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RTS2 insufficient elevation


vtecpaoche

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I'm on my third RTS2 now and still going thru issues.

 

The first one came with my CK Arms gun that didn't have sufficient elevation either and was about an inch low.  I got a replacement that was running a V3 board that zeroed right out of the box.  I had that one for 2 years and the dot started cutting out during matches and even during dry fire sessions.  That was sent back and I got a replacement this March with a V4 board.  Unfortunately, there is insufficient elevation again.  When I went to zero at 20 yards, I was not even hitting the target so I moved up to 10 yards.  At 10 yards, all my hits were low.  I tried to raise the elevation and the highest I got was about 3-4 inches low and the elevation was maxed out.

 

I'm trying to work with C-More on this.  It would sound logical if the mount was an issue if the second RTS2 did not zero as soon as I put it on the mount.  The mount is a Cheely mount that came with the CK Arms.  I guess I could go with getting a blank mount and then drilling the holes exact but if I have to RMA the RTS2 again, I may run into the issue where the adjustment is different for each RTS2.  Has anyone run into this before with a replacement RTS2?

 

I'm also wondering if putting a shim would be an option and who makes one.  I was looking at the DPP thread and it seems JP makes a shim for the J-Point that also seems to work with the DPP.  I'm not sure if that would work for the RTS2 though.

 

My last thought is to ditch the RTS2 entirely and go with a different dot which is frustrating as this is an expensive solution.

Edited by vtecpaoche
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Yes, but the poster sent back their RTS2 for repairs as they thought the adjustment screw continued to spin while the lock screw was tight.  My issue is a bit different as I've run out of adjustment.

 

I'm on my 3rd RTS2 and I'm feeling pretty frustrated with the dot.  I did read that post and backed the lock screw sufficiently by going 2 full turns instead of just 1 1/2 turns in my last range session with no luck.

 

I'm trying to see if there are other options and if other people have had limitations of the dot adjustment after receiving a replacement.  It just seems weird that my V3 could zero but the replacement V4 could not.  The only thing to really change between the two is the dot.

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I can't speak to your dot but I have had 3 ck's (2 thunder, 1 hardcore) in my hands for zeroing. All running cheely rts2 mount. All zero'd out just fine at 20 yards with poi being about 1inch high at 30 yards and about 1inch low at 7 yards. 

 

The only thing I can think of is a problem with your particular rts2. 

 

Its possible the mount or the frame holes weren't drilled on the proper angle but I'd consider that unlikely since it's probably done in a jig on their cnc and also since your old rts2 zerod just fine. 

 

Unfortunately it sounds like it needs to go back to cmore again. :(

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Thanks for confirming.  I'm curious as to why the range of adjustment is different for each RTS2 I have received.  You would figure the quality control would be more consistent.

 

I would go the shim route if it fitted as that would give me more adjustment but my concern is that there is something indeed defective on the current sight such as the glass is loose which is what a fellow competitor here had an issue with.  He finally gave up on the RTS2 and went with the DeltaPoint Pro.

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The RTS2 has been a good sight for me and my father has had good luck with both of his as a slide ride on a 1911 45 and M&P9 . As far as the differences in adjustment range, it must be a change between the versions or QC is off. The RTS2 and STS2 are both manufactured in Japan under contract for C-more (Ultra-dot maybe) and its possible glass or base plate angles changed with upgraded versions. C-more would be the one to confirm that. I am surprised to hear your running out of "up" adjustment. My experience with cheely mounts for the RTS2 or DP pro end up running out of down adjustment on most guns, just experienced this recently actually. His mounts have at least 1 degree of angle machined into the mount. That adds additional downward cant to the already 1 degree of downward cant most custom builders (and even STI the last I knew) drill and tap the frame holes at. This usually ends up being at the extreme end of "down" adjustment or just out of it leaving a high POI. But CK arms may not drill and tap at an angle because they do it in the mount. Full size C-mores have enough adjustment to make up for varying mount angles that limit the mini dots. That being said if you cant work this out get a full size C-more as they are more reliable and durable than most mini's with heavy vibrating open pistols. 

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  • 1 month later...
On 05/16/2017 at 10:28 PM, vtecpaoche said:

It's on it's way back to C-more right now.  I'm hoping the replacement works better.  If not, I'll need to find the rail mount and throw it on my 22lr pistol to play in rimfire pistol open.

What was the outcome of this?

 

I am having an amazingly similar problem

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Are you guys looking closely that the dot sits completely flush?  I ran into issues with the dot sitting on the heads of the small screws underneath that hold on the cover plate. Make sure that is good. Otherwise, the diode must be overly crooked and c-more should repair. 

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It went for repair.  I got it back and sighted it in.  It's all good now but I suspect I'm pretty close to the max elevation.  I haven't put too many rounds after sighting in as I'm trying to wrap up the year in limited.

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RTS2 can be easily assembled wrongly(BTDT) so it won't change elevation the way it is supposed to. To verify this just put sight to stable surface and adjust dot to see if it moves even on near max min range. 

 

This can be repaired at home but if your sight is under warranty, just send it back.

Edited by Kema
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Two of the three RTS2v4s I recently bought had screws protruding from the bottom.  Since the sight could not sit flat, they had to be sent back.

 

It sounds like the OP's problem is really mount related.  If the mounting surface is not angled down in front by 1 degree to match the axis of the bore in battery, there will be zeroing problems with some sights.

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Hi, I recently sold an open gun with RTS2 with repaired V4 board mounted on a Cheely older mount ( without the angle cut ) and the buyer had the same maxed out hight problem, and shooting low.  I contacted Matt and he said the 1 deg cut helps but shouldn't limit height adjustment.  I'm trying to help the buyer with suggestions before sending it back and told him perhaps a shim under the scope to raise it higher might work. The mount IS very low with the flat topped slide, but that shouldn't cause this problem, baffled. 

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  • 1 month later...
1 hour ago, Balakay said:

I just bought a new RTS2.  Out of the box it was 15 inches low at 15 yards.  Still 2 inches low after I turned the elevation screw as far as possible.  Returned and waiting for resolution

 

Have you had an RTS2 on this gun before?  Are you using the same mount, and did it work fine before?

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6 minutes ago, teros135 said:

 

Have you had an RTS2 on this gun before?  Are you using the same mount, and did it work fine before?

First time with the RTS. Switched from a 90° mount with a standard Cmore

 

 The new mount is  made by the gun's  builder, designed for the RTS.  He asked me to return the mount and RTS to him for evaluation 

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38 minutes ago, Balakay said:

First time with the RTS. Switched from a 90° mount with a standard Cmore

 

 The new mount is  made by the gun's  builder, designed for the RTS.  He asked me to return the mount and RTS to him for evaluation 

 

Good customer service.  Hope it works out.  

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  • 1 month later...
On ‎5‎/‎14‎/‎2017 at 5:40 PM, vtecpaoche said:

I'm on my third RTS2 now and still going thru issues.

 

The first one came with my CK Arms gun that didn't have sufficient elevation either and was about an inch low.  I got a replacement that was running a V3 board that zeroed right out of the box.  I had that one for 2 years and the dot started cutting out during matches and even during dry fire sessions.  That was sent back and I got a replacement this March with a V4 board.  Unfortunately, there is insufficient elevation again.  When I went to zero at 20 yards, I was not even hitting the target so I moved up to 10 yards.  At 10 yards, all my hits were low.  I tried to raise the elevation and the highest I got was about 3-4 inches low and the elevation was maxed out.

 

I'm trying to work with C-More on this.  It would sound logical if the mount was an issue if the second RTS2 did not zero as soon as I put it on the mount.  The mount is a Cheely mount that came with the CK Arms.  I guess I could go with getting a blank mount and then drilling the holes exact but if I have to RMA the RTS2 again, I may run into the issue where the adjustment is different for each RTS2.  Has anyone run into this before with a replacement RTS2?

 

I'm also wondering if putting a shim would be an option and who makes one.  I was looking at the DPP thread and it seems JP makes a shim for the J-Point that also seems to work with the DPP.  I'm not sure if that would work for the RTS2 though.

 

My last thought is to ditch the RTS2 entirely and go with a different dot which is frustrating as this is an expensive solution.

Wow sorry to hear about the RTS2 problem, this is my favorite red dot, always bright enough even in vegas and phoenix.  I use them on my saiga shotgun as well as the side dot on my rifle for three gun. I have several of them and have never had a problem.  I have heard about the cutting out of them on the early models.  

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  • 2 months later...

We get this all the time at Vortex, it sounds like the same issue here and I'm sure my colleagues at Trijicon and Leupold get this too (because our travel specs are pretty much the same). 

 

For pistol applications, the combination of height over bore (ESPECIALLY on saddle mounts) and the really close distances guys are trying to zero at will max or exceed the travel. This is because the bullet has to rise sometimes a inch or more to cross your line of sight, and even if you can zero at this distance sometimes you are at a such an early part of the ballistic arc that your zero may not work very well for other distances. We recommend zeroing at 25 yards keeping in mind that you are still going to be a touch low up close. To zero at 7, 10, or 15 you more than likely need to use a shim or a canted base. 

 

Remember in the world of carbines a conventional zero, point of impact is 1.5-2" low at close ranges due to height over bore. The same concept applies here.  

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  • 5 months later...

I am also having major issues with 2 rts2’s. The first one was difficult to zero and once I got it dialed in I began to run drills. All of the sudden I’m 1&1/2 feet low. I got it back up to 8 inches low and that’s the best it would get. So I had a second rts2 overnighted so I could make the weekend match. It zeroed fine but when I started running it hard it also dropped to a foot low and would not adjust back up. I have followed all the instructions from the manual and it rides on a cz slide. They are both going to go to the repair shop Monday.

 

p.s. They were zeroed at 25 yards.

Edited by Nugget
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