Shape of the Glock

[Mifune326]

First of all, let me say I LOVE my Glocks! And I understand how Glock decided on the geometry of its frames.

But I've always wondered why they chose to make their slides wide and block-like and not a little more tapered like S/A has done with their XDm series.

Anyone know what the method in Glock's madness is as it relates to this?

Edited December 15, 2010 by Mifune326

[Kevin G.]

I would assume that the square shape didn't happen as a result of a specific planned outcome. It was more than likely the result of a lack of benefit aesthetic machining operations would bring to the product. Cost benefit analysis. The bricks do sell and operate extremely well.

[Jman]

It's just in keeping with the frames design. A tall thin slide defeats the low bore axis advantage he achieved using the combination we have.

Jim

[Mifune326]

Ahhhh I see your point. The slide has to be more block-like to keeps its profile as low as possible. Got it. Thanks fellas and a very Merry Christmas to all on BE's forums!

Chris

[Duane Thomas]

It's because of the mechanical operating system used in the gun.

There are two commonly used mechanical operating systems in auto pistols, re how the barrel locks and unlocks during cycling, the internal tilt barrel (commonly called the Colt/Browning system because it was first designed by John Moses Browning and first appeared in guns produced by Colt) and the external tilt barrel (commonly called the Petter system - though it was not actually Charles Petter who first designed it).

The internal tilt barrel system works through having lugs on the top of the barrel mate inside the gun with corresponding lugs inside the top of the slide. This system is seen on guns like the 1911, Browning Hi-Power, CZ-75, etc. Since both the barrel lugs and the corresponding interior of the slide are rounded, internal tilt barrel guns tend to have trim, rounded slides.

The external tilt barrel system works through having the front of the barrel hood mate with the front of the ejection port. This is the system used on guns like the Glock, SIG P220-series, and HK USP and its derivatives, etc. Because, in order to work, the contact surfaces of the barrel hood and the ejection port must be squared-off, external tilt barrel guns tend to have wide, blocky slides.

[Rob D]

It's because of the mechanical operating system used in the gun.

There are two commonly used mechanical operating systems in auto pistols, re how the barrel locks and unlocks during cycling, the internal tilt barrel (commonly called the Colt/Browning system because it was first designed by John Moses Browning and first appeared in guns produced by Colt) and the external tilt barrel (commonly called the Petter system - though it was not actually Charles Petter who first designed it).

The internal tilt barrel system works through having lugs on the top of the barrel mate inside the gun with corresponding lugs inside the top of the slide. This system is seen on guns like the 1911, Browning Hi-Power, CZ-75, etc. Since both the barrel lugs and the corresponding interior of the slide are rounded, internal tilt barrel guns tend to have trim, rounded slides.

The external tilt barrel system works through having the front of the barrel hood mate with the front of the ejection port. This is the system used on guns like the Glock, SIG P220-series, and HK USP and its derivatives. Because, in order to work, the contact surfaces of the barrel hood and the ejection port must be squared-off, external tilt barrel guns tend to have wide, squared-off, blocky slides.

Thanks for the lesson Duane. You're chalk full of things I wish I knew.

[Duane Thomas]

Yer welcome. My font of otherwise useless knowledge and I both thank you.

[twodownzero]

I do wonder if you're completely right, Duane. Is there any reason to believe that a rounded slide wouldn't work with the latter system you described? I understand what you mean about the locking area on the front of the barrel hood, but do you believe that the squared shape is absolutely necessary? It seems to me that the advantage of making it "blockyier" is to maximize surface area and thus the lockup area, but it doesn't seem to me that such a shape is absolutely demanded by the design.

[Duane Thomas]

Well, if you figure out a way to make a "round external tilt barrel" gun that the gun companies haven't, let me know. The advantages of such a gun are so apparent, and so desirable, I think we can safely assume that if it was possible it would have been done by now.

[Kevin G.]

I guess I took his question wrong. I thought he meant why couldn't they make it look slimmer and sexy or give it some type of shape other than "block". Like Smith did with the M&P and other manufacturers have done with this action type.

Maybe it's like women...some guys like 'em blocky, other guys like em with more shape and some guys just don't like any of them.

[Mifune326]

I guess I took his question wrong. I thought he meant why couldn't they make it look slimmer and sexy or give it some type of shape other than "block". Like Smith did with the M&P and other manufacturers have done with this action type.

Maybe it's like women...some guys like 'em blocky, other guys like em with more shape and some guys just don't like any of them.

I totally understand what Duane is getting at Kev, but you're right, I was wondering why the shape of the Glock's slide was so block-like, and not a little more sexy like the M&P and XDm (while still being able to accomodate the external tilt barrel system as described by Duane).

Edited December 16, 2010 by Mifune326

[Rob D]

When you're the original plastic gun that runs 100% on anything you feed it, you don't have to make you gun look schnazzy to compete. When you're coming into the market 15 years later and trying to compete with the guys who have been selling said pistols to tons of agencies and individuals for over a decade, adding some cosmetic flare to your product couldn't hurt.

[kevin c]

How much started out as a matter of form following function, and has any of it evolved over time into aesthetics and brand recognition?

Starting with a bar of steel and machining off only what is absolutely necessary gets you functionality at less cost, and mebbe that's what mattered to Herr Glock when he bid for the Austrian Army's sidearm contract. Fast forward to today: while that blocky profile may be ugly, it is also highly recognizable. The same way BMW has their characteristic front grill, Glocks have an expected visual component.

Nowadays, I wouldn't be suprised to hear that some visual appeal goes into the design of gun from the outset. It may not change functionality, but it might affect marketability. Might not that be part of the difference? Glock might consider a change for marketing reasons, but might run up against resistance from their customer base, not to mention considerable retooling expense. Perhaps only small cosmetic changes would be possible (fish gill slide serrations, anyone?).

'jes speklatin'

[Kevin G.]

Well put kevin c. Let's not forget one of the earlier concessions to a targeted market. That stylish beveled at the front slide that was introduced with the 34, 35.

[Duane Thomas]

When you're the original plastic gun that runs 100% on anything you feed it, you don't have to make you gun look schnazzy to compete. When you're coming into the market 15 years later and trying to compete with the guys who have been selling said pistols to tons of agencies and individuals for over a decade, adding some cosmetic flare to your product couldn't hurt.

Starting with a bar of steel and machining off only what is absolutely necessary gets you functionality at less cost, and mebbe that's what mattered to Herr Glock when he bid for the Austrian Army's sidearm contract.

I agree with what you guys are saying. (With the minor added clarification that Glock slides aren't machined to shape, they're formed by bending a piece of sheet steel over a mandrel.) But the shape of the Glock slide strikes me as very much "function over form". Everything there you need, nothing you don't - and who care's what it looks like? Also I very much like the fact that Glock slides - the Glock overall, for that matter - are very "soft", i.e. there are no sharp edges anywhere to cut up the lining of a concealing garment, or cut up the shooter's hands during a fast gun manipulation. When the Glock was first introduced there were really no other guns even in its class in this area - and 25 years later still damn few that are.

Actually, I'm in the minority I guess in that I find that sort of stripped-down, spartan, businesslike look very visually appealing. But I know that some people don't.

[kevin c]

...Glock slides aren't machined to shape, they're formed by bending a piece of sheet steel over a mandrel...

Did not know that - very cool. Thank you, Good Sir, for such a juicy tidbit!

Actually, I'm in the minority I guess in that I find that sort of stripped-down, spartan, businesslike look very visually appealing. But I know that some people don't.

Nah. Like you, Duane, I like my Glocks pretty much as they come OOTB ('cept for sights, grip tape, and the occasional concession to my weakness for tinkering inside).

[Jman]

Actually, I'm in the minority I guess in that I find that sort of stripped-down, spartan, businesslike look very visually appealing. But I know that some people don't.

I don't think you're in the minority at all Duane. Comparing these images, I have no idea how anyone could come to a different conclusion.

Which one of these guns looks like a "Transformer"

Edited December 17, 2010 by Jman

[Duane Thomas]

The one, by comparison, does seem a bit overdone, what?

[BlueOvalBruin]

... or cut up the shooter's hands during a fast gun manipulation...

That only happens when you shoot it.

[GForceLizard]

I was not taken with the look of Glock when I bought my first. I've come to appreciate the no nonsense all business look. And if you think it looks like a 2x4, all the better for use as a club.

[Rob D]

I was not taken with the look of Glock when I bought my first. I've come to appreciate the no nonsense all business look. And if you think it looks like a 2x4, all the better for use as a club.

Same here. Every time I see someone clear a jam from a steel framed gun while running a stage, I appreciate the looks of my glock just a little bit more.

[sirveyr]

Actually, I'm in the minority I guess in that I find that sort of stripped-down, spartan, businesslike look very visually appealing. But I know that some people don't.

I don't think you're in the minority at all Duane. Comparing these images, I have no idea how anyone could come to a different conclusion.

Which one of these guns looks like a "Transformer"

Which one of these guns is trying WAY too hard?

I like my Glocks beat to shit and missing all of the finish.

[Duane Thomas]

And if you think it looks like a 2x4, all the better for use as a club.

Now, now, we don't use Glocks as clubs.

Really, that would be like hitting someone with a Nerf bat.

[R-Bros_JLR]

Is it bad if you use one Glock as a hammer to take apart another stubborn Glock? I've become a much bigger fan of the bricks since I started shooting them more that's for sure!

[sirveyr]

Is it bad if you use one Glock as a hammer to take apart another stubborn Glock? I've become a much bigger fan of the bricks since I started shooting them more that's for sure!

No, it is OK to use a Glock as a hammer. My signature line offers more uses for Glocks...