actionshooter Posted December 31, 2017 Share Posted December 31, 2017 Thinking I might need (really want) and open shotgun, it would be a box fed gun for sure.... Looking for opinions on brand and why, we have Dissident, R&R, Tooth&Nail....anyone else? Whatcha got? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todd7446 Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 I've been very happy with my Firebird Precision TAC-12A1. Make sure your mag feed lips are tuned to the right width, run an ammo with a good stiff hull and crimp (I have stuck with Fiocchi), and make sure the gas is adjusted right (not bleeding off too much). In an AK pattern, it is undeniable that Mike & Lan at Dissident Arms have their guns running like raped apes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gerritm Posted January 2, 2018 Share Posted January 2, 2018 Been running a T&N MKA 1919 for about 4 years now with thousands of rounds. Have mags from 5 rounds to 24 rounds. Gun runs 99%. Good part it is same muscle memory as an AR so controls are very easy acquire. Very good customer service. As stated above, being open you do need to keep the mags clean/adjusted, run good ammo (Winn AA 1145), no gas adjustment, just clean the gas system once in awhile. I do shoot with Mike & Lan from DA and their Vepr mag fed shotguns are great also if you like that style. Longer and heavier,but run. Not sure there are too many other choices out there if you are going to buy one from a builder. gerritm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
actionshooter Posted January 3, 2018 Author Share Posted January 3, 2018 Thanks guys, looking hard at Dissident..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKJD Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 I would go with Dissident Arms. I have a T&N match and gave up on it after a broken gas piston and 2 broken bolt carriers. I built a Vepr 12 and had DA put a left side charging handle on it. Runs great with Federal bulk pack. The T&N ran with the more expensive Win AA. You have better magazine options with the VEPR and the mags are more robust and don’t have the feed lip issues. I started out loving the 1919 but as it started breaking I lost faith in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gerritm Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 3 hours ago, AKJD said: I would go with Dissident Arms. I have a T&N match and gave up on it after a broken gas piston and 2 broken bolt carriers. I built a Vepr 12 and had DA put a left side charging handle on it. Runs great with Federal bulk pack. The T&N ran with the more expensive Win AA. You have better magazine options with the VEPR and the mags are more robust and don’t have the feed lip issues. I started out loving the 1919 but as it started breaking I lost faith in it. Just to follow up on my experience with my T&N. I have run thousands of rounds & the only thing that broke was a carrier leg and they repaired it at no charge. Only thing I have ever done with the mags is change the springs every couple of years. Unless you drop the mags on the lips or step on them they really never change. I do run 1145 AA because of the heat here in Texas. They don't deform, have hard shell casing. I have seen the cheaper rounds egg shape in the heat. I can run them in practice. Not sure on the mag options, I have 5,10,12,15,18 & 24 round mags that all work. The DA Vepr is a good platform. Nothing to take away, personal choice. gerritm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKJD Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 12 minutes ago, gerritm said: Just to follow up on my experience with my T&N. I have run thousands of rounds & the only thing that broke was a carrier leg and they repaired it at no charge. Only thing I have ever done with the mags is change the springs every couple of years. Unless you drop the mags on the lips or step on them they really never change. I do run 1145 AA because of the heat here in Texas. They don't deform, have hard shell casing. I have seen the cheaper rounds egg shape in the heat. I can run them in practice. Not sure on the mag options, I have 5,10,12,15,18 & 24 round mags that all work. The DA Vepr is a good platform. Nothing to take away, personal choice. gerritm I’m very happy for you that yours is such a fine gun, that doesn’t make mine any less of an unreliable piece of junk that cost me 2 matches. I certainly wish mine was reliable because like I said I started out loving it. As for magazines the choice I was referring to was sources. Molot, CSS, SGM. Molot factory mags are highly reliable and need no adjustment, CSS mags are very robust all steel that you must fit to your gun, easy to do and once fitted are highly reliable, SGM mags can be spliced together to get higher round counts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiggerJJ Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 Tac 12A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Searchnman Posted January 3, 2018 Share Posted January 3, 2018 Dissident seems to the best way to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jabavalk Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 In thailand Derya MK-12 is best choice for Open shotgun.http:// Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmiller Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 (edited) 12 hours ago, jabavalk said: In thailand Derya MK-12 is best choice for Open shotgun. http:// Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Can I buy one in the USA? Edited January 11, 2018 by bmiller Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike4045 Posted January 13, 2018 Share Posted January 13, 2018 Anyone trying the UTAS 12 XTR. Picked one up at the gun shop this week. So far about 50 into it and it seems to be ok. Needs chokes and a comp. Higher cap mags would be nice also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HCH Posted January 13, 2018 Share Posted January 13, 2018 On 1/10/2018 at 9:46 PM, jabavalk said: In thailand Derya MK-12 is best choice for Open shotgun. http:// Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk I want one!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmiller Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 4 hours ago, mike4045 said: Anyone trying the UTAS 12 XTR. Picked one up at the gun shop this week. So far about 50 into it and it seems to be ok. Needs chokes and a comp. Higher cap mags would be nice also. How heavy is the buffer spring? I had read somewhere the xtr-12 doesn’t like big sticks. I do not have any experience with one, I don’t know if that is true. I was curious if it had a light buffer spring and couldn’t overcome all the friction and spring pressure of the mag. They are nice looking shotguns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike4045 Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 It has a really light buffer spring. It hand cycles easily. Hope to get out to shoot it tomorrow. If it gets above zero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
compshootfl Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 I would stick with the Vepr 12 ...runs out of the box and is one tough gun. I have shooting one for over 2 years, once a week and have had maybe 5 or 6 FTF, other than that extremely reliable and soft shooting. I shot an MKA 1919 before I got the Vepr, no comparison...my 1919 was highly modified to even get it to run. Also, you can't beat the price..under $800. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VforVandetta Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 Let me know if you have any questions about the Vepr 12. Dissident Arms does the finest conversions in the business and is always innovating to drive the platform forward. These things are built like tanks on light machine gun AK receivers, the durability and speed is unmatched. I can get you the best possible pricing and discuss options for your build! -V Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudukai13 Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 I've been keeping a rough list of mag-fed shotguns for a while. So far it looks like this: KEY: +: Kalashnikov pattern •: AR-style ergonomics *: True AR pattern ^: Bullpup pattern - Saiga/VEPR-12 variants (Dissident Arms, Molot, Fostech, Kalashnikov USA, etc.)+ - MKA 1919 variants (Firebird Precision, Tooth & Nail, etc.)• - Standard Manufacturing SKO-12 and SKO-Bullpup (unsure but this may be another MKA 1919 clone)•^ - Utas XTR-12 (poor reliability track record unless T&N has fixed it)* - Genesis Arms Gen12 (available in either a full firearm or DPMS-compatible upper assembly)* - Crye Precision Six12 (not yet available for order, has been in testing for two or three years)^ - IWI Tavor TS12 (very recently announced bullpup shotgun, details to be released at 2018 SHOT)^ ___ I'm sure there are others but these are the most prominent I've been aware of this far. It will be interesting to see what else debuts at SHOT Show 2018. It seems manufacturing a reliable 12-gauge box magazine has (mostly) become a known quantity, now we'll see what different manufacturers can build around the magazines... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuckinMS Posted January 22, 2018 Share Posted January 22, 2018 Dissident are very cool looking, I noticed Max Michele Jr is shooting one. I haven't gotten an opportunity to get my hands on one, but my wife is probably unaware on how greatful she should be of that, because boy if I did...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwilkinson6 Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 Several of the open guys in my area are using the 1919 from Tooth and Nail. They always seem to be 100% once they found the right slugs for their guns. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmiller Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 On 1/13/2018 at 11:35 PM, mike4045 said: It has a really light buffer spring. It hand cycles easily. Hope to get out to shoot it tomorrow. If it gets above zero. How did it shoot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amccallister Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 I’m getting into open this year, and I went with Dissident Arms. I actually bought a new one as well as a lightly used one. Starting out the guns felt awkward as I have spent very little time shooting an AK type gun in the past. With a couple of days of dry fire and a few hundred rounds of live ammo it feels much more natural and I’m really looking forward to shooting some matches. The new gun, which I have shot the most, does not run 100% with cheap shells in the 15 and 20 round magazines, but runs them well enough for practice use in the 12 round magazines (Remington Gun Club shells). It runs perfectly with Winchester AA’s no matter the magazine size, so I will be using these in matches. Very happy with the guns so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike4045 Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 On 2/1/2018 at 6:18 AM, bmiller said: How did it shoot? I finally got a chance to run it. I ran it side by side with a factory 1919. Both guns ran 100%, but I only had 5 rd mags to try. I ran Winchester cheap crap and double aa, Fiochi, Remington sts. The 1919 ripped the first rim off the cheap stuff, but ran everything else. The utas ran it all,but the cheap stuff was a little sluggish. I have a couple of 10 rd mags on the way to try next. They both shoot fiochi slugs to poa @ 50 yds. The 1919 was run with 100 rds of 1450 fpi loads to break it in. No break in was done to the utas. I probably will one of the 2 for uml rules 3 gun shooting 4x4 division. I am also looking at an xrail. About 150 rds thru each gun while testing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montrala Posted February 20, 2018 Share Posted February 20, 2018 I'm testing Typhoon F12 now and it is very promising. Any problems I had so far were ammo related. BTW I have a question about zeroing red dot. How to best zero it for best use with birdshot and occasional use with slug (usually at no more than 60 yards)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USCSBarney Posted March 31, 2018 Share Posted March 31, 2018 Update us on the Typhoon testing. Getting a Dissident but always like idea of backup and the Typhoon looks tempting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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