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Considering Single-Stack; looking for expert wisdom


matteekay

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Howdy!

 

I'm a revolver shooter and I've been thinking about taking on Single-Stack to mix it up a little. I figured I'm usually counting to eight anyhow and the platform is almost as old as revolvers are... At the very least, it would be a good excuse to buy a semi-auto (seriously, I own seven revolvers). I figure it would be nice to have aftermarket support, be able to build out a belt inexpensively, and be able to run factory ammo for once, lol.

 

Some guidance I'm looking for...

 

- Are there any considerations I'm missing? What do you know now that you wished you knew when you started SS?

- Does anyone do SS Minor or is it really not worth it? 

- Do the Chip McCormick 10-round mags make it under the length limit for Major? Understanding that they can only be loaded to 8.

- Anyone else out there with stubby thumbs? Do you change the mag release or actuate it with your weak hand?

- Am I insane for looking at the RIA Tac Ultra guns? They seem to have pretty good reviews and options for the price (since I'm just trying out SS).

 

Any other thoughts and ideas welcome. Thanks!

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See if you can borrow someone's gear for a match or two before you decide ... That will help form your decisions better.

 

Minor may be easier to shoot, but none of the top shooters seem to be going that route ... That should tell you something.

 

It's not the mag length, per se, that will trip you up.  The gun, with empty mag inserted, must fit in the measurement box (per Appendix D).  Ten round mags are generally too long to allow for this.

 

Lots of folks with short thumbs!  Consider either using your weak hand or get an ambidextrous mag release installed.

 

No idea on RIA ...

Edited by Schutzenmeister
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For local matches 9mm minor in Single Stack is fun, and since you already shoot 8 shot revolver you probably already have good powder and bullets, and a reloading setup that is already pretty close to what you need for 9mm.    Getting a decent belt, holster, and mag pouches is pretty reasonable.  The gun and mags are the big ticket items.  I dabble in single stack and have a Dan Wesson PM 9 and really like it and if i sold it I'm pretty sure I could get close to what I paid.   i added an Ed Brown mag release and a magwell and that is about it.  STI and others make good 9mm guns for decent prices and lots of folks love them.   Tripp or Dawson mags work well out of the box.  Also, factory 9mm ammo is currently very reasonable.

 

.40 and .45 are also great options, and shooting major is probably better if you really get into the Single Stack...but IMO it is hard to beat a good 9mm for having fun and you can be very competitive at the club level with a 9mm minor SS gun. 

 

Love the revolver and have a 627 fixed up for USPSA, but changing it up keeps things fresh and may even help in your revolver game. 

Good Luck!

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No expert wisdom here, but I am a revolver shooter that began taking on Single Stack starting this past October. I Shoot a Ruger revolver, so I went with the Ruger SR1911 as my single stack semi-auto. I shoot major, but I have seen numerous competitors shoot minor, and I think major or minor is a good way to go. I use Wilson Combat 47D eight round magazines in competition, and have no experience with Chip McCormick mags (but I understand that they are good). I happened to get some Wilson Combat Shok-Buff recoil buffers, and found them to work great so far. They reduce (as you would imagine) the recoil effects to make it less "violent", and I would suggest using one in whatever 1911 you choose.

 

I am currently using a standard SR1911, and am looking at the SR1911 Target model. Not that you were considering a Ruger, but just to clarify what I use.

 

Oh, I normally shoot a Ruger Alaskan shooting 45 Colt, and the single stack SR1911 in 45ACP was a pleasant recoil change. :lol:

 

Edited by Blueridge
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34 minutes ago, Schutzenmeister said:

See if you can borrow someone's gear for a match or two before you decide ... That will help form your decisions better.

 

Minor may be easier to shoot, but none of the top shooters seem to be going that route ... That should tell you something.

 

It's not the mag length, per se, that will trip you up.  The gun, with empty mag inserted, must fit in the measurement box (per Appendix D).  Ten round mags are generally too long to allow for this.

 

Lots of folks with short thumbs!  Consider either using your weak hand or get an ambidextrous mag release installed.

 

No idea on RIA ...

I thought Jessie Duff, Julie Golob (I know that she is B class in SS), and several other Master along with a GM shot minor at the Single Stack Nationals?

Edited by Blueridge
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SS is also limited to 8-round magazines for major, so the CMC 10 round is not legal if shooting major. You can shoot Limited-10 major using that magazine however in an otherwise SS gun. I use both Wilson 47-D and CMC 8-round magazines in my Springfield loaded target. I like 1911s so SS was the natural place for me. I may shoot some L-10 once I acquire some more 10 round magazines.

Edited by Eureka1911
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1 minute ago, Eureka1911 said:

SS is also limited to 8-round magazines, so the CMC 10 round is not legal. You can shoot Limited-10 using that magazine however in an otherwise SS gun. I use both Wilson 47-D and CMC 8-round magazines in my Springfield loaded target. I like 1911s so SS was the natural place for me. I may shoot some L-10 once I acquire some more 10 round magazines.

Tripp research has some good 10 rounders.

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Have been shooting SS for about 30 years. It comes down to shoot major. I like SWC 200 gr with a good powder behind it like HP-38, WW 231 or Clays.

Shooting SS vs Rev the only real difference is the equipment. I use Wilson EMT or 47D magazines (also use them for my EDC). As long as the pistol runs, you can work on the accuracy and relearn your timing.

IMVHO

Mike

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Awesome advice everyone, thank you! 

 

I suppose you could actually shoot Limited 10 Major with a 1911. That might be fun, and would open up the other gear a little bit (holster and mag placement, etc). I'd probably start in Single Stack but it's nice to have that as an option. 

 

I hadn't thought about it, but Single Stack really is the revolver division of semi-autos. Not sure if that's good or bad, haha. At the very least, running a .45 would be good "there is no recoil" training for my 627.

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I did single stack a couple of times just for the hell of it...had a blast! I personally would never invest money in it, but it is fun to dust off the grandpa guns every once in a while.

 

there is nothing wrong with single stack at all...I just prefer to focus on other divisions.

 

the bench

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5 minutes ago, matteekay said:

Well, my only other division is revolver... so I'd have grandpa's guns and great grandpa's guns, lol.

they are both pretty much revolvers...one just happens to be a little easier to reload and ejects its own shells lol

 

the bench

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Tripp research has some good 10 rounders.



And nothing says you can't just load 8 in 10 round mags. Mag capacity isn't limited, you just can't load to capacity if you use 10 round mags for major. No more than 8 rounds in a mag after the buzzer or its off to open. You do have to make sure they fit in the box. I use 10 round Tripp cobra mags for ss major in my 40.
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1 hour ago, matteekay said:

At this rate, I'll wind up in SASS before the end of the thread, ahaha.

Been there, had fun, moved on.... The clothing/costume requirement ate into my ammunition/reloading funds.

 

I enjoy shooting single stack division, but I really enjoy shooting revolver division. 

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5 hours ago, matteekay said:

I like the idea of 10-rounders due to the ability to go between SS, L10, and bowling pins without changing out mags.

 

If you want to shoot all that with only one set of mags you'd need a .40.  You can't use 10 round .45 mags in SS, they're too long to fit in the box, and you don't want to shoot 9mm for L10.  SS minor is pretty popular for local matches though if you're considering 9mm. 

 

I have a RIA Ultra in 9mm.  For a lower price 1911 it's pretty good.  Comes out of the box ready to use for USPSA which is nice.  Would be a cheap way to try out SS and see if you like it.  Then when you do, which obviously you will since anything is better than revolver ;), you can get a nicer one and use the RIA as a backup.

 

I was just looking at the RIA site and 2 out of the 3 pictures of the .40 Ultra appear to show it with a bull barrel.  I'm not sure if it really has one or if they just put up the wrong pictures, but make sure you don't get a bull barrel as they're not legal for SS.  My 9mm is a bushing barrel.

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9 hours ago, Blueridge said:

I thought Jessie Duff, Julie Golob (I know that she is B class in SS), and several other Master along with a GM shot minor at the Single Stack Nationals?

I know both Julie and Jessie. TOP (lady) shooters to be certain.  I've only ever beaten Julie once ... and that was about 20 years ago.  She's a lot better now and I'm just older and slower!

 

I haven't taken the time to look at the finals from the recently completed SS Nats ... But you may want to look at them and see just how many of the top 20-30 shooters were listed as minor.  Not many, I'll wager. 

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1 hour ago, Schutzenmeister said:

I haven't taken the time to look at the finals from the recently completed SS Nats ... But you may want to look at them and see just how many of the top 20-30 shooters were listed as minor.  Not many, I'll wager. 

 

Top minor shooter at SS Nats was 13th, and only 1 other in top 20.  But we all know SS Nats has always been weighed heavily in favor of major.  At each of the area matches so far this year about half of the top 10 shot minor.  And last year 3 of the area matches were won by minor and quite a few in the top 10 for almost all the area matches.  I do think major comes out ahead most of the time, but minor can still do pretty well at many matches and may be a good choice for local matches depending on the types of stages your local clubs typically do.

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8 hours ago, Schutzenmeister said:

I know both Julie and Jessie. TOP (lady) shooters to be certain.  I've only ever beaten Julie once ... and that was about 20 years ago.  She's a lot better now and I'm just older and slower!

 

I haven't taken the time to look at the finals from the recently completed SS Nats ... But you may want to look at them and see just how many of the top 20-30 shooters were listed as minor.  Not many, I'll wager. 

I have often wondered, do few people shoot minor (in limited and single stack) because it is that hard to win? Or is it that hard for someone to win shooting minor because statistically/numerically few people shoot minor? It seems as it could be a self-fulfilling prophesy if a person won't shoot minor just because they believe they cannot win what they see as more challenging matches shooting minor. This would include that they have never tried, and not that they have tried and by their efforts came to that conclusion.

 

 

"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take".

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17 minutes ago, Schutzenmeister said:

I absolutely, positively, 100% guarantee that if the "big boys" of the sport thought they could do better shooting minor than shooting Major, THEY WOULD SWITCH IN A HEARTBEAT!

 

Again, this should tell folks something.

My counter to that is that the skill of the "big boys" to shoot major or minor is about the same, but shooting major provides a bit of "cushion" scoring wise. That said people saying that it SHOULD not be done if someone is serious about competition, is different than saying that it CANNOT be done if one is serious about competition.

 

I do not have the information that Southpaw uses in his earlier post to show what Area matches were won by someone shooting minor, or the number shooting minor finishing in the top 10 in area matches. The point that I am getting at is that until someone wins the SS Nationals shooting minor, of course it has not been done. Suggesting pretty much that no one should try is what I disagree with, and I have met people that espouse that idea. I would love to see someone do it, if for no other reason than to eliminate the statement that it never has been done at SS Nationals. I am not even close to being likely to do this, but I believe that someone can and will.

 

There is a quote that I read (and for the record, I am NOT directing this at anyone) which says, "Those too weak to follow their own dreams, often will discourage others". What I take from this is that it should always be noted who the source of information is, and if they have ulterior reasons behind what they are saying. The path trod by others is likely less difficult, but another path more difficult might be more satisfying to some.

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