B585

Ben Steve Firearm's Nation Shannon

OP, Why is it slow? Is it an inability to manipulate the trigger, the gun is not on the target soon enough, or do you seem to have a set cadence when shooting in live fire/matches?

I definitely can’t shoot a 1” group at 25 yards consistently unless you are talking about a group of 1 bullet. I am not sure what thread people were making that claim, but highly doubt there are many USPSA shooters who can. Even if the shooter was capable of it, it would take a very good semiautomatic pistol and ammo to pull that off. I have shot with many highly skilled shooters and I have never seen one I think could do that with any degree of consistency. Most of what I have read say you need to be able to do 1” at 10 yards or 4” at 25 yards for USPSA.

Thanks for the tip.

Thanks for the feedback. The weight is less of a concern for me, but the size is very important. With the standard X 5 grip, I can’t fit my support hand on the grip very well. With those dimensions, I think I would be good to go. Thanks again for taking those.

If you are familiar with Steve Anderson, try to get into Match Mode (not Speed Mode) at least 4 days prior to the match. As Ben (and many others) elude to, make sure you aren’t cheating during dry fire....correct grip, correct pressure, adequate sight picture, correct size of targets, minimal to no movement of sights during the trigger press. Everything I have said in both posts are coming from my own mistakes and experiences.

The white wall drill like Ben (and others) discuss can be helpful for the basics. My problem was I had a pretty good trigger press as long as I wasn’t on the clock....then it went to h#ll....so I did the same thing you are doing. I found that during dry fire making sure pretty much 100% of your concentration goes on into watching your sights/calling your shots helps a lot.

Any chance you could post a pic of the grip with a mic on it or just measure the length and width with a mic?

Awesome job!!

http://www.shootingsportsinnovations.com/X5-Tungsten-Grip-Module-X5-Grip.htm

I know there is no simple way to quantify grip size, how much bigger is it? The reason I have not purchased an X5 is because the grip is too damn small. I can make XR grip work, but hated to lose the undercut.

Since I seem to be an outlier in terms of only using 4.7 at 1.182 to make Major PF, I will note the following: The PF was determined at a Sectional match. A couple guys in my squad thought the Chrono was reading slow while others said they thought it was dead on. It was almost 90 degrees when I chronoed. I am using Winchester primers. Those numbers were obtained through a STI barrel. My personal chrono tends to read very close between both my 2011s and the other has a SV Ultramatch barrel. For Majors, I determine the charge by averaging the weight of 5 charges. The initial weight is measured on a manual scale and then every 100th bullet is checked with a digital scale. If I need to make a change, I make it averaging 5 charges on the manual scale. I check the length with a mic on every single bullet and only accept 1.179 to 1.186. Again, I was shooting 180 GN Blue Bullets. Yes, my process is surely overkill but since this was my first Major, I wanted to make sure that any mistakes I made during the match were my fault and not my equipment or ammo. I am not sure why I am getting away with less powder.

Thank you for an excellent explanation of my thoughts.

I use 4.7 of N320, 180 Blur Bullets, 1.182 OAL, out of my 5'' 2011. It made 170.5 PF. This was with different headstamped brass.

As already mentioned, visualization. I wish I understood that better when I first started.

Very cool of you. Thanks

If you are worried about MATCH performance, you won’t hero or zero the classifier. You will shoot them at the fastest pace you think you can hit. This ultimately affects the HHF. If the newest “fix” truly fixed the problems with classication, then making the changes so drastic all at once would have made a little better sense but it would still result in 2 different outcomes. The post 6-28-18 classification in Production, Limited, and Open would be better than the pre 6-28-18. If you didn’t like the PGA example then look at baseball. Years ago there were more HRs, but baseball didn’t change how tight the balls could be wound mid-season. Point is no major sport makes changes to the rules mid-season unless there is a safety concern. We all know there are more than double the matches going on right now compared to the winter months.

Maybe some of the more experienced guys know of something but I don’t know. By now, I have learned what gives me troubles I have with various guns so when I’m at a match and there is a guy with a gun I am interested in, I would ask the person if I could try it out. I mainly look at establishing a proper grip and seeing if the grip is conducive… Do the curves in the front of the grip fall at a point where my joints are and whether there is enough room for my support hand palm to sit against the gun instead of on top my fingers of my support hand.

Excellent post. I couldn’t agree more. As I said before, I have had everyone from Cs to GMs tell me to hero or zero. I see it happen at every match I go to. Quit throwing out the bad ones and you will get best perspective on what a person can do under match conditions and then grade accordingly including HHF. If a very good shooter or pro decides they want to have the HHF, they can go to a match where the COF is posted before the match and practice it all week and then hero or zero. If they manage to hook up, they just made the HHF above what someone could do under match conditions when you are trying to have the best MATCH possible. I never thought about retiring the classifiers after three or five years, but that is a good idea IMO. I would like to see the changes you proposed occur during the Winter (by calendar year). If the PGA decided that players were getting too many birdies, they wouldn’t change the rules about golf balls right in the middle of summer

When you are making drastic changes, it would make the most sense to not do it during peak season (when you are going affect most people in one week)...i.e. one week the rules are this and next week they have changed. That is not rocket science nor should it require any further explanation. Yes, for the shooters in an area where it is feasible to shoot year round, you can't avoid that, but for probably half of USPSA membership, they are lucky to shoot one match from Dec. to March (Winter by calendar year). Since the HHFs have been the same for years, this is was not something that had to be done STAT. They easily could posted the changes months before they went into effect so members knew exactly what was coming. Safety concerns would obviously be a different issue. Those types of problems would need to be addressed STAT. You are obviously you are going to defend whatever decision comes out of USPSA headquarters no matter what. I want to give you one last thing to think about. The "normal" members (Ds, Cs, and Bs) are the majority of the membership and whether you want to admit it or not, this decision and MORE IMPORTANTLY, how it was enacted, angered many of them. This organization should think long and hard before it makes a decision which angers the majority of their membership and they do decide it will be best for the organization, they should think long and hard about how to best enact it. Again, I think that is common sense. I am sure you will disagree. At least IMO, USPSA is the greatest sport in this country and out of the roughly 350 million people in the USA, the USPSA membership is ~ 27,000 active members (less than 1 in 10,000 people). I am done responding so you can have it.

Just weak hand only shooting.

I like to use the 1/2 cocked position. My 2011 has a different trigger pull uncocked compared to cocked and the 1/2 cocked seems about the same as cocked. 1/2 cocked also allows the safety to function.

Ok, during peak season. I guarantee there are more USPSA matches now than in Winter.

Ok, down season...winter

I am sure 300ex will have an answer for this question which will be my last one....why implement this right in the middle of the season? When you are making drastic changes, the off-season (winter) would have made more sense. Same thing would go for rule changes in a division (with respect to gear).