gerritm

Update on my journey to VR80 reliability. Have not drilled out the gas ports. Shot a small 3run match Saturday with low round count BS. Ran perfect with 1145 11/8oz. AA, But when I tried some hot Remington #6 1500fps BS on the spinner.2 cycled OK other 2 over ran the bolt and had to manually eject to rack next round in. Need to keep around 1300fps. Shot a 250-300 round falling steel hoser match Sunday. Very cool weather to start upper 30's. All steel 35 to 56 rounds per stage. Fast & furious. Ran out of 1145AA so got 750 rounds of Winn AA 1180fps 1oz. extra light rounds for mine & my son's Benelli M2. His shoots anything. Never shot these before, but figured the FPS was hot enough. Wrong! Would not run in mine. Turned into a single shot, might run 1 or 2 in a row, but not consistent. After 2 stages of frustration found a friend and traded for some Win X 1290 FPS 1oz and they worked. Live & learn never shoot something different in a match 200 miles away. Really liking how it shoots, as I figure it out. gerritm

Dead on just the drop of 6-8". We were shooting a steel IPSC silhouette. I just push the pin out and remove the tab & spring. gerritm

Still confused on this. Bolt will not lock back unless you manually push the bolt catch with bolt pulled all the way back. If it locks on the empty mag it should lock with the bolt catch pressed. Not like a normal SG that locks when empty & bolt is pulled back. Works just like an AR. If you can't pull the bolt back manually far enough to press & lock it with the bolt catch then maybe it is a buffer/buffer tube problem. If you put an empty mag in it and locks back it when pulled then should be working correct. gerritm

I have shot a similar velocity and the recoil was super harsh. We shoot the Fiocchi 1300fps slugs. I have also shot the Freedom Munitiions Xtreme 1300fps slugs. We zero @ 50 yards and they both drop about 6" -- 8"@ 100 yards during testing. Both of these are readily available. Recoil is very manageable. gerritm

When you pull the bolt back and press the lower part of the bolt release with the bolt all the way back, it won't lock open? works the same as an AR. gerritm

I see T&N will tune one for you. I have several of their MKA mags that they tuned and all worked very well. gerritm

Love the Magpul drum for 223 but it is a PIA to load. Anyone have feedback on best VR80 drum and how hard are they to load the last couple of rounds. Same type of mechanism/lever as the Magpul? gerritm

We have a 13/16 Taccom barrel and used to run Blue Bullets/Titegroup, but the leading/carbon was awful. I used a Dremel with a small nail after flattening the pointed end for the lead and soaked the caked on carbon with Kroil and then chipped it out with a small flat screw driver I sharpened. Pain to do. Have tried several different coated bullet brands and didn't like the leading. Went back to plated bullets. Now just deal with carbon. gerritm

Well don't envy us too much. It's mid 30's right now and rained the last 2 days so bays are under water and match is cancelled. Going to be in the high 20's tonight. It is supposed to warm up in the 50-60's next week and there is another 3-gun match on the 5th Saturday. Maybe get to run it again now that I have most of the mag issues sorted out. July/August does kinda suck, but we have figured out ways to deal with the heat. gerritm

I just received a new RIA 19 rounder and TF plus 3 mag extension. Checking how this mag fits and without any mods it goes in easily and drops free just like the 5 rounders. I guess the tolerances are all over the place or maybe being new they have narrowed it down to where they should be. Our other 3 RIA 19 rounders are much tighter and without relieving some spots would not drop free or insert easily. I did put skate tape on the holes and along the edges to help with gripping them. Weather cooperates we have a local 3-gun UML style match Saturday and will see how they run. gerritm

Mine was out of a brand new box of Fiocchi 1165FPS low brass that we have shot many times before. The plastic split about 1/2 way between the brass ring and the end. Left about 1/2" of hull. Ended my day, also. Weird thing was the way we figured it out was, not knowing it was stuck, and this was the first round fired or last one on the stage before, it loaded the next round fired it and ripped the brass just like yours. Realized something stuck & quit. Got it out with a pick very easily. I have sanded the wear areas on the RIA mags down as far as I trust. Had to take a little off the inside rear sides just inside the edge of the magwell to get the RIA mags to drop. MKA mags are still tight, but OK. 5 rounder dropped without any changes. gerritm

With Creekwood not happening anymore the Dissident Falling Steel is the best match like that around here. Thunder 3gun is also very good. We may come down to corpus for some of the matches there. gerritm

You know Phil it's your fault. After shooting yours I got her 1 and now mine. Just glad at least I can use my old mags. Liked the idea of the skate tape and ordered some. They can get slippery when hands are sweaty. gerritm

Do you have any issues with the sand or debris collecting on the sticky part of the tape in the holes? gerritm

Excellent idea, I think I still have some skateboard tape around. I am a little disappointed in the way this magwell is and having to do mods to it when hers is great as is. Kinda afraid to take too much off the magwell to affect the way they seat. Although once the mag gets past the first 1/2 to 3/4 inch they go in fine and seat. Funny thing is the 5 rounders fit perfect & drop free. I don't have any RIA 10 rounders to test. Not sure why the 19 are different. We have a 3-gun match this weekend and will see how the mods I made work. gerritm

Just for info: I shot my first Dissident Falling Steel match Saturday with my new VR80. I have a couple of hundred rounds thru it in practice & testing. It was cold and very windy for the Houston metro area. High 30's to start and maybe 40's with a very cold north wind at 20 plus mph. Range is very sandy and wind picked it up and caused malfunctions in almost all guns including my son's M2. Mags constantly had sand in them if dropped for reload, which almost every stage had more than 25 rounds. The holes in the RIA mags are sand magnets, cover the mags in sandy/windy conditions. Cover your magwell and chamber also. Have extras or clean between stages. All my testing was with the stock RIA 5 & 19 round mags tuned and with all different brands & FPS rounds. My MKA mags run perfect in my granddaughters VR80 & drop free so never tested them in mine. Seems like my newer VR80 is built slightly different than hers. The gas piston looks totally different. Lesson learned. My VR80 magwell is much tighter than hers stock from the factory. None of the MKA mags would go in easily or drop that worked in hers. So used the RIA 19 rounders and even those were very tight. Check your ammo. Had some old Win AA gray hull 1300 rounds that the brass ring was corroded and had actually split so threw them away. Never saw that before. Had 1 new Fiocchi 1200 fps round split the plastic and leave the front half of the shell in the chamber. Would not allow next rounds to chamber, but came out easily. Never saw that before. Cause, maybe the cold and it was brittle? Even the Advance Tactical extended magwell had to be relieved on the back on mine where it was fine on hers. Pinched the mags back to front. Did some extra relieving on my magwell on the back side edges and on my mags so all the mags now fit and drop free. The RIA ones fit & drop much better than the MKA's. Sorry for the long post. Bottom line was even in the cold the VR80 ran fine with all ammo used. It was mag issues that caused any problems. gerritm

Seeing those problems with others shooting the Elfman turned me off. Her T&N trigger was very good and simple installation and has been totally reliable so I stayed with that for mine. We have a couple of thousand round on hers with almost total reliability once I sorted out the mag upgrades. I am still breaking in mine with a couple of hundred rounds thru it and then will decide if I need or want to drill the ports. Not seeing a reason to drill, yet as it has shot everything thru it from 1145 to 1500 fps variety of shells brands with no malfunctions in practice. Shooting a Dissident Arms falling steel match Saturday if the weather cooperates, with average of 30 rounds per stage & 5 or 6 stages. Will see what it does when the neuralizer goes off and I run all my mags. I have run most of them in practice and her VR and all work fine. Have a mixture of RIA 19 rounders, 24 round T&N, Firebird 18 round, and older MKA 10 rounders. gerritm

Not having drilled my ports I shot some hot 1500 plus fps slugs when testing & zeroing and they ran fine in mine. I didn't like the recoil so I tried the JM Fiocchi 1300fps slugs and like them better. Zeroed at 50 yards POA with Mod choke. Tested to 100 and they were about 4-6" low, but dead on. I believe Xtreme now has some 1300fps slugs in stock. I have the low FPS. Note I have the low gas piston installed in both. The hot slugs would not run in my granddaughters with drilled ports. Hers will run the lower recoil 1300 & 1150 Fiocchis and the 1150 shoots POA at 50 yards where we zeroed. We have shot hers out to 80/100 yards in a match to POA with a drop @ 100. gerritm

Guess I got a good one. Be careful on the Elfman trigger. Not sure if they have changed it but I know at least 2 guys who installed it and had light strikes and sent it back. These were early ones last year. Might have improved or changed since then. gerrit

I ran a T&N built MKA1919 for many years with thousands of rounds before changing to the VR80 recently. Mine ran as close to 100% over the years with a couple of minor broken parts. Very happy with it and still have it. Might be for sale shortly. I have never measured what her VR80 gas ports were opened to, but have found that any rounds with 1350fps or above over run the bolt and cause failures. Turns into a single shot. Tried some 1350fps #6 on a spinner and had FTE. I Have shot everything from 1145 to 1300fps with no problems in hers and mine so I have not done anything to the ports on mine, yet. She has the T&N flat trigger and I put the same in mine. Right around 4# with no creep very nice. Thought about the barrel porting, but pretty happy with the Taccom comp on both. gerritm I broke mine in with a variety of shells and worked down to 1145 AA & Federal without the

I took a dremel (I know bad) with a fine SS brush to all of the edges of the mag top edges inside & out. Same with all the edges and any plastic slag on the follower after removing the bolt hold open tab. Then a fine sanding disc on the part of the mag paint that goes in the well until it drops free. Some when new drop easy others have a build up of paint. Again I also spray a dry teflon in the mag & follower every once in awhile if I take it apart to clean if dropped in sand. Sand/dust/dirt and the mags don't mix. gerritm

Experiment with different loads. We shoot 3-PCCs and l have tried several different loads from 115-124-&147 and all of us like the 115gr RN plated Everglades with 3.7grs Titegroup. We like the faster cycling and dot does not move. I don't worry about recoil as long as the dot movement is steady. gerritm

Loosen just enough when you load and the round goes past that joint you don't feel a lot of resistance. You will always feel some. The mags will move slightly at the joint. You can put Loctite on the screws, but I haven't because there seems to be enough pressure with the clamp against the nuts to hold them in place. Never had one loosen. Fiocchi rounds seem to have a better shell and also the Remington STS shells have a hard shell, but are on the expensive side. We use whatever for practice, but always either the Winn AA, STS, or Fiocchis in a match. Especially in the summer heat. We shoot the Dissident falling steel match with 30 plus rounds on some stages and I have shot 3-gun with 40 plus rounds, His 28 round big mag or my 24 rounder are not great if you shoot over a bench due to the length, but in the open are great. Considering the drum just for being shorter. How hard are they to load. The Magpul 223 drum is tough. Our first VR80 was built by someone and bought modified that my granddaughter shoots, but very similar to what Hayes does in the basic reliability package. could have been done by them. I did the modifications on mine and it runs great. Hers has the gas ports opened, T&N trigger, Taccom buffer & comp, along with a Magpul PRS stock. Mine is the same except I haven't opened the gas ports as it shoots 1145 AA and cheapie Winchester fine. She runs Fiocchi low recoil slugs dead on and mine likes the JM slugs medium recoil 1300 fps. Yes, I did file down the mag and smooth/polish all edges. gerritm

Couple of tricks to make the 19 rounder easier to load and more reliable. Remove the bolt hold open on the follower. Polish the edges of the follower and the metal on the mag top. I take the paint off until they drop free. I also spray a dry teflon in the mag every so often. The mag loader looks like it will work, but there is a technique to hand load the mags that works well. Also loosen up the center clamp slightly on the 19 rounder so the shells feed smoothly in & out. We run 2 VR80's using old style MKA mags and the RIA mags. Also Advance Tactical carries a Taylor Freelance +3 mag extension for the 10 round and 19 that seem to work OK with original springs & followers. Keep the springs stretched. Never used the drum, have seen a couple of shooters use it and it seems to work. I have an old 24 round T&N built MKA mag that works & feeds well and one of my buddies has put 2 RIA 19 rounds together for 28 rounds that also works. We also only use certain shells, mostly Win AA because they have a hard shell and don't dent. Here in Texas the shells will deform in the heat of the summer and will not feed. gerritm

We run 9mm Everglades 115gr RN plated right at PF in 3 different pistol & PCCs and have never had a problem knocking over falling plates, Texas Stars, poppers(large&small), and spinners in 3gun & USPSA. Have run 124's & 147s and have not noted any significance difference. gerritm