mags in holder...

[jeffsoward]

I have another "newbie" problem/question;

When wearing your mags on your belt, what is the "proper" direction for the mag to face?

meaning; wear them with the front of the mag toward your belly or back of the mag toward your belly?

When I started practicing to get ready to start shooting matches, I practiced reloading with my mags backward (back of the mag toward my belly). I got proficient with reloading this way. But some friends explained that the mags should be turned forward so that my index finger could guide the mag into the magwell. So i switched and now I completely suck at reloads. I've practiced at it for about a half-hour a night for the past week and can't seem to get it.

Today at a match I almost dropped three mags on three different reloads. I think out of the 6 stages and two to four reloads per stage (single stack), I had one smooth reload.

Does it matter? Should I go back to what I'm comfortable with or should I learn the "proper" technique?

Please, I need advice and opinions because today was such a huge cluster for me.

[spanky]

forward, always forward

put your hand on top of the mag, your index finger in front (by the bullet end) and pull out and rotate and point the mag into the magwell.

not so easy to explain but the concept is solid.

[spanky]

This video might help.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StXMHw32kjA

[jeffsoward]

forward, always forward

put your hand on top of the mag, your index finger in front (by the bullet end) and pull out and rotate and point the mag into the magwell.

not so easy to explain but the concept is solid.

That was the way my buddies showed me and have been working on, but I can't seem to get it. that's my problem. I know it's only been a week, but today was frustrating. I fumbled like I had never even reloaded a pistol before.

This video might help.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StXMHw32kjA

Man, he makes it look easy. One thing I noticed that he mentioned is watching the magwell. I have been holding the pistol about chest-high, watching the top/side of the frame while trying to reload. I clip the side of the magwell every time.

[spanky]

Definitely look into the magwell. You only need it for a split second. I have the inside of my magwell on my glock painted white on the side that i see it in from (i'm a lefty) and it helps to reassure myself that i'm looking at it.

[jeffsoward]

Here's a couple of perfect examples of what I was talking about; screwed up reloads.

Classifier - El Presidente

http://www.youtube.com/user/rustyzx9#p/u/4/IcJbWtn2iEU

I almost dropped it.

stage 4

http://www.youtube.com/user/rustyzx9#p/u/9/EKDmfG55quM

damned last reload...

I'm gonna have to practice bigtime.

[Bongo Boy]

I watch other shooter's reloads quite a bit. Most all of the folks I watch are fairly new (as am I), and a couple of things seem to happen a lot. The most serious is just a matter of muzzle management. With a lot of things on the mind of the newbie, absolute attention to the muzzle is often not one of them. So, there's rotating the gun around the axis of the barrel enough to just see the magwell open up a bit so you can see the 'far' side of it, then there's rotating the muzzle so the magwell is pointing at your eyeballs...bad juju. I've seen folks on many occassions have to look down at their belt to grab a mag even, meanwhile gun gets all out of whack as far as downrange. This is a great place for off-range practice.

The other thing that seems to happen quite a bit but isn't so serious from a safety perspective is leaving the strong arm fully extended or pulling the gun in too tight. My concern isn't about speed or anything, it's just a matter of how hard it can be to know where you're slamming that mag. My impression is that somewhere in between is the sweet spot for smoothness. Let me emphasize: I'm expressing what I've been coached on, not claiming to have even decent reloading skills developed.

[SA Friday]

I cant get to your vids for some reason. I suspect you might be having problems with how you grab the mag out of its holder too. I've seen this before with those that struggle between mag forward or mag back. Assuming your are right handed, rotate your had clockwise about 90 degrees when grabbing the mag. You rotate your thumb inward and slap your index finger on the front of the mag instead of having your index finger hit the front of the mag and the tip wrapping around the side. It's a little thing, but man does it make a difference.

[bdpaz]

Looks like you just aren't focusing on the reload - in the El Pres you appear to be looking at the targets, waiting impatiently to start shooting again. Shoot when you need to shoot, reload when you need to reload.

[Wik]

All I can add is to practice it, practice it, and just when you think you've got it down, practice it some more. Muscle memory is amazing and when your mind goes blank when that buzzer beeps you want your body to know exactly what to do. Put that magwell right in front of your face, focus on the far inner edge, and swiftly guide it in. As others said they should point toward your groin so you reach down, grab them and when you naturally lift your arm to put it in it will turn and face the correct way. Practice will help decribe and reinforce this much better than I can put it into words. Good luck!

[Resjudicata]

In the videos you are definitely taking your visual attention, and probably your mental attention as well, away from the insertion of the magazine into the gun. As soon as you dump the mag and grab the new one you are looking back up at the targets. This is why you are missing the mag well.

Watch the video of Travis. Practice the movements he is making. And, do it slowly and carefully. Do it slowly and properly about 100 times before you try to speed up. You have to work on getting it done properly before you can try to do it fast.

Chris

[kfd147]

Practice, Practice and then practice some more. With some live fire in there somewhere. I still foul up one every so often.

Jason

[NoSteel]

I've shot a couple of matches with a guy who places the mag in the holder the same way you were. It seems to work for him but definitely is not the norm. If you could watch his motion closely, you can see just how awkward it is. I would suggest you get the routine down with a lot of dry fire reload practice. If you can, add to this a video camera so you can see where you may be going wrong with your grip. If that is not an option have someone watch you closely who can then show you what is and isn't working for you. Like the rest of us you will still flub a reload or 2 but now you'll know why and can work to correct it. Also, if your a reloader, load yourself up some dummy rounds, (no primer or powder) (I color mine Red) so you can practice handling a weighted mag. This makes a big difference!!!!!

[jeffsoward]

I've shot a couple of matches with a guy who places the mag in the holder the same way you were. It seems to work for him but definitely is not the norm. If you could watch his motion closely, you can see just how awkward it is. I would suggest you get the routine down with a lot of dry fire reload practice. If you can, add to this a video camera so you can see where you may be going wrong with your grip. If that is not an option have someone watch you closely who can then show you what is and isn't working for you. Like the rest of us you will still flub a reload or 2 but now you'll know why and can work to correct it. Also, if your a reloader, load yourself up some dummy rounds, (no primer or powder) (I color mine Red) so you can practice handling a weighted mag. This makes a big difference!!!!!

Thanks to everyone for their input. I'm sticking with the proper method and just practicing as much as I can.

Bigpops has been coaching me some (big thanks to him).

I put in some practice time last night and I found that when I watch the magwell like I'm supposed to, the reload went a lot smoother. I just have to keep at it.

I've changed so many things in a short time that it's gotten to me a little. My grip is too weak, my supporting hand doesn't get proper placement all the time, keeping the gun up to watch the reload, changing from my cane to my forearm crutch. I practiced for a couple of hours last night started with drawing and dry-firing, trying to make sure my grip was right, sight-picture was right, etc. then I practiced reloading (using dummy rounds I made up for near proper mag weight). I practiced everything, including transitions, using the crutch and I think it's going to work out.

I'm practicing every night now, so we'll see how it goes and I'll post up video on Friday to see if you guys think i'm doing it right.

thanks all.

[kfd147]

Hang in there!

Jason

[Singlestack]

While you are at the practicing thing... Practice keeping your finger out of the trigger guard while reloading.

(you can see it on the trigger clearly in your El Prez reload)

[bdpaz]

I practiced for a couple of hours last night

Be careful, that is a long time and you need to be sure you are practicing correctly down to the last excruciating detail. Don't get tired and sloppy. Break it up into shorter sessions if necessary.

[jeffsoward]

While you are at the practicing thing... Practice keeping your finger out of the trigger guard while reloading.

(you can see it on the trigger clearly in your El Prez reload)

Actually, you're seeing the side of the trigger, I promise. John Zane was RO'ing me and my buddy Mike was filming. A question about it was asked and my finger was seen "on the button of the mag catch".

side of my trigger is kind of bright;

[bdpaz]

Actually, you're seeing the side of the trigger, I promise. John Zane was RO'ing me and my buddy Mike was filming. A question about it was asked and my finger was seen "on the button of the mag catch".

I watched it in glorious full screen HD and I'll back you up on that for the reload, BUT at the start of unload & show clear your finger is hovering near the trigger as you release the magazine.

[jeffsoward]

Actually, you're seeing the side of the trigger, I promise. John Zane was RO'ing me and my buddy Mike was filming. A question about it was asked and my finger was seen "on the button of the mag catch".

I watched it in glorious full screen HD and I'll back you up on that for the reload, BUT at the start of unload & show clear your finger is hovering near the trigger as you release the magazine.

Ok, sometimes i leaving it waggling about, but I'll work on it.

["JJ"]

That is exactly why I joined this forum!! I was carrying the mags facing backwards also! I tend to over analyze things a bit so bare with me. When I decided which way to carry the mags, I analyzed the movements. It seemed to be the less movement. You just lift the mag & lift it to the magwell. Not twisting. I'll have to try it the other way this evening!

[G-ManBart]

That is exactly why I joined this forum!! I was carrying the mags facing backwards also! I tend to over analyze things a bit so bare with me. When I decided which way to carry the mags, I analyzed the movements. It seemed to be the less movement. You just lift the mag & lift it to the magwell. Not twisting. I'll have to try it the other way this evening!

If the mag is pointing backwards, you have to rotate your wrist...which is akward, slow and doesn't work under pressure. Your palm is facing away from your body and you're lifting the mag with your fingers into the gun.

Bullets facing front, grab the mag with your index finger down the front of the mag pouch, so that when the mag comes out, your finger is down the front of the mag body (like it's pointed at the nose of the visible bullet). Simply point your finger at the empty magwell and use your palm to drive the mag into the gun. It's more of a gross motor movement, which makes it more reliable, especially under pressure. The other thing is that your finger can find your other hand without seeing anything (works in the dark)...handy self-defense application. R,

["JJ"]

Ok, I can see it now! I was running through it in my head & grabbing the mag wrong. You have the footplate in your palm as you draw the mag. I was making a bit more difficult. Ill give it a shot this evening. Thank you sir!

[calishootr]

like what Bart said, copper parts forward in the mag(the bullets) andthe mags are forward intheir holders, for me, the first mag is just drop my hand down to my belt buckle(more or less) for the rest if i have to go that deep, i will run my thumb across my body till my fingers/palm runs into a mag, then like Bart said, pluck it out with it mostly in the palm of the hand and your index finger along the front of it, this is your guide, then just WATCH the mag into the magwell,as it feeds in, then seat it home with the plam of your hand,do not shift your vision back tothe targets till the mag change is completed

[CZinSC]

All I can add is to practice it, practice it, and just when you think you've got it down, practice it some more. Muscle memory is amazing and when your mind goes blank when that buzzer beeps you want your body to know exactly what to do.

I couldn't agree more with this comment. I've been having issues with my reloads lately as well. Just weren't clean. So I dry fire practiced, with dummy rounds I reloaded myself ( made them red like another person said ), and I practiced. I got pretty confident, very clean reloads.....in my garage. Went out this weekend for the match and it was all different. I didn't fumble any reloads, but they just weren't clean, so I know I still need more practice.

So to the OP, I definitely know what you mean. And if you practice a lot, get confident, then go out and blow it....don't get discouraged! Go back and practice some more...that's whay I'm planning on doing. I've got two weeks before the GA State match, and that is one of things I know I'm working on.

Good luck and keep at it!