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Mag troubles


blacklab

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I searched the threads but didn't find the answers I'm looking for. I have 2 separate problems. Over the winter I replaced the springs and followers with Grams in all my mags.

Problem #1:

Factory STI 140mm mags with SNL Dawson base pads, if I load them with more then 15 rounds the bullet nose dives and jams. Anything at 15 rounds and under they work great, all 5 of them do the same thing. I'm using all the same stuff as last year, I only changed the springs and followers. I filled them to the max and tried letting them sit loaded for a few days to see if the springs just needed to seat in, it didn't help.

 

Problem #2:

Dawson 140mm tuned mags with TTI 4mm base pads. Sometimes 2 bullets get stuck side by side and jam up in the mag. There doesn't seem to be any consistency when it happens. Today I was shooting steel and only had them loaded to 10 rounds, 3 of the mags jammed through out the day. Yesterday I was shooting 3 gun and loaded them to the max but didn't have any problems, last week I was shooting knock down steel with them loaded to the max and 2 of them jammed. The mags are numbered so I know its not just one or two of them, they all have jammed at one point.

 

STI factory 170mm mags with Dawson SNL base pads.

I replaced these springs and followers at the same time as the 140mm. The 170mm haven't given me any problems.

 

A little history on the mags. The STI factory mags are used for 3 gun and USPSA where they get dropped in the mud. The Dawson tuned mages are for steel, knock down steel or anything that don't involve dirt or dropping. I had to use them for 3 gun yesterday because the factory mags don't work right now. It didn't make me very happy. Any suggestions on how to solve these problems would be appreciated.

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I know you just replaced the springs, but I believe your problem is either:

 

1.  your mags need to be resized (out of spec),    or

 

2.  you need new springs  (you sure you replaced them with the correct springs?)

 

Love that quote at the bottom of your post - "Reality is an illusion ..."    :D

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7 hours ago, EEH said:

This may sound crazy,but you didn't put them in backwards did you ?

They came with the followers on the springs. I don't think you can put them in backwards. 

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3 hours ago, racegun9 said:

What caliber? 

What overall length of the round?

Do you use spacers if 9mm?

They are for 9mm. The STI factory mags have spacers the Dawson do not. The overall length is 1.168 using SNS RED 115gr. round nose. That load was working fine but then I was getting FTF's with the STI mags late in the season, the Dawson were working. I thought if I was going to have to change the springs in the STI's I would change them all. Now the STI's feed fine with up to 15 rounds and the Dawson jam in the mag. I don't know what I did wrong.

 

There is a thread that IHMSA15151 started about a month ago where he is having the same problem as I am with my Dawson. Most people said to check the springs, but mine are new.

Edited by blacklab
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Grams does have two different follower set-ups.

A shorter follower if you use spacers and a longer one to use without spacers.

Not sure if you are already aware of that.

Make sure you have the right followers.

Are the Dawson tuned mags STI brand as well? 

Most STI mags seem to like the spacers.

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I tried the longer Grams followers to eliminate the spacers in STI 140 magazines to no avail... went back to the proper Grams followers & STI spacers .... good friend tuned my STI magazines ... now all magazines run 100%

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2 hours ago, racegun9 said:

Grams does have two different follower set-ups.

A shorter follower if you use spacers and a longer one to use without spacers

I did not know that, I may have bought the wrong kits.

 

4 minutes ago, Aircooled6racer said:

Hello: The side by side problem is caused by the rounds going past the crimped sides of the tube allowing the follower to tilt over. What springs are you using? Thanks, Eric

I bought the kits from Grams. I'm going to have to look into if I have the right ones.

 

2 hours ago, racegun9 said:

Are the Dawson tuned mags STI brand as well? 

Most STI mags seem to like the spacers

They never had spacers in them and used to work fine.

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http://www.gramsengineering.com/products/?p=productsList&iCategory=4

 

fks9 are short followers for use with spacers

fks are for mags without spacers

 

If you are fully loading your mags with extended base pads the follower and or rounds

can go past the ribs of the magazine and cause all kinds of problems.

If you are just loading 10 to 15 rounds it's not a "going past the ribs problem".

 

You can also put a mag back to the original set-up with a new spring and see what happens.

Edited by racegun9
fix fks spelling
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I had a long and interesting talk with Devon from Grams today. He seems to know his stuff, apparently all STI style mags for 9mm need spacers to be dependable. He thinks if I get the spacers the jamming problem in the Dawson's will go away, he said something about the bullets are getting past the ribs because 9mm's are so short. (good call racer9)  I have the fsk9 followers in them now but he still recommends using the spacers. As far as the stock STI's he said it sounds like the tubes are out of shape and need to be tuned. I also learned that my cleaning method was not the best.

 

Thumbs up to Grams. I was surprised when a actual person answered the phone, and how willing Devon was to help. I was going to buy new spring kits and he talked me out of it, he told me he would like to sell me new kits but I would only be wasting money. Its good to see there are still honest companies.

 

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1 hour ago, Glk21C said:

You most likely talked to Beven, the man himself, not Devon.

Beven will never steer you wrong, he is the best.

Maybe his name was Beven, he said his last name was Grams. He did seem to know his stuff.

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