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Open Gun with Weapon Mounted Light?


Rudukai13

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I figure the popularity of night time matches has grown enough that at least a few people out there have to have set up their Open blaster to have a WML by now. Anybody out there who's done it, can you tell us your setup? How does the light change the feel of shooting the gun?

 

Make sure to post pictures too please!

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6 hours ago, drewbeck said:

Are you talking about evening matches “lower light”  or matches shot in the dark?

 

I'm talking about Open guns with mounted flashlights - Level of darkness of a particular match isn't really of importance

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I'm talking about Open guns with mounted flashlights - Level of darkness of a particular match isn't really of importance


It’s actually very relevant. Unless it’s pitch black out and you need a light to even see the target whatsoever, a weapon light would be detrimental and pointless to performance


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Years ago we had a night match and a velcroed a led key chain light to my scope mount (that’s wasn’t my idea, I saw it here)

and as feeble and weak as the light was ,it lit up the targets just enough so I could see them

if you attach a rail to the scope mount, it might work and you wouldn’t need a new holster

 

btw the muzzle flash wasn’t that impressive, I never saw it,  the open guns I saw all had the flame appear a few inches above the gun

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I guess that's my point, these type of matches are so rare I doubt there are many (if any) people out there that have an open gun and holster rig configured this way.

Reasons, 

1) very few open guns have rails to mount a light 

2) most people generally use a race holster for an open gun, and most race holsters index or mount the gun off the bottom of the frame and face of the trigger guard which wouldn't allow for a light to be mounted

 

I'll be curious whether you get any response from someone who has actually tried to do this.  I'm one of the small number of people that have a tactical framed with rail open gun and in a pitch black match scenario, I'd put a headlamp on my belt to illuminate the path and targets before I'd ever consider mounting a light to my gun.  I bet you'd find a lot more weapon mounted lights in carry optics guns because they are typically designed to be carried with this option.

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I have a Glock 34 with a slide mount red dot "open" comped gun with flashlight/laser combo. None of the night matches around here have PF so no reason to use the major gun. I tried zip ties, duct tape, various ideas to mount light to red dot frame mount and none worked.

 

I could picture using a small rail section screwed to the frame mount with a light, then remove it. Usually a dark start or head lamp only start. A good high power head lamp will give you enough to use your red dot. Not ideal, but will work.

 

We shoot several night matches a year here locally. Pretty much gone to PCC with light/green laser for most of the night matches now. Use the Glock for 3-gun night matches. 

 

gerritm

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3 hours ago, drewbeck said:

I'm one of the small number of people that have a tactical framed with rail open gun and in a pitch black match scenario, I'd put a headlamp on my belt to illuminate the path and targets before I'd ever consider mounting a light to my gun.  I bet you'd find a lot more weapon mounted lights in carry optics guns because they are typically designed to be carried with this option.

 

If you happen to have a WML of any type handy, would you mind mounting it to your Open gun and posting pictures? Just curiosity on my part

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There just is no good way to put a light on the frame of an open gun. Your holster simply wouldn't work. And, in most situations I have experienced when it is really really dark, is the amount of muzzle flash and sparks coming out of the gun is so beyond distracting that it is nearly impossible to see the targets anyway. Perhaps a light would make them less obvious, but I don't know. The most... elegant(?) solution I have seen was 2 scope mounts and some extra long screws, with one of them bolted on backwards then a light attached to that. 

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I have shot night matches with my open gun using a wrist mounted light from ebay for $15. 

 

It worked but Railed guns with proper torches are better. I'll be using a carry optics shadow 2 for the next one. The dot is way easier to see than iron sights with a rail mounted light. 

 

 

 

 

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No, think about the frame design, the optic mount fits the frame without a rail, the rail is added material below the “traditional” 1911 frame dimensions, so why would they interfere. The bigger issue is whether the optic mount was made for a 1911 width or a “wide body” width. Though I doubt that somebody makes a standard width 1911 frame and then balloons the rail dimension to fit a mil spec width. Unless the frame is literally a one off, a frame with a rail will always be a wide body frame, aka same width as the slide. (Anybody tell me if this is inaccurate) so no clearance issue.

 

a reliable holster as well as the very limited need, is the reason this is a “who cares” issue.

 

However, if you are the kind of guy that wants/needs an open gun for his nightstand blaster with an optic, it’ll work fine but you’re better off with a suppressor and no comp. anyone in the room not getting shot will thank you a lot!

 

 

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I have for a novelty night match. 

 

I was shooting a tanfog eric custom at the time. It has scope mount holes on both sides of the frame but only uses the left side. 

 

I got these 2 little plastic things that are made to secure cables to a wall with cable ties. 

 

Screwed one into the two furthest apart holes. Put light on and secured with 2 cable ties. 

 

It worked pretty well. 

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Bolt a rail on dust cover. Year's ago there was a featured gun for this in a gun rag.
It belonged to Ichiro Nagata. All black, 38super, square comp, aimpoint. Was built on a railed 2011 frame. Think the name was black widow. It was quite interesting.

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On 2/8/2018 at 2:51 AM, drewbeck said:

No, think about the frame design, the optic mount fits the frame without a rail, the rail is added material below the “traditional” 1911 frame dimensions, so why would they interfere. The bigger issue is whether the optic mount was made for a 1911 width or a “wide body” width. Though I doubt that somebody makes a standard width 1911 frame and then balloons the rail dimension to fit a mil spec width. Unless the frame is literally a one off, a frame with a rail will always be a wide body frame, aka same width as the slide. (Anybody tell me if this is inaccurate) so no clearance issue.

 

a reliable holster as well as the very limited need, is the reason this is a “who cares” issue.

 

However, if you are the kind of guy that wants/needs an open gun for his nightstand blaster with an optic, it’ll work fine but you’re better off with a suppressor and no comp. anyone in the room not getting shot will thank you a lot!

 

 

Actually....I would have thought the same thing. However, at least with STI frames, they are the same width. STI makes a “wide dustcover” frame that is the same width as the slide. They also make a “traditional” width dustcover frame. The STI “light-rail” frame has the same width dustcover as the “traditional” frame...at least at the point where you’d drill and tap for an optic mount. I know this because that was my concern when I sent my STI light-rail/tactical frame to my gunsmith to build an Open gun on. I’ll see if I can find the dimensions and e post them here. There’s another thread discussing this issue of width on the STI frames in the Gunsmithing section of Forums.

 

Now...other newer manufacturers of hi-cap widebody frames may Inc fact be wider on their “light rail” frames. Phoenix Trinity comes to mind. Last time I was at their factory and saw one, it sure looked wider. CK May be wider too. Dunno... But STI is not.

 

Hope that helps!

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Found the dimensions. 

STI Standard and Tacitcal/lightrail dustcovers measure .830” +/-

STI Wide Dustcovers measure .920”+/-

At some point, STI started machining the rails to be more similar to 1913 Picatinny style. Don’t know what those measure, but the Tactical rails measure .830”

Again, hope it helps. 

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5 hours ago, cheers623 said:

Actually....I would have thought the same thing. However, at least with STI frames, they are the same width. STI makes a “wide dustcover” frame that is the same width as the slide. They also make a “traditional” width dustcover frame. The STI “light-rail” frame has the same width dustcover as the “traditional” frame...at least at the point where you’d drill and tap for an optic mount. I know this because that was my concern when I sent my STI light-rail/tactical frame to my gunsmith to build an Open gun on. I’ll see if I can find the dimensions and e post them here. There’s another thread discussing this issue of width on the STI frames in the Gunsmithing section of Forums.

 

Now...other newer manufacturers of hi-cap widebody frames may Inc fact be wider on their “light rail” frames. Phoenix Trinity comes to mind. Last time I was at their factory and saw one, it sure looked wider. CK May be wider too. Dunno... But STI is not.

 

Hope that helps!

 

I was referring to a 1911 standard width which is .750-.760 depending on manufacturer.  Which in that case you would need to be custom width/wider frame (ie one off) to have a picatinny rail that measured .830" in width.

 

My gun pictured above is a wide PT frame with rail.  I haven't measured the rail width on it to see if it's wider than the standard .830" rail, but my light fits so it doesn't matter much

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