jeffroberdo
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Posts posted by jeffroberdo
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3 hours ago, nso123 said:
Do you need to make power factor, or are you looking for a steel load?
Need to make Power for sure and wouldn't mind having something to reach out and bring somewhat of an okay group at 100yrds or so.
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Good Afternoon Folks,
I am not new to reloading for Pistols for competitions but an now getting into PCC. I am looking for some good reloading concencus specific to PCC. I am wondering what you competition shooters are running in your rigs.
For my pistols am running 3.8gr of Aliant Sport Pistol under a 124/5gr Blue Bullet. Works great out of my CO and Production Guns. I have shot quite a few out of my Ruger and PSA PCC guns and it "OK" but maybe i can do keeping my Dot Still. I have read through most of the posts on here already and did get a little information.
I am just looking for a happy medium between Accuracy, Speed and Flat Shooting.
Hit me with what ya got and i will check ya later.
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Anyone have any real world experience with the new Alliant Sport Pistol Powder yet? Burn rate?
9mm and .40 for USPSA and Steel Challenge.
I am always willing to tinker and experiment but would like a good starting point for reference
http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/06/07/new-alliant-sport-pistol-powder/
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Awesome reading on this thread. I have shot almost exclusively coated (BBI, Blue, Bayou and SNS). None have given me true acceptable accuracy. I have tried a few Plated from RMR and XTreme.
The Plated have never given me an appreciable benefit over Coated to justify the extra cost.
Now, To My question/comment. Even though everyone is saying "Acceptable For Our Game" accuracy is good enough and i am okay with that but.
I want my gun to shot as accurate as it can. (Glock34, Wilson Barrel).
I want to try some FMJ bullets now after reading all this.
What brand does everyone recommend within a reasonable cost? Sounds like MG's are a bit pricey.
Right now my "Go To" Load is 4.1gr of HP-38 under a 125gr Blue Bullet RN.
I do not have a crono but these should be right around 1050fps for about 130pf.
P.S. For some of the posters that will probably be reading this. I stopped using TightGroup because of smoke and leading issues. W231/HP-38 is great.
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10 hours ago, Bamboo said:
When the Nobel-Vectan powders started to become available the powder drought was still going, and lots of folks were looking for other powders to fill the gaps. Several in my area started using GM3 so I got some and tried it. There is no published data in English that I found, but did find some in Italian as it is a European powder and was made by SNIA.
Prima SV, Prima V, and GM3 are all in the same powder family but have different burn rates. Grafs gives a reference for the burn rates, but there is no other info from another source I have found that collaborates their burn rate info.
I worked up loads starting low and working up with a chrono. After going through this process I have some nice minor load recipes for 9mm with bullets ranging from 115gr through 160 grain. So, using powers like these requires some homework and willingness to be on the fringe of reloading as there is no published data for pistol from the mfg or in our standard reloading books that I know of. One thing I have noticed is that the load data I've seen for GM3 vs Prima V are not far off....I'm getting 128 pf with 147gr bullets over 3.0gr of GM3 and people using Prima V are using about the same...and this is from several of my 9mm pistols so it just isn't a fast barrel. So, don't take burn rates or "similar to" powders that Grafs provides as gospel. They say GM3 is like AA#5 or Auto-Comp. In my experience it is waaaaay faster. In fact, I am using charge weights and getting similar velocities in the American Select or Solo1000 range. Also, a buddy got some to try to make major in 9mm, and couldn't do it.
Lastly, there seems to be anecdotal info that there is substantial lot to lot variation with these powders. All of my GM3 is the same lot number, but have been reading about folks using old vs new lots of Prima V and having substantially different charge weight vs velocity differences.
So, if you decide you like it I'd say get a bunch of the same lot number. I like the power a lot. It is very clean, I get low SDs, very good accuracy, it is cool burning, is easy to load as it meters well once settled, not pressure spiky, and is cheap....so IMO the juice is worth the squeeze to work with this powder.
But, now that the powder drought is pretty much history there are lots of other powders available that have well established load data. Hopefully, Lyman will pick up the ball and publish some pistol loads with the Vectan powders.
@Bamboo. Thank you for that very well composed and very informative reply. I love tinkering and don't mind at all being on the "Fringe" of reloading for my pistols. V sounds like a good powder and i did notice the inconsistencies that everyone is having and i agree that since the powder shortage is now all but over their are lots and lots of other powders out there that have very well established load data available. I indeed may be just chasing a rabbit down a rabbit hole and looking for the Holy Grail of accuracy with my Glock 34 and should just be happy with the accuracy i am getting but i KNOW this gun can do better in the accuracy department.
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On 4/14/2017 at 5:50 PM, motosapiens said:
I find prima v to be really clean in 9mm and 40. I've used about 10 lbs of it in the last year and a half, but maybe I have the 'old batch'.
Not sure what the op means by 'reliable load data'. If you need lawyers to tell you what to do, you will probably be better served with a different brand of powder, but if you aren't scared of experimenting with reasonable caution and thought, you will find prima v to be very comparable to n320 or even more so red dot in terms of load data. I get just about identical velocity from the same weight of prima v as from red dot, so if I need to guesstimate at a new load, I just look up the specs for red dot and start there.
Using coated bullets i make low-mid 130 pf with 3.1 grains under a 147, or 3.8 gr under a 125 gr boolit at fairly standard-ish oals like 1.15
fwiw, i see absolutely no signs of any pressure issues, so if you like the feel of faster powders, it may be worth trying some of the faster vectan powders like AS or prima sv as well.
By "Reliable Data" I mean something i can read and use from say "The Manufacturer" not something i have read on a forum or on the internet somewhere. I don't need a "Lawer" i just want good well tested data, not B.S.
Now after saying that, I indeed have found lots and lots of good load data starting points from folks in this forum and yes, i love to experiment when i can afford the time and ammo to test.
That is one of the reason i asked if anyone would know where Prima V falls in the burn rate chart.
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On 4/14/2017 at 5:14 PM, MemphisMechanic said:
It's dirty like titegroup, but very very to clean unlike the baked on carbon titegroup leaves.
Burns cool, meters well through Dillons, and feeling/non-smoky like N320.
What projectile type/weight and gun(s) are you shooting it through?
Sorry for not getting back you guys till now.
My Main Shooter right now is my Glock 34 9mm with a Wilson Combat Match Barrel.
My Favorite Projectile right now is Blue Bullet 125gr RN.
My current go to load right now is 125gr BB RN over 4.1g of Win231 should crono around 1050ish. Shoots pretty soft and not bad accuracy but i know the accuracy can be better.
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I am hearing a lot about Prima V Pistol Powder.
Where can i find reliable 9mm Load Data and,
Does anyone know where it falls on the Relative Burn Rate Chart?
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13 minutes ago, igolfat8 said:
I just shot a SC match today. 95 grain over 4.6 TG powder @ 1.035". Very accurate, soft recoil.
@igolfat8, What type of gun and What Brand of 95gr Bullet?
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On 3/17/2017 at 4:44 PM, RickT said:
Wife runs 3.7gr N320 behind 115gr Acme in our 9mm 1911s. Recoil is approaching 22lr pistol territory. What are you shooting BTW (always useful information). I'm shooting 3.7gr N340 behind 147gr Bayou only to use up a great deal of N340; this is also soft shooting.
@RickT. Running a Glock 34 9mm with a Wilson Combat Match Barrel. Very tight chamber on the Wilson Barrel. Does Not Like .356 Bullets. Best Bullets for this barrel i have found are "The Blue Bullets" I have always shot 125gr 9mm bullets in USPSA but i am getting my inexperienced brother in law into shooting competitions with me and we are gonna be doing a lot of Steel Fun Matches and i hope some Sanctioned SCSA matches to get him a lot of "Under The Buzzer Match" Trigger Time.
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I have 2 Simple questions for the 9mm shooters.
1. What is the lightest Bullet anyone has used in their 9mm handguns? (Non Compensated)
2. For those that shoot Steel Challenge, What would be your Favorite Loading for SCSA?
This topic may have been covered here before and if so please point me to the thread and i will read on.
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1 minute ago, FortyOverUnder said:
I change nothing but the bullet. I use coated lead for practice and local matches and FMJ for majors.
I would like to use the same for both economically but i want good match ammo.
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I am pondering and wondering what everyone else does?
Does everyone that competes (I am sure most people here do). Does everyone that does Live Fire Practice use the same ammo to compete with that they use to practice with or do some folks have different match ammo then practice ammo.
2 Different loads. Very similar but different.
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2 hours ago, IDescribe said:
Got it! I was thinking of their 125 RN. My mistake.
I've never even noticed this bullet on their page. Definitely a .38/.357 mold.
I chose this bullet because i love the clean holes flat points put in paper and i wanted to try a 125 instead of a 147 Flat Point. Its listed under the 9mm section on SnS Casting site and sized at .356 so i decided to try it out. the 100 rounds of test ammo i shot, shot very well and 1.050 +/- is just my first batch. I have 3000 of these so some experimenting with O.A.L can be done but can only go so long due to the Lube Groove. I wouldn't mind a 1.10 length so this gives me a reason for more bench and range time.
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4 minutes ago, Sandbagger123 said:
you have a lube ring on your 125's? i have shot thousands and mine don't i load it to 1.14 as a standard minor load and it shoots out of everything i have. Gl/MP etc. i use the same bullet in my open gun
The BBI 125gr TC bullets this post is originally about do not have a lube ring. The new SnS Casting 125gr FP bullet i am talking about does have a lube ring and a crimp ring.
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@IDescribe, The reason for the 1.050 Depth is the bullet profile of this particular bullet. They have a Crimp Ring in them and my depth is pretty close to that crimp ring. Trust me, I stopped at that depth. Could have been a few thousandths shorter to seat inside that ring. I certainly would think 1.040 or shorter is way to short. Go to the SnS Casting website and look at this bullets profile and you will see what i am talking about. I was actually pretty happy with the way they performed.
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On 11/21/2016 at 2:22 PM, IDescribe said:
Okay, there's something wrong. That SNS 125gr bullet doesn't contact lands in a CZ until somewhere in the neighborhood of 1.08-1.10, depending on pistol sample. Your Glock should be .03-.04 LONGER than that. Would you run us through your plunk and spin test procedure so we can see if there's something not quite right that you're doing?
Or better yet, could you simply make a dummy round @ OAL 1.10. No primer. No powder. But ...- RESIZE a case
- EXPAND/FLARE the case mouth
- SEAT the bullet to 1.10
- CRIMP to .378
Make sure you crimp to .377/.378. Measure it. It's important to make sure this is getting assessed solely by bullet/rifling engagement.
Now plunk and spin. Does it still not spin freely?Testing Completed using the SnS 125gr FP's. Very Pleased with Results.
Specs: Glock 34 Factory Barrel
125gr SnS Coated Flat Point
C.O.L.: 1.050 +/- .001
Crimp: .377
Powder: 3.7gr Tightgroup
100rnds tested: Flawless Plunk, Spin and Drop Free of Chamber.
10yard off hand group of 50rnds netted around 3in grouping (Not Exact) Slightly to the left of center and slightly high about 1.5in.
15yard Pistol Rest Group of 50rnds netted almost the same probably 4in grouping (not exact).
As for the BBI 125cn, I will since i have about 1800 of those left to try i will certainly give them a second chance once these SnS 125's are shot up.
I just think they were loaded to long and not the best quality control on the coating.
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On 11/19/2016 at 3:14 PM, Sac Law Man said:
What kind of gun are you shooting? The ability of the bullet to plunk and spin has a lot to do with the barrel and the bullet. If your shooting a CZ and the barrel has not been reamed, you will have to load shorter. You also have to take into account the ogive of each bullet. Comparing a factory round that has a completely different bullet profile is useless. My duty round, WIn Ranger 127 +P+ measure 1.11 COL. Anyway, I load the BBI 125 at 1.10 and they feed and cycle fine.
Says in my Original Post, I am shooting a Glock 34 Factory Barrel. I am switching over to the Glock 34 from an M&P Pro for the upcoming USPSA Shooting season and am doing my load development work for this gun.
I just received my shipment of SnS Casting 125gr Flat Point bullets and so far i am impressed with the coating. Very clean and smooth compared to the BBI.
I did my bullet seating and dummy round development last night and the way this bullet style is shaped i will be having a (what i consider) pretty short C..O.L. of about 1.050.
I will tell ya that the testers i have done so far plunk, spin and drop free very very well.
I will be loading up a bunch at different powder weights this week and testing for function and accuracy. We have a match on Sunday afternoon for a Field Test.
My 2017 Season will begin February 27th for 3 matches a month.
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7 minutes ago, Swanny10 said:
I would very much like to be able to spin the round in there but I can't make it happen with coated bullets. In fact it's not uncommon for them to not fall freely from the barrel. I really wish BBI had .355 as an option.
My apologies to the OP. I didn't mean to make this thread about my problems. If anybody has input for me feel free to PM.
I also wish more of the manufacturers offered a coated in .355. I know Blue Bullets does and they may be my next purchase.
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2 minutes ago, MemphisMechanic said:
1. Run an OAL at 1.125" or 1.130" and see what happens. You'll probably like it's ability to
2. It looks like you're using the flat-nose profile seating die. Flip it and use the round-nose profile instead. (Yes yes, even though the bullet has a flat point. Your Dillon die is leaving a round raised spot on the bullet. They're bad about doing that)
@MemphisMechanic. The O.A.L. i am trying to achieve is 1.125 and its binding during Plunk and spin. I am going to try seating some tonight way down in the 1.0xx - 1.10 range and test. Late last night after posting this i removed the Flat Nosed seating die and got out the Round nosed seating die and it looks to me as like the very tip of this Truncated Cone bullet looks like it will sit directly on the flat part of the very top of both. I think the Round Nosed Die would leave the tip deformed also. I am gonna try it tonight and see.
I am also going to switch back to a Flat Point bullet too. SnS casting has a 125gr Coated Flat Point.
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3 minutes ago, njl said:
Different bullet shapes may require different OALs. I wouldn't worry about what OAL factory FMJ ammo is. Just find what works for a given bullet in your guns.
Also, at least with my .45 loads, I've found that coated bullets need to be loaded to minimize the bearing surface exposed outside the brass, or it gets scraped while chambering (or extracting).
Okay, So do an O.A.L. on the shorter side of the measurements say 1.110 and they plunk and spin fine, would these be okay to shoot like that?
I looked at both seating dies and either one i would use will do that to this bullet. I have 2000 of these things to use.
After these i am gonna go back to the Flat Points.
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8 minutes ago, njl said:
Are the bullet noses like that before you load them? Could it be that your seating stem is doing that to them?
Though 1.125" seems kind of on the shorter end already, you seem to have an awful lot of bearing surface forward of the case mouth. What happens with your plunk test if you load them a bit shorter?
As for the surface irregularity, I wonder if that was caused before or after coating by bullets denting each other during manufacturing, or if it's really an issue with inconsistent coating thickness. Those look more like surface irregularities in the lead (dents) to me.
I think you guys might be right. I just inspected the bullets before loading and not much of a nipple at all.
As for my O.A.L. I am going by the hodgdon Web Site load data length for the 125gr LCN Bullet. I wanted to keep a happy medium between 1.110 and 1.150. Winchester Factory 115gr FMJ is 1.150.
I am taking the seating die out of the SDB right now to see.
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I am growing to Dislike BBI Bullets and i am Asking the community if anyone likes or dislikes them and has ever had issues with them. My issue is with the consistency of the coating (I Think).
Pictured below (as well as i could) is a picture of the top of the bullets. If you can, Notice the small nipple on top of the bullet. Its on every one of them.
Its causing me issues with my O.A.L. measurements. NEVER get a consistent measurement. Trying to get 1.125.
Also, Seems to me like the coating is causing bullet diameter issues as well. Not consistent at all.
Glock 34 Factory Barrel Plunk and Spin testing almost every round at this point and rejecting at least half of them.
What is everyone's opinions?
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On 10/30/2016 at 6:50 PM, 1sickPuppy said:
I get those same marks at the bottom of the bullet. I'm wondering if it's something inside the case itself. Maybe the case has a shelf of something that marks up the bottom of the bullet seating it that deep.
The marks like that on the bottom of the bullet are from pulling the bullets with a hammer style bullet puller.
Reloading 9mm for PCC Competitions
in Pistol Caliber Carbine
Posted
Does anyone know exactly where Alliant Sport Pistol Powder is on the Burn Rate Chart? I know its somewhere around Tightgroup, N320 and such but it would be nice to know where about it truly is.