g flat-point Rainier reloads that won't even run in my XD and it ate them all.

For me, something made here in America was a big part of my decision to go with a Trojan.

[59Bassman]

For what it's worth, I bought the 75 Shadow, and have put 250 through it so far. I'm still wringing it out, but initially I'm very pleased with this gun.

[ck1]

I've got around 700 through it now and I'm really digging it, since I put back the properly set-up extractor it's been just about flawless, I've had a couple (literally 2) FTRB that may be caused by my grip-style of pressing my support-hand thumb against the slide coupled with shooting light 125-130pf rounds and using a 9lb recoil spring.

I had to change the grip-safety to an Ed Brown as the stock one is cut-in and has a weird corner that didn't work with my hand, and I tweaked the sear spring and installed a 17lb mainspring... now I've got it feeling right and the trigger is about as good as they get.

I've done sights, grips, magwell, grip-safety and some minor spring stuff so it is now in "match form". Shooting a match tomorrow and we'll see how it goes, to be fully honest I'm not enough of a 1911-fanboy to forgive very much and I've already spent more on it than I would've had to to get a Shadow running equally as well or better, so if it gives me too much drama there'll be a really nice 9mm 1911 up for grabs... That said, if it runs flawlessly and I do my part and don't completely F' up I'll probaly finish towards the top of the standings, if I don't it won't be because of the gun.

Things I've gleaned after now having spent some time with both types: (1) for the money they cost IMHO the STI is the better value for sure, the way it's fit and put together is far above what one gets in the CZ, in fact it's better than most guns period, I've compared my gun to a few Brown's, Baer's, and Wilson's and a couple were as good none were better. The CZ Shadow's pricetag just buys you a more rare model of a $600 pistol, the extra money is what you've hot to pay right now to get the magic configuration, if CZ started making and importing more of their non-FPB models, where they showed up in LGS's for $500-700 instead of $800-1200 through the custom shop they'd get real popular real fast. (2) CZs are even more underrated than I had originally thought, IMHO anyone who really knows what makes a nice gun and can't admit that a non-FPB CZ with a competition hammer installed can be every bit as nice as a great 1911 is uninformed or just wrong

Edited February 5, 2011 by ck1

[twodownzero]

STI makes an amazing gun for the money. I just wish they made a gun with fronstrap checkering for $1000. They'd have a product nobody could compete with if they did.

I know everyone loves their $2500 custom limited guns, but I really love my Eagle, and it saved me a lot of money.

STI should be really proud of the product they bring to the market.

[ck1]

Just a quick update: over 1000rds through the Trojan 9 now and think I'm finally pretty used to the 1911 platform. It's been boringly reliable, I'm well aware 9mm 1911's can be a PIA but this one just runs and runs, my "recipe" has been a 9lb ISMI recoil spring with a 17lb ISMI mainspring and Wilson 10rd ETM mags shooting either WWB or Federal Champion 115gr cheapo stuff from wallyworld, no real gun-related failures of any kind to report and the slide feels like it's riding on ball-bearings, the finish however looks like I've been through a few tours, STI's bluing is a joke, they should come with a coupon towards a refinish...

So far this thing doesn't just run good for a 9mm 1911, it runs better than just about any 1911 I've ever been around in any caliber, if you're looking for a 1911 that can take some punishment and run drama-free these Trojans are the truth, I've pretty much decided I'm going to put together virtually the same exact gun in .45 down the road, the combination of the undercut trigger-guard and slim grips make other singlestacks just feel clunky and club-like in comparison, I may go to a long flat SVI trigger just to increase the trigger-reach a bit to keep me honest and strictly using the pad of my finger on the trigger when really pushing it at speed, but thus far the ergos have been working great and at 6'2" 225 I don't exactly have small hands either, the gun's slimness just makes it so I can crush the crap out of it and get really far around it with my support-hand and operate all the controls without shifting my grip.

FWIW, I think everyone should try running a 1911 with slim grips for a few hundred rounds to really see how it does on the clock for them regardless of what they may be used to, IMHO there's no reason not to at least give it a try and see if the thin-ness provides any advantages, so many guys pick up a slim-gripped 1911 and go "this isn't right" within mere seconds without really giving it a chance, but I've started to feel that there just may be no real need to deal with the added width and bulk unless one is running a doublestack. YMMV, but worth checking out.