goldilocks Posted November 6, 2010 Share Posted November 6, 2010 I'm hoping someone here can help me to figure out whats going on with my M2. I wanted to cure my "Benelli Thumb" problem. I live in the UK, and instead of ordering a welded up lifter from the USA, I ordered a Super Black Eagle Lifter and have filed it down to fit. The lifter looks the same now, just a bit longer. I fitted it in the gun and the lifter operates freely. Heres the problem; with a shell on the lifter, when i pull the bolt handle back it doesn't travel forwards on its own. I need to push on the bolt handle a bit to help it start moving forwards. Which part of the mechanism forces the lifter up as the bolt goes forwards? I'm stuck, any ideas would be greatly appreciated!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike_pinto Posted November 6, 2010 Share Posted November 6, 2010 (edited) Need more tension on the spring for the carrier dog on the left side of the trigger group. When the lifter is up and dog back, you should not be able the see through any coils. Also, I just had the same symptom, and found my recoil spring was gunked up and sluggish. Cleaned it and it worked. M Edited November 6, 2010 by mike_pinto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldilocks Posted November 7, 2010 Author Share Posted November 7, 2010 Need more tension on the spring for the carrier dog on the left side of the trigger group. When the lifter is up and dog back, you should not be able the see through any coils. Also, I just had the same symptom, and found my recoil spring was gunked up and sluggish. Cleaned it and it worked. M Thanks for the pointers Mike. The carrier dog spring is pretty tight, and the recoil spring clean and free. This only happens with the new lifter installed. I just swapped the old one back in and it works fine. I took a picture to compare the 2 lifters. the SBE lifter is the one at the top. They look the same apart from the SBE one being longer. So I'm thinking there must be something I haven't noticed that makes the difference? M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Sierpina Posted November 7, 2010 Share Posted November 7, 2010 The one on top is slightly different. The contour in front of the pivot hole is cut back on a little bit more of an angle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldilocks Posted November 7, 2010 Author Share Posted November 7, 2010 The one on top is slightly different. The contour in front of the pivot hole is cut back on a little bit more of an angle. Do you think thats why it doesn't work? Whats that cut-out for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boomfab Posted November 7, 2010 Share Posted November 7, 2010 Can you get an M4 lifter? They work in the M2 with just a tad bit of filing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldilocks Posted November 7, 2010 Author Share Posted November 7, 2010 (edited) Can you get an M4 lifter? They work in the M2 with just a tad bit of filing. I think I can get an m4 lifter. Is the m4 lifter longer than the m2 lifter? I'd like to use this one if at all possible because I spent a whole day filing it already! I made a short video of the problem; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eN5RyAV5T8E to help show whats going on. Thanks for helping me out. m Edited November 7, 2010 by goldilocks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steveo Posted November 7, 2010 Share Posted November 7, 2010 What advantage does the M4 lifter have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boomfab Posted November 7, 2010 Share Posted November 7, 2010 (edited) Yes, the M4 lifter is longer than the M2 lifter. In the pic, the M4 lifter is shown in the gun. M2 held to the side, lined up where it would be if installed in the gun. I've been running an M4 lifter for about a year now. Never had Benelli thumb since. You will have to do some filing on the underside of the lifter to make it lay properly against the bolt carrier. Edited November 7, 2010 by boomfab Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike.45 Posted November 7, 2010 Share Posted November 7, 2010 Matt, I was kinda wondering what the outcome of this would be when you and Steve were working it out on Saturday - I have a few questions but can be at the range from 3pm tomorrow to help work this out if it helps - firstly have you acually shot it yet ? If the answer is no then I suspect it will actually shoot just fine if you did. Secondly I dont think it has anything seriously to do with the carrier but the carrier latch and carrier latch spring, which I know you have already worked on. If the carrier latch spring doesnt solve it then I suspect it is slightly dragging on the new carrier and a few polishing enhancements and a lightened spring will resolve the issue. I will see you at 3pm if you can make it !! Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldilocks Posted November 7, 2010 Author Share Posted November 7, 2010 Matt, I was kinda wondering what the outcome of this would be when you and Steve were working it out on Saturday - I have a few questions but can be at the range from 3pm tomorrow to help work this out if it helps - firstly have you acually shot it yet ? If the answer is no then I suspect it will actually shoot just fine if you did. Secondly I dont think it has anything seriously to do with the carrier but the carrier latch and carrier latch spring, which I know you have already worked on. If the carrier latch spring doesnt solve it then I suspect it is slightly dragging on the new carrier and a few polishing enhancements and a lightened spring will resolve the issue. I will see you at 3pm if you can make it !! Mike I shot half a box through it yesterday, about 1 in 3 shells didn't feed, and needed the bolt pushed forwards. This had happened a couple of times with the stock carrier, but only about once a box. See you at 3, I'll bring my pump as well so I have something to shoot! Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldilocks Posted November 7, 2010 Author Share Posted November 7, 2010 Yes, the M4 lifter is longer than the M2 lifter. In the pic, the M4 lifter is shown in the gun. M2 held to the side, lined up where it would be if installed in the gun. I've been running an M4 lifter for about a year now. Never had Benelli thumb since. You will have to do some filing on the underside of the lifter to make it lay properly against the bolt carrier. I seems like I should have started out with the m4 lifter! if I really can't get this SBE one to fit I'll try the M4 one. I'm getting a lot of practice at filing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadeslade Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 No carrier dogs on auto shotguns. The lifter is not balanced correctly. Lots of welded up lifters suck ,too. Whats wrong with the original lifter? If nothing, put it back in and just use it stock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldilocks Posted November 9, 2010 Author Share Posted November 9, 2010 With help from Mike and Steve I have a shotgun that shoots again! Mike crushed the tension out of the spring on the bolt release button, and that sorted the problem. My weaker mag spring wasn't throwing the shell out hard enough to fully trip the bolt release lever. I fired a box through it with only one jam, where the bolt rode over the shell on the lifter, without picking it up. So its still not perfect, but a massive improvement! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steveo Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 So,if you had to do it allover again what would you do?Just buy the welded lifter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldilocks Posted November 9, 2010 Author Share Posted November 9, 2010 So,if you had to do it allover again what would you do?Just buy the welded lifter? Thats a good question! I had quite a short timetable to get this done, I didn't want to wait weeks for a part from America. I saw a post here that mentioned some reliability problems with a welded lifter too, so I'll shoot some rounds through it, and the shotgun runs reliably with my new lifter then I'll be glad I did it this way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steveo Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 I was asking as I'll be in the market for a new M2 from Steve at Sheild in the near future (its a small World!) Let us know how you get on I'm assuming you need it for the match in a couple of weeks time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldilocks Posted November 9, 2010 Author Share Posted November 9, 2010 I was asking as I'll be in the market for a new M2 from Steve at Sheild in the near future (its a small World!) Let us know how you get on I'm assuming you need it for the match in a couple of weeks time? Steve just got some new M2s in, hes been great helping me get my new gun set up for the match. I'm down there quite a bit, so if you want to try my m2 out just pm me and we can meet up. Heres a shot of the gun with the longer lifter fitted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steveo Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 Thanks for the offer I'll bear it in mind I am miles away in West Sussex so it would be a bit of a road trip (although I'm a member) Cheers Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J-Rob Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 I was asking as I'll be in the market for a new M2 from Steve at Sheild in the near future (its a small World!) Let us know how you get on I'm assuming you need it for the match in a couple of weeks time? Steve just got some new M2s in, hes been great helping me get my new gun set up for the match. I'm down there quite a bit, so if you want to try my m2 out just pm me and we can meet up. Heres a shot of the gun with the longer lifter fitted. What shell holder is that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadeslade Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 What was wrong with the M2 lifter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steveo Posted November 9, 2010 Share Posted November 9, 2010 What was wrong with the M2 lifter? It has that cut out at the end (I'm guessing so you can remove a jammed shell?) that everyone seems to damage thier thumb on when loading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldilocks Posted November 9, 2010 Author Share Posted November 9, 2010 (edited) What shell holder is that? I just made it from some of the shell holders that you put on a belt, threaded on some velcro. I need to try it out tomorrow to make sure the shells don't fall out when I shoot it! Edited November 9, 2010 by goldilocks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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