IHAVEGAS Posted July 9, 2017 Share Posted July 9, 2017 Alrighty then. Appreciate all of the responses. Had it in my mind that is must be the hammer travel just based on visual, but it sounds like that was jumping to a conclusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnbu Posted July 9, 2017 Share Posted July 9, 2017 15 hours ago, IHAVEGAS said: Even if the hammer is not coming back close to as far as ideal in double action? Will check consistency of seating and fpb! yup. as Memphis said, the gun should pop winchester primers with ease. 3 hours ago, IHAVEGAS said: Alrighty then. Appreciate all of the responses. Had it in my mind that is must be the hammer travel just based on visual, but it sounds like that was jumping to a conclusion. The short stroking hammer is probably also impacting things. But even falling from 1/2 cock notch should set off a winchester primer! Full stroking hammer will set off nearly every primer ... with a 15.5# spring and a fully prepped gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanfastic Posted July 13, 2017 Author Share Posted July 13, 2017 Having some strange things as I try to get the bolo in and fitted correctly. I had it in before and didn't really pay any attention to the DA hammer travel. I have a 2nd bolo which I wanted to start with and measure everything exactly, including the hammer travel. I'm finding that the DA hammer is short-stroking pretty badly and not consistently, once in a while it travels farther but most pull are short-stroked. Measuring the stock disconnector DA hammer travel, it's rock solid, long travel, and measures exactly the same every time, so I don't think I have any other issues contributing to this. With the bolo, not so much. I pinged Joe at PD, he said he wasn't sure but maybe I needed to take a little off the bottom of the bolo to allow it to sit down on the trigger bar more. I tried that, made no difference at all. Then I tried taking some off the tip of the bolo in case it was dragging on the frame and breaking early, still no change. I swapped the stock disconnector back in a couple times, it's always perfect. Then either of the 2 bolos I have, it's always short-stroked DA pull and not consistent, most obvious is that if I pull the trigger fast it's always short stroked, and if I pull it slowly it's sometimes short stroked. Any other ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalShooter69 Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 (edited) I'm not going back 7 pages to re-read what mods you have done. Please update. That being said, your bolo is coming off the trigger bar too soon. You should send your gun to Joe, since you're unsure of how to remidy the issue. Did you break the 90° wing at all? The have been issues with bad trigger bars. I'm guessing it's still rubbing the frame. Either way, there are thousands of bolos properly functioning and properly modded for increase DA. You need to send tour gun to someone competent. Coming back here and making page after page of people making guesses, isn't going to fix your problem... Send. It. To. Joe. Edited July 13, 2017 by SoCalShooter69 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanfastic Posted July 13, 2017 Author Share Posted July 13, 2017 9 hours ago, SoCalShooter69 said: I'm not going back 7 pages to re-read what mods you have done. Please update. That being said, your bolo is coming off the trigger bar too soon. You should send your gun to Joe, since you're unsure of how to remidy the issue. Did you break the 90° wing at all? The have been issues with bad trigger bars. I'm guessing it's still rubbing the frame. Either way, there are thousands of bolos properly functioning and properly modded for increase DA. You need to send tour gun to someone competent. Coming back here and making page after page of people making guesses, isn't going to fix your problem... Send. It. To. Joe. Uh, thanks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sniperboy Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 Are you getting light strikes in DA from this short stroking? I don't blame you though - it would annoy me crap out of me eventhough conventional knowledge would say don't worry about it. Gleaning from a previous poster here with bolo woes - your Tanflango is not a SMALL FRAME by chance is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWfront Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 14 hours ago, Tanfastic said: I swapped the stock disconnector back in a couple times, it's always perfect. I believe your answer is in the question. I had similar issues and decided to remove it for the time being. For now I just load ammo and shoot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanfastic Posted July 13, 2017 Author Share Posted July 13, 2017 40 minutes ago, Sniperboy said: Are you getting light strikes in DA from this short stroking? I don't blame you though - it would annoy me crap out of me eventhough conventional knowledge would say don't worry about it. Gleaning from a previous poster here with bolo woes - your Tanflango is not a SMALL FRAME by chance is it? No, large frame. Yes light strikes with bolo, never a light strike in over 1500 rounds now with the stock disconnector. That's why I got a 2nd bolo to try, my first one I had modified so I started over with a fresh one. When I originally posted about having light strike issues, I didn't equate it to the bolo install since conventional wisdom said it shouldn't be related. I also got the primer seating issue resolved out of that, but I know now that the majority of the light strike issue was due to the short-stroking hammer with the bolo and not just the ammo. I didn't post back about it because.... well you know. I ran a ton of my leftover factory ammo back through it in practice with the stock disconnector and it fires 100% now that the gun is broken in and polished up. I like the trigger feel with the bolo obviously so I want that in there long-term, but for now I'm stuck with the stock setup since I can't send the gun away at this point in the season. I thought if I could keep messing with it and figuring out what's causing the break to happen early, I might be able to resolve it so I can use the bolo now, but no luck so far. I see nothing wrong with messing with it, I don't mind that sort of thing and I'm not mechnically incompetent. I know a lot of guys here have done a TON to their guns so there is a good body of knowledge, if someone can help, great, and if not that's fine. I appreciate all of the info here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanfastic Posted July 13, 2017 Author Share Posted July 13, 2017 Just now, NWfront said: I believe your answer is in the question. I had similar issues and decided to remove it for the time being. For now I just load ammo and shoot. Oh, that's what I'm doing as far as the practice and matches go, I'm not worrying about the bolo for that at this point. It's more of a "hobby" since I don't like have a puzzle that I can't figure out! ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MemphisMechanic Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 I think the main issue you're having finding help is that, for most of us, a one-piece sear and a Titan hammer and a Bolo were an absolutely drop-in installation. I don't have any experience fitting a disconnector. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanfastic Posted July 13, 2017 Author Share Posted July 13, 2017 42 minutes ago, MemphisMechanic said: I think the main issue you're having finding help is that, for most of us, a one-piece sear and a Titan hammer and a Bolo were an absolutely drop-in installation. I don't have any experience fitting a disconnector. Right that's what I was assuming would happen.... only it didn't. Sounds like at least one other person had a similar issue and wasn't able to resolve it, so still a mystery. It's fine, not like the end of the world at this point, the gun works perfectly with the stock disconnector for now. I've swapped back and forth to/from the two different bolos I have too many times to count now, so I'm confident it's not a basic install issue, there's something different either with my Xtreme trigger bar or ??. I have the Xtreme 1-piece sear and titan hammer. There must be something wonky with my gun, could be related to the "factory trigger job" that the Xtreme has, maybe they changed something with the trigger bar besides just polishing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalShooter69 Posted July 13, 2017 Share Posted July 13, 2017 2 hours ago, Tanfastic said: Right that's what I was assuming would happen.... only it didn't. Sounds like at least one other person had a similar issue and wasn't able to resolve it, so still a mystery. It's fine, not like the end of the world at this point, the gun works perfectly with the stock disconnector for now. I've swapped back and forth to/from the two different bolos I have too many times to count now, so I'm confident it's not a basic install issue, there's something different either with my Xtreme trigger bar or ??. I have the Xtreme 1-piece sear and titan hammer. There must be something wonky with my gun, could be related to the "factory trigger job" that the Xtreme has, maybe they changed something with the trigger bar besides just polishing it. That's my point, maybe one or two out of thousands of bolos. That's why I suggested sending to Joe. Hundreds of S2/S3 xtreme users have had zero issue. There have been some with irregular trigger bars, or trigger bars that didn't quite catch QC. Your gun would be running by now, if you actually sent it to someone competant. But let's keep discussing possibilities and how the bolo doesn't work in your platform, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnbu Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 One thing, i believe the factory disco and the bolo have "wings" on opposite sides. the trigger bar could be fubar one one side, but ok on the other. the tanfo guys could have only concentrated on the one side ? Just a guess. A clear high res photo of the trigger bar end would be nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanfastic Posted July 14, 2017 Author Share Posted July 14, 2017 3 minutes ago, SoCalShooter69 said: That's my point, maybe one or two out of thousands of bolos. That's why I suggested sending to Joe. Hundreds of S2/S3 xtreme users have had zero issue. There have been some with irregular trigger bars, or trigger bars that didn't quite catch QC. Your gun would be running by now, if you actually sent it to someone competant. But let's keep discussing possibilities and how the bolo doesn't work in your platform, lol. I have a L3 match coming up in 3 weeks that I'm training every day for, otherwise I would have already sent it in. I don't have a backup Tanfo yet, but will be getting one as soon as my hobby funds have re-accumulated to the level of buying another. As I mentioned, I'm just fiddling with it at this point, I enjoy the fiddling, and am learning a lot about the gun through the fiddling. So just let me fiddle please. If no one has ideas to guide my fiddling, that's fine, I just posted the question to see if anyone else had experienced something similar since Joe didn't have any specific ideas on it either without looking at it. I fully understand there may be no answer to the question, I'm ok with no answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanfastic Posted July 14, 2017 Author Share Posted July 14, 2017 1 minute ago, johnbu said: One thing, i believe the factory disco and the bolo have "wings" on opposite sides. the trigger bar could be fubar one one side, but ok on the other. the tanfo guys could have only concentrated on the one side ? Just a guess. A clear high res photo of the trigger bar end would be nice. Yes, that's correct, opposite sides. I can snap a pic of it, will post it up when I get a chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalShooter69 Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 3 minutes ago, Tanfastic said: Yes, that's correct, opposite sides. I can snap a pic of it, will post it up when I get a chance. We're all fully aware of what the bar looks like. There have been instances where the bar was jacked. You keep eluding that the bolo is your issue, when I don't think it is. Yes, the factor disco might work beeter, but you may have an underlying problem with your trigger bar or set-up. Fiddle.if you wamt, but damn, stop.posting how things don't work... when you're not competant enough to get them to work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanfastic Posted July 14, 2017 Author Share Posted July 14, 2017 2 hours ago, johnbu said: One thing, i believe the factory disco and the bolo have "wings" on opposite sides. the trigger bar could be fubar one one side, but ok on the other. the tanfo guys could have only concentrated on the one side ? Just a guess. A clear high res photo of the trigger bar end would be nice. Here it is: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeinctown Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 I'm not a Tanfo guy so forgive me if it is normal, but the angles look jacked on the right side of the back of that trigger bar where on the left side the angles are more square. As it is mentioned that the two ride on different sides, having one side angled differently could be an issue. Also not sure how far over the disco rides, but it looks in at least two of the photos like there are burrs or some deformity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanfastic Posted July 15, 2017 Author Share Posted July 15, 2017 On 7/14/2017 at 8:14 AM, mikeinctown said: I'm not a Tanfo guy so forgive me if it is normal, but the angles look jacked on the right side of the back of that trigger bar where on the left side the angles are more square. As it is mentioned that the two ride on different sides, having one side angled differently could be an issue. Also not sure how far over the disco rides, but it looks in at least two of the photos like there are burrs or some deformity. Yeah that could be the deal, it's not really obvious looking at it in real time but in the zoomed photos it's more obvious. Since I don't have another one to compare to I don't know what's "normal" variation and what's too much. This trigger bar is as delivered from factory, I haven't done anything to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanfastic Posted July 17, 2017 Author Share Posted July 17, 2017 Just to close the book on this for posterity, I did finally get the BOLO working properly. I had to take a lot more off the bottom radius of the BOLO to get it to sit down father on the trigger bar per Joe's suggestion. After polishing it up and getting things all back together, it's spot-on now with the DA hammer travel just as long as the stock disconnector, and the almost zero take-up SA action characteristic of the BOLO. The biggest thing is the DA pull is exactly the same hammer travel every single time. First pic is the DA hammer travel right before the break, and the 2nd is the SA position. Now I need to get back to training with the short SA pull and put another thousand rounds through it to verify reliability, which I have a week to do before the next match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IHAVEGAS Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 15 hours ago, Tanfastic said: Just to close the book on this for posterity, Thanks for posting! The s.a. versus d.a. travel pictures are very interesting to me, it is hard to know what is 'right' when you are not experienced with fiddling about on these things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IHAVEGAS Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 On 7/6/2017 at 8:04 AM, johnbu said: Word to the wise, dull the end so it won't poke a hole in your finger. I use a very small philips screwdriver to catch and lift the sear spring. Less chance of my clumsy fingers getting poked ! Needle was good, very small phillips is very good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanfastic Posted July 29, 2017 Author Share Posted July 29, 2017 On 7/18/2017 at 9:23 AM, IHAVEGAS said: Thanks for posting! The s.a. versus d.a. travel pictures are very interesting to me, it is hard to know what is 'right' when you are not experienced with fiddling about on these things. I think "right" really means it reliably ignites your primers, and there's clearly a balance between the hammer spring rate and the travel to achieve that. I'm over 2000 rounds now with zero misfires of any kind with the 14lb spring and bolo, it's been rock solid set up this way. I have come to terms with the trigger feel now, which was much of the motivation to put that many rounds through in such a short time. Love the gun, glad I switched, and now I have a back up on the way too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HesedTech Posted July 29, 2017 Share Posted July 29, 2017 I have a Stock II large frame 9mm and have been shooting it with the Henning upgrades for a few months. To be honest I wasn't really happy with the trigger, DA or SA, at all. So, following this and other posts here on BE I have done the Patriot Defense upgrades and polished to a magnificent shine, per MM. Parts: Titan Hammer Extreme Sear and spring. Henning Firing Pin and Extreme FP spring. Henning slide return rod and spring. Extreme trigger spring. After trying 13, 14, 14 Wolff, I have settled on 15.5# PD hammer spring. PD Bolo Extended firing pin safety. Its a whole new machine! DA pull averages under 6 lbs (5lbs 10oz average 10 pulls) SA pull under 3 lbs (2 lbs 8+oz same average) Very smooth DA and the SA has the fabulous bolo almost no take-up. For those who don't believe that something as simple as polishing the parts is important I can confirm that it reduced trigger pulls by close to a pound. I have about the same trigger weights with the 15.5# hammer spring (after polishing) as with the 13# one. 25 yard shots are now far easier to keep tight than before upgrades. The only thing which prevented this from being a "drop-in" project is: Bolo required small filing, per PD instructions, to get DA to work. Followed instructions to modify bolo to get longer DA. Safety and sear also needed minor filing and smoothing to get it, safety, to work with one piece sear. I polished extended FP safety, but it was basically drop-in and worked perfectly. The stock one will not function with one piece Extreme sear. Put 200 rounds though it today and it ran perfectly and I can't write enough about how nice the SA is with the Bolo from PD. Too bad Tanfoglio couldn't have done that from the start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emjei Posted July 29, 2017 Share Posted July 29, 2017 Because the OP has a Xtreme Gun Can I ask ..... how Tall and Wide the Xtreme Front Sight is ??Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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