Toyotafrank Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Hello been shooting steel and some USPSA and when I shoot fast (2 shots or more same target) I start tracking left and low. If I slow down I am A zone all day long. It is frustrating no matter what I do I am pulling left any ideas. I have an APEX trigger other than that stock (same with stock trigger). I can slow shoot and nail it but speed up and left i go its like the gun is heading that way and I cant seem to correct. Any help would be great M&P pro 9MM 147 HP 940 PF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LilBunniFuFu Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Sounds like you are slapping the trigger to the rear when you are trying to go faster. Make sure to align those sites before you fire off that next round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alma Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Sounds like you are slapping the trigger to the rear when you are trying to go faster. Make sure to align those sites before you fire off that next round. It doesn't have anything to do with misaligned sights per say. Your trigger pull is jerking your gun down just before it goes off. You needed to adjust your trigger pull so that when you slap the trigger it doesn't disturb the sights. Start with dry fire practice focusing on not disturbing your sights when you pull at speed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just4FunLP Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Same here. I asked an experienced shooter about this and he laughed and said that everyone does that. For me, I've found that hooking my finger a little and putting a small amount of pressure on the left edge of the trigger seems to help a lot. But I have to concentrate. I'm dealing with pain in my arms, but if I get a tight wrap with my left hand and do a little finger hook my accuracy goes way up. I've been studying shooting continuously for almost a year now and I've never heard of anyone doing this, so I must be doing something wrong. I've been meaning to ask about this for a long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alma Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 It's really about pulling straight back on the trigger and not pulling too far through where you are bottom out the trigger on the frame. Imperfections in trigger pull are not as obviously when you are shooting slowly but when you speed up its easy to get sloppy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just4FunLP Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 It's really about pulling straight back on the trigger and not pulling too far through where you are bottom out the trigger on the frame. Imperfections in trigger pull are not as obviously when you are shooting slowly but when you speed up its easy to get sloppy. That leads to another question. I put a Springer Precision trigger kit in my XDM and there wasn't much info out there in where to adjust the trigger stop. It's setup to stop as soon as the trigger releases. Do I need to add more free travel? It's an expensive part and I've already had to add material once because I messed up the adjustment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZackJones Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 If you can video tape yourself shooting. Do this in practice so you can set the camera up to get the best shot. I did this and discovered when I'm trying to shoot fast with my M&P's my finger was coming completely off of the trigger between trigger presses. I know slapping the trigger may be okay for super up close stuff but it's not a habit I want to develop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mgardner Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Could be pushing the gun hard back on target and driving it low for the second shot. You need to have an aggressive enough stance and grip so that as the gun recoils it will naturally come back to target by itself as your body rocks forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alma Posted May 22, 2014 Share Posted May 22, 2014 It's really about pulling straight back on the trigger and not pulling too far through where you are bottom out the trigger on the frame. Imperfections in trigger pull are not as obviously when you are shooting slowly but when you speed up its easy to get sloppy. That leads to another question. I put a Springer Precision trigger kit in my XDM and there wasn't much info out there in where to adjust the trigger stop. It's setup to stop as soon as the trigger releases. Do I need to add more free travel? It's an expensive part and I've already had to add material once because I messed up the adjustment. Some like to have a little bit of pull through with their overtravel settings to avoid this. It is just something you have to try to see what works best for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle7735 Posted May 22, 2014 Share Posted May 22, 2014 These two videos were two of the biggest helps for me when i was first trying to get bill drills and multiple shot strings consistent. The way Mr. Avery breaks down the finishing flat of the trigger press was the lightbulb that let me figure this stuff out.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Azb3q8wOrV4https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_h9rKDEXPvM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bountyhunter Posted May 22, 2014 Share Posted May 22, 2014 (edited) Put a red dot sight on the gun and you'll be shocked at how much the dot jumps when you pull the trigger. At least I was. Edited May 22, 2014 by bountyhunter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alma Posted May 22, 2014 Share Posted May 22, 2014 Put a red dot sight on the gun and you'll be shocked at how much the dot jumps when you pull the trigger. At least I was. Good point. That makes it much easier to spot the dip. Just point your strong hand right now as if you were holding a gun and Make a motion like you are quickly pulling a trigger. Chances are that your hand will dip towards the end of the pull. It's only natural but you have to learn to isolate the trigger pull motion from moving the rest of your hand/arm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lppd4 Posted May 22, 2014 Share Posted May 22, 2014 I put dummy rounds in my gun or in the gun of someone I'm trying to help, they will let you know immediately if you are anticipating recoil. My bet is that you are. I'm also guessing you are right handed, low left a sure sign of anticipation from a right handed shooter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just4FunLP Posted May 22, 2014 Share Posted May 22, 2014 Kyle7735. Great vids. Cant wait to try this on Saturday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeerBaron Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 I thought it was in this thread but it must be somewhere else. Someone mentioned that the trigger pull is basically the "eraser" on your gun. No matter how good your stance, grip, sight picture and aim is if you jerk the trigger it erases all those other things you are doing right. It's the one thing you absolutely MUST have to be able to consistently put your shots in the right place. I thought that was a very apt analogy. low left (for a right hander) is most often trigger jerk and it most often shows up when trying to shoot faster. it can be hard to cure. Dry fire is a good start. The drill with dummy rounds in your mag will help show up a problem. Make sure you don't have your trigger finger in there too deep either. you want to be using basically the first pad on your finger. no deeper than that. it's all about gaining that nice smooth, consistent trigger pull. it just takes practice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemike22 Posted May 24, 2014 Share Posted May 24, 2014 Thanks for starting the topic. I'll be trying the triggerstripe drill next. I am experiencing a little of the same issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toyotafrank Posted May 25, 2014 Author Share Posted May 25, 2014 well guys this posting has helped a ton! The line target, changing the grip and trigger position have made my shooting more "center". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toothandnail Posted May 25, 2014 Share Posted May 25, 2014 OP your not the only one, I've been trying to speed up my double taps, 2 shots as fast as I can pull the trigger, and am seeing the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toyotafrank Posted May 25, 2014 Author Share Posted May 25, 2014 wanted to add, i changed my reload to a different powder and that has helped as well. Was shooting red dot (made power factor 135 ish) and went back to autocomp (135 ish).... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pengsun69 Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 Me too really having the same problem, the range officer told me not to hook my index finger very much it's just the tip of it, but when I started to shoot, at first yeah well its ok, but then the third will go off the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jshuberg Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 Try working on establishing a separation of concerns of the hands. Your support hand is in charge of holding, aiming, and moving the pistol. Your weapon hand is responsible for only one task, operating the trigger. If you are leading the weapon with your weapon hand, you have a greater tendency towards low left as you increase speed. You'll also have the tendency to miss left when transitioning from right to left, but not when transitioning from left to right. If you can isolate your trigger squeeze, and establish a proper separation of concerns, these problems will disappear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just4FunLP Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 Try working on establishing a separation of concerns of the hands. Your support hand is in charge of holding, aiming, and moving the pistol. Your weapon hand is responsible for only one task, operating the trigger. If you are leading the weapon with your weapon hand, you have a greater tendency towards low left as you increase speed. You'll also have the tendency to miss left when transitioning from right to left, but not when transitioning from left to right. If you can isolate your trigger squeeze, and establish a proper separation of concerns, these problems will disappear. This is very well said. I'm becoming aware of this, but now that I see it in writing it helps a lot. I think when my left hand has a good firm wrap and is controlling the direction of the gun more, I seem to do better. It's hard for me to describe, or repeat. You know it may sound strange, but Ive been practicing hard for about 9 months and have been making improvements, but find that at the end of each drill I often seem to miss what just happened. I should be learning from every run, but it just doesn't seem to be happening. Sometimes I have an awesome run (awesome for me that is) and I can just feel it all come together. But afterwards it's hard to consentrate on what it was that made it great. I think part of the problem is I don't have the vocabulary to put these things into words. I work with a lot of very smart people in a high tech manufacturing facility and have found that almost any problem can be solved, but it must be identified and well defined. For a long time now I've been setting up short field courses using about 6 targets, 3 stacks of barrels, and a couple of 6" square paper targets to simulate steel. I practice running and gunning about 50% of my 500 round weekly sessions. It's a lot of fun. This has made tremendous improvements in my match performance, but at the end of each run it's impossible to remember what went right and what went wrong. Today I decided to spend time doing very short drills and immediately stopping after each one and try to say out loud exactly what happened. It's a little difficult because I've never tried to put it into words. Does anyone know if there is a dictionary for pistol shooting techniques? I also like the video above. Particularly the part where he describes using the forearm muscles on your strong hand to add a little back tension. It seemed to make a difference while I was standing there, but was hard to implement while running around. I'll definitely try it some more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pengsun69 Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 Thanks a lot Jshuberg for sharing, it is a big help for me. best regards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Matzka Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 (edited) Ive been practicing hard for about 9 months and have been making improvements, but find that at the end of each drill I often seem to miss what just happened. Try video-recording yourself. Either have a shooting partner record you, or camera on a tripod, or a hat-cam/icam recorder. Video can be a valuable tool. Edited May 27, 2014 by Jeff Matzka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted May 27, 2014 Share Posted May 27, 2014 Adjust the sights so the "shooting fast" group is centered and shoot fast all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now