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Prepped .223 brass drops into JP case gauge--but sticks in chamber


Kasteel

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Is the head flush with the top step of the gauge or the bottom step? Or is it in between? For my rifle, if it was flush with the top step, brass was hard to eject. I had to dial the sizer die down just a little further to get the head in between the steps and then it was smooth as silk to extract the rounds.

So as far the gauge goes, a flush seat must be the extreme outermost limit that is likely to chamber.

Kasteel,

Perhaps trimming ing the the gauge down a few of thousandths would make a flush seat a "go" for you and save your eyes?

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If the exact reamer that made your chamber is *not* the exact same reamer that made your gauge, you cant fault the gauge. Gauges are simply a tool.

+1 JP case gauge represents JP chamber only. Make work for others, my not. My reloads worked great in my Sig 556 but would stick in my JP. Adjusted Dillon dies down until cam over & bought JP gauge. Problem solved.

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Very simple fix, buy a Hornady Cartridge Case Headspace Gauge.

1. You only need to buy one gauge for all calibers.

2. you measure a fired case and bump the shoulder back .001 to .002 on bolt actions and .003 to .004 on semi automatics.

gauge002_zpsc597686b.jpg

I now use my Wilson cases gauges for paper weights and pen holders.

penholder_zps6580345c.jpg

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Very simple fix, buy a Hornady Cartridge Case Headspace Gauge.

I just started loading 223 and got the Hornady Headspace gauge based on advice from searches here.

I bump the shoulder back about .004" to .005" and the Dillon die doesn't even come close to touching the shellplate (1050). All rounds case gauge in my JP case gauge and no issues when shooting the ammo (JP-15's).

You might give the Hornady a try.

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Actually, now that I think about it, the Hornady Headspace gauge appears only to measure the bump back on the shoulder--and tells you nothing about whether the base of the cartridge case has been resized down to dimensions sufficient to allow the case to chamber.

If you are processing brass that has been fired through an unknown gun, and may be subsequently fired in someone else's gun, the Hornady won't tell you whether the cartridge will chamber.

Or am I missing something?

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I use the RCBS Mic (also have the Hornady but prefer the RCBS) to set the shoulder. I use the JP and Dillon and EGW gauges as chamber checks for finished rounds.

When I have had problems with cases sticking in the rifle it has always been the shoulder. Rarely (as in never) has the problem with the body.

If you ever go into reloading for bolt rifles, to conserve cases, people first just size the neck. When it becomes harder to chamber you resize the neck and bump the shoulder. When it becomes harder again you full length resize the case (neck, shoulder and body). The body is one of the last things that will prevent chambering.

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I use the RCBS Mic (also have the Hornady but prefer the RCBS) to set the shoulder. I use the JP and Dillon and EGW gauges as chamber checks for finished rounds.

When I have had problems with cases sticking in the rifle it has always been the shoulder. Rarely (as in never) has the problem with the body.

If you ever go into reloading for bolt rifles, to conserve cases, people first just size the neck. When it becomes harder to chamber you resize the neck and bump the shoulder. When it becomes harder again you full length resize the case (neck, shoulder and body). The body is one of the last things that will prevent chambering.

+1...just cam over and be done with it.
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If the exact reamer that made your chamber is *not* the exact same reamer that made your gauge, you cant fault the gauge. Gauges are simply a tool.

+1 JP case gauge represents JP chamber only. Make work for others, my not. My reloads worked great in my Sig 556 but would stick in my JP. Adjusted Dillon dies down until cam over & bought JP gauge. Problem solved.

Here is the problem with your observation:

I'm guessing your Sig uses as 5.56 NATO chamber. The JP Chamber Guage is cut to tighter specs using a .223 Wylde chamber reamer. From the instruction sheet on the JP Gauge:

"This gauge is cut with a .223 Wylde chamber finishing reamer, and will give a reliable check of ammunition used in rifles chambered for either the .223 Remington SAAMI specifications or the 5.56 NATO specification."

The instructions continue:

"If your ammunition is just slightly out of spec, it may go into battery with the forward kinetic energy of the bolt and carrier, but once wedged in the chamber, it may not allow for extraction of the unfired cartridge when un- loading is necessary."

This was EXACTLY my problem. I figured the JP gauge would help me get my die adjustments correct and then to perform periodic quality checks. Again, looking back at the instructions:

"If your ammunition fits flush in this case gauge, it will go into battery and extract when necessary in ANY rifle." (Emphasis added.)

There's my issue: my cases were fitting flush in the chamber, but sticking in BOTH Wylde chambered guns AND 5.56 NATO chambered guns. Thus: either I'm readin my gauge incorrectly, i.e., not seeing that a case head is not quite flush with the bottom step of the gauge OR the gauge is out of spec. Notwithstanding Religious Shooter and Slowhand's opinions to the contrary, the chamber of the guns is highly unlikely to be the issue.

I'm betting I'm not looking at my gauge carefully enough. In that case, MainlineSteve's suggestion that " Perhaps trimming the the gauge down a few of thousandths would make a flush seat a "go" for you and save your eyes," would be the daily stroke of brilliance. Thanks Steve! Until then, I'll just take out the firing pin from a gun and dry cycle some rounds periodically.

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BTW: My magic marker test agrees with Religious Shooter: the shoulder needed bumped back just a SMIDGE.

Outerlimits is right as well: setting the press to cam over did the job.

Perhaps of interest: following Dillon's instruction to adjust the sizing die down (without a case) to lightly touch the shellplate was a no-go. Adjusting the die (again without a case) down an extra 1/4 or 1/2 turn seemed to cause an uncomfortable amount of "flex" in the shellplate. So, I adjusted the die incrementally until the die just lightly touched the shellplate with a case under it. At that point, the lever just barely cams over and did not create any perceptible flex in the shellplate.

Just a bit of thread drift, but hopefully useful to someone.

Back on the original subject: I'll re-check my reading of the gauge. Again.

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I agree with JJ's statement and have found that on my XL650 which is where I FL size and Trim my rifle brass a slight overcam is required to get the correct setback for my.223 Wylde chambers AR (I have confirmed with a Horandy comparator, EGW and Dillon case gauge).

Edited by Boxerglocker
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Yup, cam over is required to get my brass to fit in between the steps on the JP gauge. If I don't size to fit between the steps at least, or flush with the bottom step, then brass is hard to extract from my JP rifle. I've talked to a couple of very experienced reloaders and 3-gun shooters who have indicated the same. Some have taken a little off the base of the die to get sufficient shoulder bump without camming over. Some, loading on a single stage, have taken some off the shell holder to accomplish the same. I live with slight cam over.

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Ok. The entire genesis of this thread is simple user error on my part. No defective JP Chamber Gauge. No strangely tight chamber. Just me not knowing what to look for.

So, in my painful experience, sizing a case to fit BETWEEN the steps of the JP Gauge is insufficient to ensure positive chambering AND easy extraction of an un-fired cartridge.

Here are some before and after pictures of what to look for with regard to your gauge. Hopefully this will save someone some time and trouble.post-17675-0-47721200-1375977096_thumb.j

post-17675-0-60087300-1375977080_thumb.j

The first pic is of a case sized with the Dillon die adjusted to lightly touch the shellplate without a case in the die. This case would chamber if the bolt was allowed to go forward with some force, but not if one were to "ride" the bolt forward. Extraction was very difficult and required "mortaring" with quite a bit of force.

The second pic is of the same case after sizing with the Dillon die adjusted another full HALF turn down past touching the shellplate. Chambering and extraction from Wylde or 5.56 NATO chamber was smooth and easy.

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It's tough to see the detail real well in the pictures--and yes, I was surprised at how a "go" looks as opposed to a "no go" but when I only sized the case enough to fit between the steps, it was a bear to extract. Chambering wasn't difficult using the preferred method of just letting the bolt to forward under the force from the buffer spring. In effect, the forward motion into the chamber was accomplishing the last couple thousandths of shoulder bump. But let me reiterate: the case was very difficult to extract from both the Wylde chamber AND from the looser NATO chamber. I'll try a different BCG in the NATO chambered gun tonight just to see if there's a difference.

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I'm surprised the "before" case was hard to chamber/extract. The "after" case looks like you might have gone just a little too far. But, maybe it's hard to tell from the picture?

I am too. The after looks like its slightly below flush of the slot.

I dropped some new factory XM 193 and Federal Gold match into the JP case gauge to get a reference on how the headstamp should look. They look like the before picture as do my reloads. I checked my press and my dillon die is probably ~.025" from touching the shellplate.

All that matters is that it works in your rifles, though. Glad you figured it out.

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As to the pictures: look more at the forward edge of the case head in the gauge than the rear. Looking at the rear of the case head looks like the case is slightly below flush. The view of the front of the case head is more representative. The light is a bit harsh on my table.

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