beltjones

Powerfactor is a bad approximation of kinetic energy. A 200gr bullet traveling at 850 fps makes 170 PF at 435 Joules. A 180gr bullet traveling at 944.44fps also makes 170PF, but at 483 Joules. To equalize the kinetic energy, the 180gr bullet would have to travel at 896 fps, making only 161 PF.

On threads like these it's very difficult to get a good idea of quality because a lot of people will post in support just to justify their purchase decision in their own minds, and others will post their bad experiences as a form of catharsis. The best way is to look at who's using what to win championships, who is taking what to nationals, and how well things sell here on the classifieds. If no one has won nationals with a certain builder, the builder also doesn't show well in the nationals equipment survey, and guns sit for a while before selling on the classifieds, that's all you need to know.

Before CZ they were owned by the guy who now does Fusion Firearms. I would stay way, way away from that guy.

How heavy are your bullets?

Bare lead bullets or coated? I use E3 a lot and have never had an issue like you're describing. I'm guessing it's fouling from the lead bullets that you're seeing.

How it "sounds to you" is irrelevant. The rest of your post is a conclusion based on your own confusion.

That was pretty good, except that nils guy is somewhat competitive in SS too. And Ben isn't too shabby in production Man, you guys really know how to step on a joke. Obviously I left out a bunch of awesome shooters, but that's because it was meant to be humorous. In other news, a chicken didn't actually cross the road.

Open: People who like getting beaten by Max. Production: People who like getting beaten by Eric. SS: People who like getting beaten by Robbie. Revolver: People who like getting beaten by Jerry. Limited 10: People who like to win meaningless trophies. Limited: People who like getting beaten by Nils, Blake, Manny, Bob, or Travis. It's the most democratic division.

Who are the nine people who think it's acceptable? That's what I want to know...

Are you guys just going to ignore that Troy, uh, I mean Mara already weighed in on this one with the correct answer?

The Uplula can certainly dent the casings, but those dents come from really smashing rounds (usually w/ an uplula) into an STI mag tube. The "ridges" inside the tube cause the dents.

You make some good point, but I don't think i'm missing the point at all. I don't need to wait until demand is overwhelming. I'm ready to accomodate even a minimal demand *right now* at my local events. So far I have seen no evidence that it's worth the trouble for folks who aren't actually interested in shooting this division to get behind it. However, if someone started recognizing this division locally and got some participation, or got folks to show up for a PO-only match, I could change my mind. Certainly there are a handful of optics shooters at the glocks-only matches, but I'm not yet convinced that handgun optics are nearing a tipping point. As MD of a weekly steel match I brief and orient alot of new shooters and answer alot of questions about what guns are appropriate vs what people have. I just haven't seen PO-style guns as even being a blip on the radar. I admit that my limited experience with AR optics (one tactical shoot with some LE guys I was training for something else) opened my eyes to that aspect of shooting, but I think that the percentage of AR's with optics totally dwarfs the percentage of handguns with optics. I also work for an agency with 300 sworn officers, and while AR optics are standard now, we haven't even started discussing handgun optics, or really had a significant number of requests. fwiw, I totally agree that revolver is a silly division to recognize outside of specialty/novelty/classic matches. I would also combine singlestack and L10. Ok, I take back that you're missing the point. You're not. It's just that we're having a "chicken or the egg" discussion now. I think if USPSA envisions that it will one day have some kind of duty / carry optics division, then it would be wise to start shaping it now. It sounds like you would prefer to wait until there is some kind of "tipping point" where the prevalence of such guns is sufficient to support the division. I totally get the logic, and I don't disagree with it. Maybe fielding a production optics division at Nationals is way too premature, but I would still like to see USPSA start reaching out to potential sponsors with the message, "Your company is a leader in this technology, we are interested in promoting it through our national shooting sport, how can we work together? What would you like to see if we created a division? What other companies should we partner with?" So it's not that the conclusion is that PO is needed, it's that we have a hypothesis that a PO division will one day be popular, and that sponsors will want to support it. If we get some data that the hypothesis is incorrect we either course-correct or scrap the idea entirely. Either way it's a way to grow visibility of the sport among new potential sponsors and create goodwill in doing so.

it hasn't happened yet, but it will be interesting to see if all 15 of you start shooting IDPA regularly and all show up to the same match. We've been discussing this for months, and so far I've seen 1 (one) gun that might qualify for prod optics show up to our weekly steel match. I need to see more interest than that before I can support watering down the existing divisions any further. I don't think I would shoot Production Optics, but I think you're missing the point. The point isn't to wait until the demand is sufficiently large that we are practically forced to create the division, the point is to lead the way if that's where the industry is going. If carry / duty guns with optics are really going to become a major trend of the future (and I think they are if the AR-15 market is any indication), then maybe it makes sense to create the division, connect with potential sponsors, market the sport to new shooters who are interested in these types of pistols, and grow the sport. The potential sponsors of USPSA seem like they are getting smaller and smaller, with even the sponsor-friendly Production division catering mostly to "boutique," custom pistols. This would be a way to "double down" with old sponsors (Glock, S&W, etc) and new (Trijicon, Aimpoint, etc). Or not. Let's worry about "watering down divisions" while we continue to recognize Revolver even though less than 10 people show up with one at even big area matches.

No more mag pouches for me if thats the case Let me know how that works out for you.

It says rear pocket, which are known as "hip pockets" in many places. I take "rear" to mean behind the hip bone line.