Jump to content
Brian Enos's Forums... Maku mozo!

Old Time IPSC shooters


tightloop

Recommended Posts

I would have to say Ray Neal and Nick Pruitt. Both shot at our home club here in the Coachella Valley. Back then it was Desert Sportsman, now it is Palm Springs Gun Club.

Both were fast, but Ray was a friend of the family and gave me some of my first tips. Don't know how y'all shot so well with that Weaver push-pull technique but you did. :bow:

Being the son of a friendly Father and capable shooter I met the likes of Tim LaFrance and Armand Swenson. LaFrance was just a master gunsmith. I don't know what he is doing now but he did great work.

I thought Tim was going to shoot my dad once when the old man was teasing him with a large snake found on the range at Rainbow. The look on Tims face I will never forget!

TL, on the note of equipment, I would have thought that the cross-draw would have taken over :rolleyes: I do remember a time when that was the ticket with the faster shooters. I even remember seeing people shooting Jackass rigs in competition. ROs just made you start at a 45 degree angle to the LOF.

I started with an IWB Gordon Davis, with mags in my pockets. Amazing how things evolve. :)

One of my good buds shot Xdraw for a long time, 78 - about 81 but dropped his pistol at the 81 Natls using a Xdraw and was DQed...they were nice enough to let him shoot for no score,but that cured him....do you remember Tom Campbells sternum holster..sort of a cross draw but up high..

and when Weaver was the only way to go, and Cooper, Chapman and Fowler and Seyfried were using it...well...you did too...

The few times I saw Nick Pruitt, he was amazing...IIRC he did not aim at the 5 or 7 yd targets, used his natural index..and was uber fast that way...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 106
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Several years ago I had a conversation with Richard at the range Chip used to lease out the months before the Steel Challenge to practice.. some of Chips steel is probably even still there. Anyway, he said that Chip figured out he didn't have to look at his holster (which everybody was doing) when he drew if he ran his thumb down his shirt on the way to it (surrender draw for Steel Challenge). I think he eventually even dropped the thumb thing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Several years ago I had a conversation with Richard at the range Chip used to lease out the months before the Steel Challenge to practice.. some of Chips steel is probably even still there. Anyway, he said that Chip figured out he didn't have to look at his holster (which everybody was doing) when he drew if he ran his thumb down his shirt on the way to it (surrender draw for Steel Challenge). I think he eventually even dropped the thumb thing.

Yeah, we finally worked thru all that gimmicky stuff...if you position the holster in the same spot and make the same move a 100k times you don't need to look for the pistol. The sport was so new that when John Shaw (IIRC) started looking at his pistol prior to the buzz, we all thought there MUST be something magical about it, cause the 80 Natl Champ is doing it...well, took some of us longer to give it up than others, just like the cross draw, but we finally did give it up. However there are some little tricks that we picked up by watching the Top Guys shoot that really helped....like using just your thumb and index finger to lift if off the table, the fastest way to move the pistol from SHO to WHO (don't think that is done anymore though), little goodies like that made some difference.

How about you Shred, fastest you have ever seen....holster to first shot.

Edited by tightloop
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Since he has already been mentioned in this topic, I will say that I just watched a clip of Miami Vice with Jim Zubiena doing the Mozambique on the guy...only the clip I watched on from the PACT web site and they timed the sequence....Jim might have only won the Southwest Pistol League once (IIRC) but drawqing from concealment with latex gloves on and doing a 2+1 in 1.38 sec is pretty fast....shows him breaking the first shot in .85 and the first split is .22...not bad for an Old Timer :D

Edited by tightloop
Link to comment
Share on other sites

How about you Shred, fastest you have ever seen....holster to first shot.

I've seen a couple guys hit in the .6's fairly consistently on the draw on big close targets like the 18x24 gong at 7 yards on Smoke & Hope and Ted Bonnet was consistently quick out of that beater Hellweg but the quickest guy I ever saw in person was old Cal Erlich with the Cowboy Fast Draw action. Not an IPSC draw, but he's hitting plates and balloons with wax bullets and draws down in the .208 range from almost-but-not-quite-touching the gun. Not only that but he could call his draws to within a few thousandths of a second "this here technique is good down to about a quarter second... <bang> .248 <bang> .249" I always heard Ernie Hill was the guy to beat there, but never saw him shoot.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would have to say Ray Neal and Nick Pruitt. Both shot at our home club here in the Coachella Valley. Back then it was Desert Sportsman, now it is Palm Springs Gun Club.

Both were fast, but Ray was a friend of the family and gave me some of my first tips. Don't know how y'all shot so well with that Weaver push-pull technique but you did. :bow:

Being the son of a friendly Father and capable shooter I met the likes of Tim LaFrance and Armand Swenson. LaFrance was just a master gunsmith. I don't know what he is doing now but he did great work.

I thought Tim was going to shoot my dad once when the old man was teasing him with a large snake found on the range at Rainbow. The look on Tims face I will never forget!

TL, on the note of equipment, I would have thought that the cross-draw would have taken over :rolleyes: I do remember a time when that was the ticket with the faster shooters. I even remember seeing people shooting Jackass rigs in competition. ROs just made you start at a 45 degree angle to the LOF.

I started with an IWB Gordon Davis, with mags in my pockets. Amazing how things evolve. :)

In the pre-IPSC/Columbia Conference days (1975 and early 1976) Ray would occassionally shoot with us at the Oceanside Combat Pistol League (kind of an offshoot of the SWPL). Our club was run by Bill Hahn who went on to be one of the founders of Cowboy Action Shooting along with Harper Creigh and Gordon Davis. We shot everything on hanging steel plates and occassionally a balloon stuck into a cardboard silhouette that Bill had drawn a cartoon bad-guy out of (he was quite an artist). Nick was just a kid then but moved alittle like I'd imagine "Winged Mercury" did. Ray IIRC was a construction worker, or at least had forearms bigger than my thighs (I was in the Marine Corps then and my thighs weren't particularly small at the time). I remember distinctly the first time that I saw Ray shoot. By that time most of us were shooting 1911 guns--Ray shot a long barreled, nickle plated Model 29 with full house magnum loads out of a shoulder holster!! With his massive forearms he looked like he could squeeze the sap out of the wooden grips--when those "big bangers" went off there was alot of noise but very little movement! He kicked our collective asses with it as long as he didn't have to reload more than twice in a string of fire. That was a great group of shooters--no one was terribly serious about being #1--just wanted to shoot up to our own potential. Jerry Usher shot with that club also--Gordon Davis named his cross draw after him--anyone remember the "Usher International?" Jerry represented the US in the world shoot with Raul Walters, Ray Chapman and that crowd.

You mentioned Swenson--at the time he lived in Fallbrook, just outside the back gate of the Naval Weapons yard which was contiguous with Camp Pendleton. He had a beautiful house and IIRC primarily worked out of his garage. I went to visit him a couple of times. He called everybody "Laddy" in a sort of Scottish brogue. We were standing in his kitchen talking about something and he said, "I want to show you something, Laddy--now where did I put that???" He started opening up the kitchen cabinets and looking for something. Up with the dishes he found a wooden box, took it down and said, "Here it is, I built this for my wife." He opened it up and took out a .45 that was classic Swenson--squared trigger guard, ambi-safety, checkered, stippled top of the slide, S&W K-frame sights and A VENTILATED RIB!! He had put a vent. rib on this .45 for his wife--it was the most remarkable pistol that I had ever seen up to that time. We went out into his shop/garage and there were literally boxes of customer's pistols stacked from floor to ceiling lining three of the walls. That was probably in mid 76' and I doubt that he could have done the work on all of those by the time he passed. If he liked you though, he was incredibly gracious and got your work done quickly.

Thanks for letting my vent some OLD memories.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Shred

I never got the chance to see Cal shoot in person, but the videos of him even now are something to see, so are the ones of Bob Munden. As you say, not IPSC style draws but fast as hell anyway...

Early IPSC'er

Hadn't thought of Jerry Usher for a long time, but he was one of the original point shooters, IIRC, and shot from a kind of crouch. Maybe that rubbed off on Nick as well...Jerry was a very gracious guy and always ready to help a fellow shooter,

Ray Chapman was a big guy, with huge forearms like you say. No wonder he had no problem with recoil from the little 45ACP...I remember in 99, I had driven up to an IDPA match one Sunday to be shot at the Hill Country Pistol Club outside Bee Caves, and the newbie shooter that came with me must have asked a million questions about the old IPSC days as we drove to the match from Houston...Imagine my surprise when we get there and are unloading the truck when I see Ray walking across the range talking to Beverly McCord...could have knocked me over with a feather. The newbie noticed my distraction and asked me what was special about the big guy in the blue shirt...told him nothing except he is the 1975 World Pistol Champ and close friend of Jeff Cooper...Had a great time chatting with Ray after that match...think that was the last time I saw him in person but talked to him on the phone a few times after that...Man did he have some stories...talk about the OLD DAYS, how about the FIRST DAYS with Jack Weaver and those guys. You bring up another name from the past that was a very fast shooter in his own right, Raul Walters..watched him at the 80 Natls shooting the mover....due to equipment malfunction he had to shoot it 4 times...Raul was so tightly wound that he got worse each time he shot it....that one stage knocked him out of the shootoff...

Another guy who had one big splash was Kirk Kirkham..won the 78 Natl title...then kind of dropped off the radar...I see in some of BE's old pics that he shot with the Brian and TGO and that group, but I don't remember shooting with him at all...and don't remember him in the sport after he won in 78...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Shred

I never got the chance to see Cal shoot in person, but the videos of him even now are something to see, so are the ones of Bob Munden. As you say, not IPSC style draws but fast as hell anyway...

Early IPSC'er

Hadn't thought of Jerry Usher for a long time, but he was one of the original point shooters, IIRC, and shot from a kind of crouch. Maybe that rubbed off on Nick as well...Jerry was a very gracious guy and always ready to help a fellow shooter,

Ray Chapman was a big guy, with huge forearms like you say. No wonder he had no problem with recoil from the little 45ACP...I remember in 99, I had driven up to an IDPA match one Sunday to be shot at the Hill Country Pistol Club outside Bee Caves, and the newbie shooter that came with me must have asked a million questions about the old IPSC days as we drove to the match from Houston...Imagine my surprise when we get there and are unloading the truck when I see Ray walking across the range talking to Beverly McCord...could have knocked me over with a feather. The newbie noticed my distraction and asked me what was special about the big guy in the blue shirt...told him nothing except he is the 1975 World Pistol Champ and close friend of Jeff Cooper...Had a great time chatting with Ray after that match...think that was the last time I saw him in person but talked to him on the phone a few times after that...Man did he have some stories...talk about the OLD DAYS, how about the FIRST DAYS with Jack Weaver and those guys. You bring up another name from the past that was a very fast shooter in his own right, Raul Walters..watched him at the 80 Natls shooting the mover....due to equipment malfunction he had to shoot it 4 times...Raul was so tightly wound that he got worse each time he shot it....that one stage knocked him out of the shootoff...

Another guy who had one big splash was Kirk Kirkham..won the 78 Natl title...then kind of dropped off the radar...I see in some of BE's old pics that he shot with the Brian and TGO and that group, but I don't remember shooting with him at all...and don't remember him in the sport after he won in 78...

It was Ray Neal that had the huge forearms, although Chapman was good sized. One week he stayed with my wife and I while he and I taught a local PD a class on auto pistol shooting. He brought along home movies of the early leather slap days--those were WAAAY cool. We talked him into showing them at the dinner held at one of the Indoor championships that we held a few years later--seeing him with a cowboy hat shooting a single action--and Cooper with a goatee (sp?) were funny. Wish you hadn't mentioned Beverly--what a train wreck for his life that turned out to be. Never understood the bizarre nature of their relationship in later (Texas) life. I wonder if she has Ray's old film, guns, gear, etc.?

Kirk Kirkham commited suicide in about 80 or 81 IIRC. Jake Jatras in his newspaper reported it as "...he chose to exit at his own hand..." or something to that effect. Were you at the first Bianchi Cup, tightloop? Chapman didn't have the range quite ready and it had been raining like crazy and everything was "mushy." He had huge piles of bark-mulch to spred on to the pathways. I took three wheelbarrows of mulch down the barricade set up before we could even get into the little shooting boxes behind the barricades. I was on the first relay of the first day of the first Bianchi Cup Barricade stage, so I got to help spread mulch! When we got ready to start shooting I introduced myself to the other shooter--it was Kirk Kirkham--this was '79 and he had won the first National match held in Colorado in '77 -- I was intimidated as heck. He and I fired the first shots ever fired on the barricade event (his shots were considerably better than mine!) I have some interesting pics of that shoot. The mover wasn't working quite right and I got a picture of Leonard Knight sitting up on the brace-works trying to fix it. Also a pic of Ken Hackathorn shooting the barricade event from a contorted, crosslegged kneeling position (there weren't many rules, early on).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would have to say Ray Neal and Nick Pruitt. Both shot at our home club here in the Coachella Valley. Back then it was Desert Sportsman, now it is Palm Springs Gun Club.

Both were fast, but Ray was a friend of the family and gave me some of my first tips. Don't know how y'all shot so well with that Weaver push-pull technique but you did. :bow:

Being the son of a friendly Father and capable shooter I met the likes of Tim LaFrance and Armand Swenson. LaFrance was just a master gunsmith. I don't know what he is doing now but he did great work.

I thought Tim was going to shoot my dad once when the old man was teasing him with a large snake found on the range at Rainbow. The look on Tims face I will never forget!

TL, on the note of equipment, I would have thought that the cross-draw would have taken over :rolleyes: I do remember a time when that was the ticket with the faster shooters. I even remember seeing people shooting Jackass rigs in competition. ROs just made you start at a 45 degree angle to the LOF.

I started with an IWB Gordon Davis, with mags in my pockets. Amazing how things evolve. :)

In the pre-IPSC/Columbia Conference days (1975 and early 1976) Ray would occassionally shoot with us at the Oceanside Combat Pistol League (kind of an offshoot of the SWPL). Our club was run by Bill Hahn who went on to be one of the founders of Cowboy Action Shooting along with Harper Creigh and Gordon Davis. We shot everything on hanging steel plates and occassionally a balloon stuck into a cardboard silhouette that Bill had drawn a cartoon bad-guy out of (he was quite an artist). Nick was just a kid then but moved alittle like I'd imagine "Winged Mercury" did. Ray IIRC was a construction worker, or at least had forearms bigger than my thighs (I was in the Marine Corps then and my thighs weren't particularly small at the time). I remember distinctly the first time that I saw Ray shoot. By that time most of us were shooting 1911 guns--Ray shot a long barreled, nickle plated Model 29 with full house magnum loads out of a shoulder holster!! With his massive forearms he looked like he could squeeze the sap out of the wooden grips--when those "big bangers" went off there was alot of noise but very little movement! He kicked our collective asses with it as long as he didn't have to reload more than twice in a string of fire. That was a great group of shooters--no one was terribly serious about being #1--just wanted to shoot up to our own potential. Jerry Usher shot with that club also--Gordon Davis named his cross draw after him--anyone remember the "Usher International?" Jerry represented the US in the world shoot with Raul Walters, Ray Chapman and that crowd.

You mentioned Swenson--at the time he lived in Fallbrook, just outside the back gate of the Naval Weapons yard which was contiguous with Camp Pendleton. He had a beautiful house and IIRC primarily worked out of his garage. I went to visit him a couple of times. He called everybody "Laddy" in a sort of Scottish brogue. We were standing in his kitchen talking about something and he said, "I want to show you something, Laddy--now where did I put that???" He started opening up the kitchen cabinets and looking for something. Up with the dishes he found a wooden box, took it down and said, "Here it is, I built this for my wife." He opened it up and took out a .45 that was classic Swenson--squared trigger guard, ambi-safety, checkered, stippled top of the slide, S&W K-frame sights and A VENTILATED RIB!! He had put a vent. rib on this .45 for his wife--it was the most remarkable pistol that I had ever seen up to that time. We went out into his shop/garage and there were literally boxes of customer's pistols stacked from floor to ceiling lining three of the walls. That was probably in mid 76' and I doubt that he could have done the work on all of those by the time he passed. If he liked you though, he was incredibly gracious and got your work done quickly.

Thanks for letting my vent some OLD memories.

EarlyIPSCer, I was a range rat in the OCPL days. I was there when the old range flooded out and we moved over to Rainbow. I started shooting there at the shoots that Bill and Dorothy would put on.I remember that we would often go to the Hahns for sodas and food after a shoot and talk. Bill and Dorothy were great. Was talking to my Pop about this thread last night and asked him how he met Jerry Usher. He said that Jerry came by the shop( that would have been my Great-Great Gandfathers gunshop. He was a MasterGunsmith by the name of Carl Woodhouse)and was mentioning something about having shoots out at Lake Cahuilla. Dad had been on a rifle team in High School and in the Army and having three tours of combat in SEAsiathought that would be a good way to keep his survival skills sharp. That turned into more competition and meeting Ray, Nick, Nicks dad and brother(cant recall their names)here in the desert.

The only shooter I can remember from the OCPL range that wasn't from the desert was Seth Nadel. There were many back then but Seth for some odd reason comes to mind, oh and Danny Boches.

Yeah, bill was agreat artist. Wish I still had some of the club shirts that he would have made. Did you ever have to wear the "I Shoot Hostages" cowbell?

As to Ray Neal, he was a drywaller. He was very quiet but kind to us kids and my Mom liked him so he passed muster in our house.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

...

EarlyIPSCer, I was a range rat in the OCPL days. I was there when the old range flooded out and we moved over to Rainbow. I started shooting there at the shoots that Bill and Dorothy would put on.I remember that we would often go to the Hahns for sodas and food after a shoot and talk. Bill and Dorothy were great. Was talking to my Pop about this thread last night and asked him how he met Jerry Usher. He said that Jerry came by the shop( that would have been my Great-Great Gandfathers gunshop. He was a MasterGunsmith by the name of Carl Woodhouse)and was mentioning something about having shoots out at Lake Cahuilla. Dad had been on a rifle team in High School and in the Army and having three tours of combat in SEAsiathought that would be a good way to keep his survival skills sharp. That turned into more competition and meeting Ray, Nick, Nicks dad and brother(cant recall their names)here in the desert.

The only shooter I can remember from the OCPL range that wasn't from the desert was Seth Nadel. There were many back then but Seth for some odd reason comes to mind, oh and Danny Boches.

Yeah, bill was agreat artist. Wish I still had some of the club shirts that he would have made. Did you ever have to wear the "I Shoot Hostages" cowbell?

As to Ray Neal, he was a drywaller. He was very quiet but kind to us kids and my Mom liked him so he passed muster in our house.

JimmyZip, perhaps we've met. I moved from Oceanside back to Kansas City in early '77 which was prior to the OCPL move to Rainbow, but I did shoot there once on a visit. Bill and Dorothy were saints and serrogate parents to alot of us young Marine officers. After the matches we would always go to their house and sit up in Bill's studio and look at his incredible gun collection. The last time that I saw Bill was in the summer of 2002--my wife had just died of cancer and I wanted to go visit our old stomping grounds and see old friends. Dorothy was in the final stages of Alzheimers at the time and Bill was completely devoted to her. She had flooded their house and damaged alot of things and it was the saddest site that I think that I've ever seen--Bill was loving and compassionate with her in a way that was very inspiring. When Dorothy died, Bill did one of his cartoons of her playing the organ in heaven with halo--I still have it and will always cherise it. He encouraged me to get active in cowboy action shooting which I put off until about 2 years ago. By that time I had remarried and my wife and I both started shooting. When I saw Harper Creigh at the SHOT show a couple of years ago I asked how Bill was doing and was told that he had passed away--I haven't been able to find any info on him, what he died of or how he died. As devoted as he was to Dorothy, my guess is that he died of a broken heart.

As a matter of fact when I got to KC one of the first things that I did was make a cowbell with the "I shoot hostages" on it--actually took it to a match the other day for grins. I still have one of the tee shirts of the "Bull-istic Pendalum" it's priceless!

I've stayed in touch with Seth Nadel--he lives up in the Sholow, AZ area--stopped and had lunch with he and his wife a couple of years ago--he seems to be doing well. It was quite a joke when he and Linda got married since she was an ATF agent at the time.

Thanks for your response Jimmy.

Edited by Early IPSC'er
Link to comment
Share on other sites

How about you Shred, fastest you have ever seen....holster to first shot.

I've seen a couple guys hit in the .6's fairly consistently on the draw on big close targets like the 18x24 gong at 7 yards on Smoke & Hope and Ted Bonnet was consistently quick out of that beater Hellweg but the quickest guy I ever saw in person was old Cal Erlich with the Cowboy Fast Draw action. Not an IPSC draw, but he's hitting plates and balloons with wax bullets and draws down in the .208 range from almost-but-not-quite-touching the gun. Not only that but he could call his draws to within a few thousandths of a second "this here technique is good down to about a quarter second... <bang> .248 <bang> .249" I always heard Ernie Hill was the guy to beat there, but never saw him shoot.

Ernie was the one to beat at one time. On his timing equipment (not officially calibrated that day), I saw him under .20 for lightbulb starts and balloon finishes. But my memory gets confounded with exaggerations, so I'll leave it there. Another shooter (when they got to shooting for fun) was under .50 a number of times to a large plate at about ten yards from a "not-competition" holster -- with a regular .45 LC SAA, 7 1/2" barrel, and factory ammo. Can't remember his name. If I remember right, a switch on the plate stopped the time. Darn fast on mutiple targets, too. Cal and Munden were pretty respectable IPSC shooters (about the time of pin guns).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

How about you Shred, fastest you have ever seen....holster to first shot.

I've seen a couple guys hit in the .6's fairly consistently on the draw on big close targets like the 18x24 gong at 7 yards on Smoke & Hope and Ted Bonnet was consistently quick out of that beater Hellweg but the quickest guy I ever saw in person was old Cal Erlich with the Cowboy Fast Draw action. Not an IPSC draw, but he's hitting plates and balloons with wax bullets and draws down in the .208 range from almost-but-not-quite-touching the gun. Not only that but he could call his draws to within a few thousandths of a second "this here technique is good down to about a quarter second... <bang> .248 <bang> .249" I always heard Ernie Hill was the guy to beat there, but never saw him shoot.

Ernie was the one to beat at one time. On his timing equipment (not officially calibrated that day), I saw him under .20 for lightbulb starts and balloon finishes. But my memory gets confounded with exaggerations, so I'll leave it there. Another shooter (when they got to shooting for fun) was under .50 a number of times to a large plate at about ten yards from a "not-competition" holster -- with a regular .45 LC SAA, 7 1/2" barrel, and factory ammo. Can't remember his name. If I remember right, a switch on the plate stopped the time. Darn fast on mutiple targets, too. Cal and Munden were pretty respectable IPSC shooters (about the time of pin guns).

Yes, Cal and Bob did shoot some IPSC, but really couldn't break their long ties with Quick Draw, and I suspect that since they both shot about the time of pin guns, they might have had a tough time beating BE, TGO, Shaw and Chippie while they were the King of the Hill in their sport...perhaps their perspective was why start something at the bottom of the pack in one sport when when they were at the top of their own...just my thoughts.

JT, there are plenty of great stories, just getting the guys to tell them is the tough part...bet guys like Benny Hill, and Bob Hostetler have some great ones if they would chime in.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You pretty much hit it. Hard to make exact comparisons from those days, but having seen BE, TGO, and Shaw, Cal and Bob were not in their class. Good shooters. You noticed their performances -- and not because you felt you should be seeking safety in another bay... I would guess that they did not have the time to do everything. They obviously spent a lot of time and effort on one series of movements (quick draw). Doubt they were willing (able?) to go to those lengths in a second arena (IPSC) at the same time. Heck, maybe they just enjoyed quick draw more than IPSC.

But I stray. Thanks for bringing back memories.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...
I heard from more than one person that Rick Castelow was the fastest shooter they had ever seen from the beep to the first shot.Back in 02 he sort of came out of retirement and shot at a small club way up in the hills and hollers of middle TN.8-10 shooters max was all that ever showed up but of those there were at least 5 A to Master class shooters.Castelow was shooting a Les Baer Single Stack.He had obviously slowed down some over the years but was still smooth and effortless.There was one stage where you could shoot all the targets plainly from one spot but to have any decent shot at the last couple you had to move as only part of the head was visable and you were crouching down and shooting almost at the 180 through a port .Everyone but Castelow moved to the other spot.This was a 16 rd stage mind you.He stayed there shot 9 rds,reloaded and hit the two difficult targets in the upper B zone.Needless to say he smoked every body on that stage including the Open Masters

Started shooting in that small club in 1980. At that time it consistantly had 40 to 50 shooters at every match. The club had one of the larger mission counts for slots to the Nationals. No masters or grand masters, hadn't been invented yet. Rick also started around 1980. I saw him progress quickly. Not only fast on the draw to the first shot, but very accurate. Club is still going, shooting three gun, no national affiliation. Rules come from the range owner and are a mixture of IDPA and USPSA. Normally have about 20 shooters and we have a big time.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So...I'd like to hear if anyone has any stories about Roy Bohmfalk and/or Albert Nichols.

Roy shot in the Big Bear Valley days with Jeff and later at SWPL. For 50yd standards, he always shot supine rather than prone. He practiced with Albert Nichols and Jack Weaver. Roy knew Jeff well enough that when our shooting class went to Gunsite to take a Louis Awerbuck shotgun class, everyone ended up at Jeff's house for BBQ. Roy isn't shooting anymore. I keep trying to convince him to write down all his early IPSC stories. He still has match scores and stage descriptions. I may need to take a trip to visit him and haul along a laptop and scanner.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So...I'd like to hear if anyone has any stories about Roy Bohmfalk and/or Albert Nichols.

Roy shot in the Big Bear Valley days with Jeff and later at SWPL. For 50yd standards, he always shot supine rather than prone. He practiced with Albert Nichols and Jack Weaver. Roy knew Jeff well enough that when our shooting class went to Gunsite to take a Louis Awerbuck shotgun class, everyone ended up at Jeff's house for BBQ. Roy isn't shooting anymore. I keep trying to convince him to write down all his early IPSC stories. He still has match scores and stage descriptions. I may need to take a trip to visit him and haul along a laptop and scanner.

How did he manage to go supine without flagging himself with the muzzle? I would like to see how that is done...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 months later...
...

EarlyIPSCer, I was a range rat in the OCPL days. I was there when the old range flooded out and we moved over to Rainbow. I started shooting there at the shoots that Bill and Dorothy would put on.I remember that we would often go to the Hahns for sodas and food after a shoot and talk. Bill and Dorothy were great. Was talking to my Pop about this thread last night and asked him how he met Jerry Usher. He said that Jerry came by the shop( that would have been my Great-Great Gandfathers gunshop. He was a MasterGunsmith by the name of Carl Woodhouse)and was mentioning something about having shoots out at Lake Cahuilla. Dad had been on a rifle team in High School and in the Army and having three tours of combat in SEAsiathought that would be a good way to keep his survival skills sharp. That turned into more competition and meeting Ray, Nick, Nicks dad and brother(cant recall their names)here in the desert.

The only shooter I can remember from the OCPL range that wasn't from the desert was Seth Nadel. There were many back then but Seth for some odd reason comes to mind, oh and Danny Boches.

Yeah, bill was agreat artist. Wish I still had some of the club shirts that he would have made. Did you ever have to wear the "I Shoot Hostages" cowbell?

As to Ray Neal, he was a drywaller. He was very quiet but kind to us kids and my Mom liked him so he passed muster in our house.

JimmyZip, perhaps we've met. I moved from Oceanside back to Kansas City in early '77 which was prior to the OCPL move to Rainbow, but I did shoot there once on a visit. Bill and Dorothy were saints and serrogate parents to alot of us young Marine officers. After the matches we would always go to their house and sit up in Bill's studio and look at his incredible gun collection. The last time that I saw Bill was in the summer of 2002--my wife had just died of cancer and I wanted to go visit our old stomping grounds and see old friends. Dorothy was in the final stages of Alzheimers at the time and Bill was completely devoted to her. She had flooded their house and damaged alot of things and it was the saddest site that I think that I've ever seen--Bill was loving and compassionate with her in a way that was very inspiring. When Dorothy died, Bill did one of his cartoons of her playing the organ in heaven with halo--I still have it and will always cherise it. He encouraged me to get active in cowboy action shooting which I put off until about 2 years ago. By that time I had remarried and my wife and I both started shooting. When I saw Harper Creigh at the SHOT show a couple of years ago I asked how Bill was doing and was told that he had passed away--I haven't been able to find any info on him, what he died of or how he died. As devoted as he was to Dorothy, my guess is that he died of a broken heart.

As a matter of fact when I got to KC one of the first things that I did was make a cowbell with the "I shoot hostages" on it--actually took it to a match the other day for grins. I still have one of the tee shirts of the "Bull-istic Pendalum" it's priceless!

I've stayed in touch with Seth Nadel--he lives up in the Sholow, AZ area--stopped and had lunch with he and his wife a couple of years ago--he seems to be doing well. It was quite a joke when he and Linda got married since she was an ATF agent at the time.

Thanks for your response Jimmy.

So sad to hear of the Hahn's passing. I used to shoot regularly at Rainbow in the 80's and early 90's-we'd shoot the steel, and then go up the hill to shoot the IPSC stage put on by Linea de Fuego (my home club for many years). Bill was an extremely gracious gentleman, and Dorothy was one of the nicest people I've ever met. I last saw them both in 2002 when Rainbow held their 350th match. Dorothy was not doing well at all by that time.

I have worn "the cowbell" a number of times.

Thanks for the news-I'm sure Bill and Dorothy are together again.

God bless.

TJ

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So...I'd like to hear if anyone has any stories about Roy Bohmfalk and/or Albert Nichols.

Roy shot in the Big Bear Valley days with Jeff and later at SWPL. For 50yd standards, he always shot supine rather than prone. He practiced with Albert Nichols and Jack Weaver. Roy knew Jeff well enough that when our shooting class went to Gunsite to take a Louis Awerbuck shotgun class, everyone ended up at Jeff's house for BBQ. Roy isn't shooting anymore. I keep trying to convince him to write down all his early IPSC stories. He still has match scores and stage descriptions. I may need to take a trip to visit him and haul along a laptop and scanner.

Wow, it's been a long time since I thought about Roy and his 50 yard sitting position. I shot IPSC with him in San Diego for a few years, and did some of his classes at the SDPD range for fun.

Roy scared the snot out of a few people when he dropped into that position at the 50 yd. line-he dropped so fast, you'd think he AD'd and shot himself, or hat a heart attack.

Gotta get him to write down his stories-the man is a walking history book of IPSC, in addition to being a smart guy and a real student of shooting overall.

TJ

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I remember Jerry Barnhart at the Dallas nationals in 86 I think. He made up misses faster than most anyone could shoot. Saw John Shaw shoot at the Canadian IPSC nationals north of Toronto. He was good. Had a lesson with Leatham, saw him hit a 0.4something draw. He did 6 sub 2 second Bill Drills in a row. He said 7 was the world record then. It was just before he got his new Wilson L/E dual chamber comp 38 super. My triple chambered Kempton 45 freaked him out. Leatham is always a treat to watch at Rio Salado. Matt Burkett is no slouch either.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 5 months later...

Florida Invitational circa 1984 or so.It was the year the freeze wiped out the citrus industry in central Florida.

The first day our group shot the standards.Starting at 50 yards you went to one knee and engaged three targets at 35-45-50 yards.First shooter was a glasses wearing youngster with sandy hair--kind of bookish looking.At the beep he goes to one knee and fires the required six rounds in just over 5 seconds.We all thought this was WAY too fast to hit anything at that range.This guy only got faster as he got closer to the targets.Still thought he was shooting too fast to hit anything.I think he dropped 8 points out of 30 rounds.Won the whole match too!!!!

His name--Barnhart something--Jerry Barnhart I think!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

Man, this is a great thread. I had the privilege of attending the Chapman Academy back in the day when Ray taught quite a bit. What a true American hero, and just a great guy. His souped up jeep on the jungle course was more fun than I'd ever had with a weapon in my hand.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 years later...
So...I'd like to hear if anyone has any stories about Roy Bohmfalk and/or Albert Nichols.

Roy shot in the Big Bear Valley days with Jeff and later at SWPL. For 50yd standards, he always shot supine rather than prone. He practiced with Albert Nichols and Jack Weaver. Roy knew Jeff well enough that when our shooting class went to Gunsite to take a Louis Awerbuck shotgun class, everyone ended up at Jeff's house for BBQ. Roy isn't shooting anymore. I keep trying to convince him to write down all his early IPSC stories. He still has match scores and stage descriptions. I may need to take a trip to visit him and haul along a laptop and scanner.

Wow, it's been a long time since I thought about Roy and his 50 yard sitting position. I shot IPSC with him in San Diego for a few years, and did some of his classes at the SDPD range for fun.

Roy scared the snot out of a few people when he dropped into that position at the 50 yd. line-he dropped so fast, you'd think he AD'd and shot himself, or hat a heart attack.

Gotta get him to write down his stories-the man is a walking history book of IPSC, in addition to being a smart guy and a real student of shooting overall.

TJ

Roy and I shot together for years and had some time to travel together as well. We had one hysterical evening with Albert Nichols and his wife at one of the major restaurants at the Bazaar Del Mundo in Old Town in San Diego and that was really a lot of fun. I was an assistant for Roy when he taught the Basic and Advanced Firearm Safety classes at the Police Range in San Diego and remember taking the class out to Kitchen Creek one year for a weekend of shooting and camping.

We set up the courses of fire, mainly steel, and put everyone through them with good range etiquette, timers, etc. I remember the look on the campground manager's face when I came in to make some reservations complete with speed holster and .45...it was priceless. One of our shooters was a Navy Captain in the Dental Corps and an excellent shooter. He brought out his large and very gracious motorcoach to which people gravitated after dinner in the campground and we tallied the day's shooting scores. That was wonderful weekend, mainly shooting steel but with some paper courses like the [polically abhorrent] Mexican Standoff. Roy generally won that won on time....

I remember spending a day out at Kitchen Creek with Roy shooting steel in the snow. Another great, great, day, but man, difficult to retrieve the shells from the little snow holes they created as they melted into the snow drifts.

Dropping and shooting prone: Roy told me he created that particular shooting position (which is very solid) and named it the Rhodesian Prone - not sure why, but it was catchy.

I'm sorry to hear he's no longer shooting; he's 78 now and I think living in Pine Valley, east of San Diego.

Thanks for letting me share some of the memories.

Mary Hart

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now



×
×
  • Create New...