Vlad

I don't know abou USPSA, but under IPSC Rules, "method 3" will result in a procedural penalty when shooting Production. You know, I had to look that up when George posted it. I was thinking it wasn't allowed. But, all I found was it wasn't allowed in IPSC, not USPSA. Anybody else??? For some reason I could have sword the books said "First shot must be double action", but according to US D9.19 the only requierment is that the gun may not be in single action mode at start signal, so I guess you can cock your gun before the first shot. Now I have to worry about some hot shot trying to cock his gun on the draw.

This morning I got up early and went to shoot a local steel match. It was revo's and rimfire day so I dug out my old Ruger MK2 and I hurried out the door completly forgeting my Depends. Not that I usually need them, mind you. Weather is great, sunny but cool, perfect day. The people are friendly, mostly regulars, the usual banter and good natured jokes. My shooting sucked, but who cares, it is a nice day, and I'm playing with guns. Steel is becoming my guilty pleasure, as I really don't care how I place and I just shoot it for fun. The first stage goes by, with no troubles. At the second stage the joking continues, the fun is rolling. I'm RO'ing one of the regulars. He has only been shooting for about a year or two but he is always out and helpful and pleasent. He is shooting a S&W 41 with a 7 inch barrel. Odd lookind and for some reason he is shooting it out of a Limcat. I found it strange that it fit but I figured he must have shot it before and he seemed confident in his gun/holster cambo. Around his third string he reloads and holsters and BOOM! HOLY CRAP!! I look down and perfectly centered between his two fit is a hole in the dirt and everyone on the squad is silent as a tomb. I give a quick look over the shooter and he is not bleeding from anywhere so I have him unload and show clear. When that is done I note that my toes are about 2ft from the whole in the ground too. I quietly count my own toes inside the shoes and confirm they correct number is still present and accounted for. Later I found out that this was the first time he used the gun he borrowed from a squad mate for the match. He just slaped into the Limcat and it seemed to fit so he went with it. I didn't even bother to ask if he used the safety for any of his other strings, I didn't want to know. And then we got to look at his pants: Yup, thats the muzzle burn, and ... damn .. thats the grease mark as the bullet grazed his jeans. I didn't even have to tell him his was DQ'ed. He did the cool thing and hung around for the rest of the match scoring for the rest of the squad. I don't have a real conclusion for this except that maybe we should never assume that ANYONE has a clue of what they are doing, but then you risk offending people. Sigh. This is the SIXTH shooter that DQ'ed while I was running them in less 18 months. I'm starting to think I'm cursed. And I can't even say this one was the worst of the lot. That honor goes to the corrections officer who at our shotgun match last year finished his run and was unloading his pump gun buy pumping the rounds out one at a time .... but he forgat his finger on the trigger and a load of no. 6 shot impacted the ground between us less then a 12 inches from my foot. Any of the older guys want to tell me how well Depends work? I'm tiered of having to bring spare boxers and pants to every match.

But ... what does IPSC need to approve? They now need to approve of USPSA running IPSC matches? I also don't see how they can say USPSA can't run other types of competitions.

Eric, you just voiced the anguish of an entire generation. I managed to avoid real injury for a long time despite some really close calls, until last year when I took a flight from about 4 steps up my stairs and landed on my left knee. Stupid accident which will most likely be with me for life. I was lucky enough that during my stupid years I managed to stay alive. Free solo rock climbing is fun but dumb, which luckily I realized early on.

Also, as comfortable as the CZ is, if small hands are the issue, then the Baby Eagle wins. Its a CZ derived design but the grip is cut deeper shortening the LOP. Also, depending on what division she wants to shoot, some of the single stack 9mm guns may work too, like the SIG 239, which doesn't have enough rounds for production. You can get 10 round mags, but then you are shooting L10 minor.

I think you need to check out someones expensive set and decide if they are worth the money to you. If not, then buy the cheap ones at your local sporting goods store, they'll save your eyes just fine and they won't hold you back. Personally, the expensive ones are worth it, specially when you need RX.

Hmm .. Three matches a year? .. Lets say that Florida Open goes IPSC. They could have a Open match, a Standard Match, and a Production match. There .. I found three matches. They just happen to run concurent. Failing that bit of rule gaming, you could have Florida Open, IPSC Nationals, and one other just for fun, lets call it the North American Invitational or something. That way you end up with two Nationals you can shoot every year (IPSC and USPSA) plus a third national level match, and that doesn't even count the Florida Open.

Well .. and not L10, and not SS, and lots of us like the 10rd limit for production as it lets the field be more open. But, we will have to wait and see. I think this could work out, but it also has some dangers associated with it.

I don't think that 4.9.1 was ever the answer, with the possible exception of production and L10 capacity regs. What could it possibly have to to with the removal of the traveling warnings?

Congratz, I know exactly how you feel.

It hasn't. The thread has wondered off the beaten path, never to be seen again.

Hmm .. I somewhat disagree. If the sport becomes unrecognizable is it still the same sport? I like shooting USPSA. I like that we at least try to have some practical applications. Maybe we can become a wild success by changing some aspects of the game, but then it wouldn't be the same game anymore. It would a different type of downfall. The resulting game may be enjoyable, but it won't be the same game. I don't think we should sacrifice the practical/tactical/self-defance roots of the game just so we can get more shooters or fame. Nascar may be more popular then Rally driving, but one is going fast in a circle with a car not drivable on any street, and the other one is driving really fast on back roads with a car that has a license plate. USPSA is Rally driving. Personally, I hope it doesn't become NASCAR.

For my part, I take issue with some of the changes which are in the USPSA book and came from the IPSC one. But those aside, in my opinion, the current BIG differences are the divisions differences and the warning system. There a bunch more small ones, some more important then others.

You find that out, you win a cookie. IPSC keeps on refusing to answer that question.

DUDE!! 33%. I feel dirty. It might have been the fact that my guns cost more then my car.

And amuzingly in NJ, of all places, a police officer is not allowed to even ask for your consent to search you vehicles. He needs a warrant and nothing else will do.

So he had to much powder .. all he has to do is load a lot of ammo fast. My personal policy is that unless I called you, you need warrant to come into my house. The more important question is WHY did the fire marshall come to his house? Does he have neighbors who dont like him?

I've fixed the spelling and formating of my post above. Sorry if I confused anyone with the intermediate forms.

Hmm I'll try. Basically the proposed position of USPSA is that it will be running BOTH IPSC and USPSA matches within the US. The IPSC matches will be run under IPSC rules, the USPSA matches under USPSA rules. USPSA will run a number of qualification matches which will be used for World Shoot slots. Those matches will be level III and ran under IPSC rules. Local clubs will have an option as running under either of the rule sets. Bruce Gary hints that separate regional, sectional, area, and national matches will "logically" evolve over time. This is my read of the article and I'm sure I missed some nuances at my first read. My basic understanding is the USPSA will now be an umbrela organization running both IPSC and USPSA matches. As far as I can tell this position would still have to be approved/adopted by IPSC. Also check the at the bottom of http://www.uspsa.org/bodminutes/20060304.pdf for the official wording. Here is the text:

I just got my new Front Sight and read the new USPSA position on the IPSC/USPSA rulebook issues. I don't really have a preformed opinion on the subject and I am curious to know if anyone thinks this will work. I guess it is a two part question 1) Will this change help solve our rules issues or make it worse? 2) Does anyone think there will be any "IPSC" matches besides the 3 designated matches?

I think I know why that land was purchased now .... training ground for the USPSA black helicopters.

Troy, thank your for clearing some of this up. However, if the RO can not go through somones range bag, what is the point of asking for ammo from that bag? Someone wishing to cheat could hand out ammo from the right box, or hide the box of cheater ammo under a gun rag or in a side pocket. If the RO can not look for it, then it seems even less useful to request ammo from the shooters bag. If I read it correctly the shooter is the one handing over the ammo, and as long as the shooter hands over ammo that makes the power factor, he or she may carry whatever ammo they wish in their bag, even though they proabably shouldn't. How about shooters (friends or family) with more then one loading in their bag for two different shooters? I'm really confused as how this is supposed to deter cheating.

The shooters bag is not listed as competitor equipment as far as I can tell (someone correct me if I'm wrong). As such I do see how it can be subject to the rules. Ammo should be drawn from the competitors equipment, ie. his firearm, magazine, etc. I will gladly provide sample rounds until I run out of ammo. They key word is "provide" as opposed to hand over my range bag. However I think that if I ran into this kind of policy a lot I wouldn't stop going to matches. I would just start adding certain items to my range bag and make sure they would have to be removed to get to the ammo boxes. Nothing dangerous mind you, just things that I would have to mail order and most likely would come to my house in a plain brown wrapper. It is amazing the things and shapes they can make out of jelly plastics now days and I think I would want to spread that knowledge and surprise with whoever wants to go through my bag.

Hmm so how does this silly policy (not based on any actual rules in the book) prevent cheating exactly? Is the chrono RO going to check every pocket of the bag? The shooters pockets? His car? No? Then what the hell is the purpose of having this policy besides just insulting shooters by stating that we don't trust them to play fair? The guy that wants to cheat will always be able to do so. I'm with Eric on this one, if a match decides to use this "rule" I wish they would put it on the application OR change the damn rule book. I'm generally not worried about the ammo in my bag (loose rounds aside) as I don't bring ammo I know to be bad to a match, I just have a serious issue with a policy which I think is insulting and also not based on the rule book.

The best plate I've ever seen was owned by a co-worker about 10 years ago. Unfortunatly the joke is kinda techie so only a handful of people on the road ever got it, mostly Unix geeks. His Honda plate read "DEV CAR".