Is This a Limited Pistol

[DyNo!]

If you saw someone shooting this pistol in the limited or tactical optics division in USPSA 3-gun, what would be your reaction? The attachment at the end of the barrel is a barrel bushing.

(Without the light)

Edited October 8, 2010 by DyNo!

[ima45dv8]

A 92 has a barrel bushing? I didn't know that.

Call it what they want, but I'd deem it a weight attached to counteract recoil. Welcome to Open division.

[twodownzero]

Has Beretta made 500 of those? If not, welcome to Open Division.

If so, I'd need to look at it closer.

[DyNo!]

Looks like they use the word "counterweight" in parts of their documentation for nomenclature - question answered.

[staudacher]

Well that is either a Beretta 92(or 96) Target PGC with the adjustable rear sight replaced with a fixed sight or a standard 92 that has had the target conversion kit installed. The kit consists of a 150mm barrel and the aluminum barrel sleeve.

Either way I think it would be covered under the "Any complete handgun or components with a minimum production of 500 units by a factory and available to the general public." Now the question is since this is all factory Beretta components would this still fall under prohibited modifications.

Edited October 8, 2010 by staudacher

[G-ManBart]

Somebody's been reading Tactical Ninja Magazine

[joecichlid]

Somebody's been reading Tactical Ninja Magazine

Can I get some vanilla ice cream with my sliced pie please?

Joe W.

[wide45]

•Replacement barrels – provided they are the same length as original factory standard.

[Flexmoney]

22 Prohibited modifications

External modifications or features such as weights or devices to

control or reduce recoil (such as but not limited to thumb rests or

components which could be used as such).

[Skydiver]

Interesting... Putting my evil hat on (yes, the one with room for the horns): as I recall from my high school physics, anything that adds mass/weight to the gun in operation serves to reduce recoil. Limited and L10 don't have weight limits as I recall so people can add as much mass as they can as long as their primary function is not to reduce recoil.

If I remember correctly tungsten guide rods are specifically suppose to add mass and help reduce recoil. Are these guide rods illegal? As far as I know they are legal.

Weighted magazines are to help the magazines eject faster and cleanly. But putting in a weighted magazine would add mass to the gun and therefore reduce recoil. As far as I know they are legal.

A magwell is suppose to make reloads easier by providing a bigger target and be more forgiving of sloppy reloads. But installing a magwell adds mass to the gun and therefor reduces recoil. As far as I know, most competitive Limited guns have (huge) magwells, and are considered perfectly legal.

(As an aside also consider the sales pitch I read for a magwell: "The outside design improves the grip handling by extending the grip in the front. This allows for support hand leverage to counter recoil and quicker shot-to-shot recovery.")

[beltjones]

If a dude is willing to shoot tan targets with a tan front sight I think he should be able to shoot in any division he wants. :P

[mgood]

If a dude is willing to shoot tan targets with a tan front sight I think he should be able to shoot in any division he wants. :P

I tend to agree but I don't believe it falls within the rules.

[DyNo!]

If a dude is willing to shoot tan targets with a tan front sight I think he should be able to shoot in any division he wants. :P

[AggiePhil]

I'm gonna insert a newbie question here... Would having a basic weaponlight (like a TLR-1) put me in open division? I always carry my GLOCK with the light attached so all my holsters are meant to only hold it with the light attached. Got some nice kydex and that I'd just assume not replace as long as the rules don't require me to do so.

[Flexmoney]

No light, except in Open Division.

(Unless that is a true everyday LEO/MIL duty rig, then it may be allowed by the Range Master at local matches.)

5.2.8 Competitors deemed by the Match Director to be full-time law enforcement

officers with arrest powers or military personnel on current active

duty orders, may be entitled to use their duty holsters or similar holster

and related equipment when such equipment does not strictly satisfy

the equipment or other requirements of the declared Division. The

Range Master will remain the final authority in respect of the safety

and suitability of using such equipment at USPSA matches. The use of

such equipment, except as otherwise permitted in the rules, is restricted

to Level I matches only.

[dnuke146]

Where does the knife come into play? .... does it attach somewhere?

[mgood]

Where does the knife come into play? .... does it attach somewhere?

For those really close targets, and/or when you're low on ammo, there's always the pistol bayonet.

[McAllyn]

I can't imagine the 92 Target Counterweight being attached to a full-time duty rig. As far as I know, the M9A1 railed frame was never offered with a 92 Target Counterweight system either.

That guy needs to grab a welder and make some 170mm mags and enjoy his Open adventures.

Mac