DKorn

I could absolutely see scenarios if the targets are very close together (like stacked targets overlapping with a no shoot between them, or targets shoulder to shoulder) where a hit on one target could very easily have been aimed at another target. I’ve done it, sometimes due to a really bad trigger pull yanking the shot low or left, sometimes due to transitioning between targets and firing early or late (which would normally be a mike, but if the targets were close together I could see clipping another target), and once because my optic lost zero midway through a stage and started shooting way to the right.

This is a great way to put it, even more so if you change “see” to “observe” since sometimes you can know without seeing which shots go towards which targets - for example, if there’s an array of 3 steel and the shooter only fires twice. Here’s one to ponder - what call would you make if a shooter moves to a position with 4 closely spaced paper targets and fires 6 shots? Let’s say that due to the close spacing, you are unable to tell from the angle of the shooter’s body or gun which target is being engaged on any given shot. I know what I would say but I’d like to hear what others would do.

If the ROs knows that the shooter didn’t fire at least one round at a target, then they can call it a Failure to Shoot At (FTSA) and impose a procedural penalty under 10.2.7, assuming that none of the exceptions apply. If the ROs aren’t sure, they shouldn’t apply the penalty. Personally, I’ve never seen it called until scoring of the targets happens - so as they’re scoring, the RO will call “2 mikes, 1 FTSA”. Thats it. If the shooter disagrees, they can appeal to the CRO, then the RM as needed. Usually if the primary RO scoring targets isn’t sure if a target was shot at or not, and if the shooter in fact didn’t shoot at it, it goes one of three ways: 1 - The RO calls “2 mikes” and the shooter goes “Darn, I forgot that one!”, and the ROs apply an FTSA penalty. 2 - The RO asks the other RO if he saw the shooter engage the target. If the other RO is sure that the target was not engaged, then an FTSA penalty is applied. 3 - The RO asks the other RO if he saw the shooter engage the target. If the other RO is sure that the target was engaged or is not sure, then an FTSA penalty is not applied.

A lot of this has already been said, but: - Collect chrono ammo as early as possible and get it to chrono to give the chrono team time to pull bullets without making people wait. How you collect the ammo is up to you. -Have a WSB for chrono and use the range commands. -Pairing chrono with another stage can help with match flow. -Chrono team should have the shooter place the gun and an unloaded mag on the table when given the make ready command. Chrono official should inspect the gun, weigh it if necessary, put it in the box if necessary, and gage mags if necessary. Then the chrono official should load 3 rounds into the mag, load the gun, and fire them. The bullet should already have been pulled, weighed, and the weight recorded so power factor can be calculated right away. If the shooter makes their declared power factor, they unload and show clear and holster as you would on a regular stage. Also, separately from this, ROs should be checking shooter’s’ equipment for legality before their first stage. It’s not a lengthy process - a quick question to each shooter about what division they’re shooting, then a quick glance over their gear to make sure it’s legal. Don’t bother measuring anything unless you think it might not be legal.

Think about it this way when comparing major and minor - 90% of points in minor is 2 Alpha, Alpha Charlie on every other target. Basically, you can only drop 1 Charlie every other target assuming no mikes or deltas, etc. In major, 90% of points is alpha Charlie in every target. You can shoot 50% charlies and still get 90% of points. Fast alpha/charlie wins all day every day in every division with major, except maybe single stack depending on the stages and how many times you’ll have to shoot 8 round arrays with multiple pieces of steel, or how often you can skip a position by shooting to 10 rounds. Even then, major typically has the advantage.

Sounds like you made the right call.

Based on the clarification that the shooter started holding the gun and was engaging targets, no. 10.4.7 requires that they are retrieving a staged gun and not engaging targets. If you’re already holding the gun in the PCC start position, then it can’t apply. Likewise it can’t apply if you’re picking the gun up and engaging targets when you shoot the prop.

Not bad for your first match! Biggest thing I see as low hanging fruit is movement. Explode out of position, move hard to the next position, and get the gun up early as you get into position so that you’re ready to shoot as soon as you get there.

Yeah, don’t ask to see every target every time, but if there’s something specific you’ve been working on and want to see an occasional request to not pre paste is reasonable. Another good option is to ask someone else to look at the targets for you and get whatever information you need. This is actually covered under 9.6.2 - If the ROs decide that scoring will start before you finish the stage, you are allowed to designate someone to act as your delegate to verify scoring for you.

10.4.2.2 would only apply if the round would have hit the ground within 10 feet of the shooter if it hadn’t hit the barrel. Since it hit the back berm, it sounds to me like it’s just a miss - no different than if you’re leaning around a wall and forget about height over bore and put a round into the edge of the wall.

Agreed. The 2 possibly applicable rules that immediately come to mind are 10.4.2.2 and 10.4.7. 10.4.7 would apply if the firearm was staged and the competitor was clearly not yet engaging targets when the round fired. 10.4.2.2 would apply if the round would have hit within 10 feet had it not struck the barrel as long as the target was farther than 10 feet.

Can you clarify for me a bit - was this a PCC or handgun? Was the start position “muzzle touching barrel” or “gun sitting on barrel”? Would the round have hit the ground if the barrel wasn’t there, and if so, how far from the shooter? How far away was the target? I have a few answers depending on the answers to those questions.

If you’re the shooter, before you make ready, you say to the squad “Hey, I’d like to see (whichever targets you want to) before you paste them unless (if there’s something you’re okay not seeing). Do you guys mind waiting? Thanks.” For example, “I’d like to see these first 3 targets and that one over there before you paste them, unless they’re all alphas.”

I’m using LOK Grips “LOK Ops” texture. It’s essentially the same as the LOK Grips “Spec Ops” or VZ Grips “Operator 2” textures, but with the ridge portion running 90 degrees to the way it does on those textures. This makes the ridges oppose the gun’s motion in recoil, essentially causing it to dig in more as the gun pushes back into your hands.

I think the way they should go is essentially open minor except no comp, optic must be slide mounted, and 140 mm mags. I could also see an argument for keeping it DA/SA and striker only, but that’s the most restrictions I would bother with.

Ghost pouches are affordable and work okay. That’s what I’m using now and I’m considering upgrading. Double Alpha Racers and CR Speed Versa pouches are both very popular and get good reviews. They’re similarly priced. There are some other options that are pricier or offer different features but those are probably the most popular.

For my Production setup, I have 6 magazines (and 5 mag pouches on my belt). I add the Barney round to the mag in my pocket right before I walk to the line in order to avoid any mixups. For single stack, I have 7 magazines since my mags can’t fit the extra round, so I use an extra magazine for the chambered round. I also run 5 mag pouches. For Carry Optics, I use the same gun as I do for Production so I have 6 mags. I only run my front 3 pouches for CO. I only have 5 basepads so one mag is unused for CO, but usually ends up being brought along just because. For PCC I run a Scorpion and have a mix of mags. I think right now I have two 30 round mags, one 20 round mag, one spliced 20+30 that’s unreliable so I don’t use it, one 35 round mag, and one 35+15 round mag. Typically I run the 35+15 for everything, although I’ll start with the 20 round mag for stages with a mandatory reload because it drops free most reliably.

Steve Anderson likes to say on his podcast that the dot is usually “a paintbrush and not a scalpel”. As long as all the movement is inside where you’re trying to hit, send it!

What if you’re shooting a round where factory ammunition doesn’t make the appropriate power factor, is loaded excessively hot, or is unavailable?

Reread the OP. The chamber checking was being done outside of the safe area using a barrel from a gun that had been disassembled in the safe area.

I was told by the guy who taught my RO and CRO class when I asked him what counts as a gun replica that if it looks like a gun or has sights, it’s not allowed under 8.7.2, otherwise it’s ok (for USPSA) So using an umbrella in your hands to mimic a PCC is pushing it, and a broom that’s shouldered is too far. And if you mount a red dot on a stick, that’s also not allowed.

For your first one, that’s a DQ under 10.5.1. Just because the firing pin is removed, it’s still a firearm that you are handling outside of the safe area and not under RO supervision and in response to a range command. Still true if you take the slide off of a handgun, since the frame is the actual firearm in most cases. Something that’s not a firearm, like a blue gun, would probably be technically not in violation of 10.5.1, although you would be violating 8.7.2 if you’re on an actual stage. Assuming USPSA rules, your second one falls under one of the very limited exceptions in 3.3 that allows a local rule to be enforced (required to comply with legislation) so I would say a violation falls under 10.6.2 as failure to comply with the reasonable direction of a match official. This also assumes that the MD/RM make the rule and penalty for violating it very clear during the shooter’s meeting and in pre-match communication.

The other thing that comes to mind is that lots of people use dummy rounds for weighting mags in dry fire practice that are virtually indistinguishable from live rounds at a quick glance. From a rules perspective it’s probably easier to just count all dummy rounds as the same as live ammunition than to try to decide which ones look enough different to not count.

It’s also a DQ to handle those in the safe area, by the way. There are definitely a few weird discrepancies in the rules, but I don’t think this is one of them. If it looks like ammunition and feeds and chambers in a gun and magazine like ammunition, then for all intents and purposes it is considered ammunition. Having ammunition in your gun when you aren’t supposed to or handling it in the safe area is a DQable offense.

A snap cap, dummy round, or even empty casing in the chamber, cylinder, or inserted magazine is considered loaded because the rules explicitly state that it is considered loaded. Check the glossary definition of “loaded firearm” in the current USPSA rulebook. A chamber flag is acceptable in PCC because it isn’t a dummy round, and is required by the rules. What other disciplines do in their rule sets has no bearing on what the USPSA rules say.