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Shooting with better shooters...


astephenson

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I heard it yrs ago that if you hang with a certain skill level crowd you will rise no higher than the crowd, which is fine ifthat is your thing, butf orthose who want to excell to the maximum oftheir abilities??? need to look beyond the comfort zone/squad

Recently I heard a similar concept explained as, "You are the average of the five people you hang around with most."

Interesting to ponder that, for both shooting and non-shooting aspects of life.

This is troubling :surprise:

lmao :blink:

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  • 2 weeks later...
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  • 2 months later...
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Shooting with better shooters has helped me understand the game, learn how to shoot stages and plan reloads, and gain confidence with my gear. Most have been very patient and willing to help new shooters do better.

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"Shoot slow and do evertthing else fast"

Where did I hear that? It was from a GM, so I kow it must be true.

Yeah, it worked out that way.

If you don't think so, try it the other way around and ket me know how it works for you.

biggrin.gif

First time I've heard it put that way. Wise words.

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  • 5 months later...

I only ever shoot with better shooters and compete with better shooters, it is the only way to go because you also tend to push yourself and actually shoot a lot better. You also tend to shoot in the present as you are not worrying about your results.

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I plan on trying to squad myself with at least one of the top shooters at this weekends match (only my second match). I found that my shooting is fast but I need to work a little on movement and a lot on stage breakdown. I hope to watch and pick their brains a little on both subjects.

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  • 3 weeks later...

I may just be blessed to live by cool people but it seems like the better the shooter the nicer the shooter. The higher end shooters are usually very helpful and I always try to squad with them. To be honest though, I've often wondered if they were just tired of having to wait for slower shooters.

That being said, I was squaded with significantly better open and limited shooters at a major match last year and I ended up tring to shoot the match at their pace. Of course I shot too fast for my ability and ended the match with 6 misses. If I would have spent a whole additional second per miss I would have been more competitive in my class and division (L10).

I think the best advice to give anyone is shoot slow , do everything else fast and listen to others. It's very annoying to try and help someone out only to get excuses as to why they can't follow the suggestion.

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Time spent watching other shooters is time spent not visualizing the stage and getting ready to shoot. When you ask a Super Squad shooter how much they visualize a stage prior to shoting it the answer will be: " continually until it's my turn to shoot". After you shoot a stage, by all means watch better shooters who shoot your same division but before it's your turn to shoot - never.

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  • 2 months later...

Only if they shoot your division. I've seen lots of new Production shooters try to copy what they see Master class open shooters doing with disastrous results. Even within your own division it can be bad if you try to copy what you see right there during the match. Take good notes or video their runs, talk with them and then during your training sessions try to figure out how to do what you've seen them do. Matches are not the time to experiment or try new things. This is the time to let your subconscious takeover and just shoot ....

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I had the luxury to shoot with a GM at a match once, although he was shooting open and I was shooting production. I asked him if I could tape his run, he allowed me to and when I finished I took his video and put it side by side with mine on the computer. I learned so much by watching his run compared to mine. Shooting with better shooters will make you better as long as you have the fundamentals in place. Being fast and sloppy doesn't help your ability.

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Train with better shooters.

At matches it depends... If you really want to beat the better shooters and you have the skill, don't squad with them or don't pay any attention to their run. If they are way beyond your current skill set or you don't care about beating them, heck yeah!

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I recently started to shoot with a new group of friends, as the many of my previous crew have moved on to other sports. The new gang nearly all shoot in my division (Production) and we are all fairly close in ability and classification.

I see this as a potentially very good change. My old friends actually all shot higher capacity divisions, especially Open, and were Master Class level. I would often be the only Production shooter in the group, and much of the time time finished tail end Charlie in time/points/HF. My stage breakdown was always different, given the ten round capacity limit, the differences in the platform, and my own ability. It was hard to judge progress because I didn't have useable benchmarks. My friends would offer advice, but sometimes what works for Open/Limited doesn't translate well to Production. There was also the insidious expectation of finishing well behind the others that started to affect how much I thought I could improve my shooting.

With my current squadmates we pick each other's brains, suggest and try different things/techniques, and, being in the same Division, it seems more pertinent. There is also a bit more friendly competition, again because we're in the same Division at the same level, all looking to improve.

So, strictly from the perspective of improving one's own shooting, shooting with the right group of shooters may be as important as shooting with better shooters.

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  • 1 month later...

Regarding doing things with those better than you, it's not the association that automatically makes you better, but the expectation you place on yourself of what you should do or can do. That expectation may change as you hang with the better folks. (IMHO based on many things outside of shooting)

That's probably why the good folks don't slow down when with others, they are playing to their expectation of what they should do, not the average of the group they are with that day.

So why work with those at a level below yourself - once you have mastery at any level? The sharing and teaching actually make you even stronger as now you have to not only understand why you do what you do, but be able to explain it so others can understand. (Again, IMHO -- for USPSA I'm very much on the learning / improving end right now :-)

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  • 2 months later...

As a newer shooter, I have met some master level shooters at matches. They have been more than helpful with tips and are very responsive to my questions. I hope to do the same if I ever get better……...

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