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My First DQ-2017 texas open


djj1234

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I am very new to the sport, a good buddy of mine introduced me to it a few months back and since then we have never looked back, we were hooked.  I have participated I a few and I mean a few local area matches so by no means am I considered a seasoned shooter, but as most know that the best way to get acclimated is to jump right in, well that's what I did.  I spent the entire week getting my gear ready for the texas open, so by the start of the weekend I was at least gear ready, new pistol was running great, light loads were spot on and at a good power factor , clothes were washed and ready. Well the weekend started, our group shot Saturday morning, myself and my buddies were pretty excited as we couldn't stop talking about this weekend since we signed up. our first big match.  1st bay we got to wasn't too hard 16 shots, pistol and mag on separate barrels for starting. almost everyone did well on this bay, I honestly shot all alphas on the 1st run and a decent time, (my thoughts were man this is gonna be a good day, lets keep this goin).  Well needless to say that all came to a quick hault on the 2nd bay we went to.  We had a barrel in the front, a metal plate on either side, fencing behind that on both sides with a shooting hole, and barrels on the end of the fence. 2 paper swinger targets activated by shooting the metal plates in front, 1 step back allowed you to shoot the swinger targets and 2 paper targets on the ends on each side that needed to be shot from the very back. Now I played it over and over in my head how I could do this and get the most advantage for me time wise by shooting the metals first, the outsides next and then the swingers (allowing them to slow down a bit to make sure my shots count).  Here is where I messed up, as I made ready (pistol loaded and chambered, put on the barrel in front of me) I took a step back to the starting line, range officer gave the commands and I was off, first shots were perfect, metal plates fell, I then took a step back, and out of the corner of my eye I could see the 2 targets to the left, I spun enough to point but then I realized I was REALLY close to hitting the 180 rule, I never fired as I did not want to break that rule, but as I turned a bit back to the right the range officer called it and let me know that I surpassed the 180 deg mark.  I honestly thought I had stopped far enough that I did not break the rule but the R.O was certain of the infraction. I was pretty disappointed in myself, more so when I realized that we were only on the 2nd bay of 12 and still had a  whole day ahead of us. well I stuck around to support a fellow shooter for the next 8 bays then decided to leave with a sense of understanding what I did wrong and what all I needed to do to fix it.

 

So please learn from my mistakes and play the scenario out in your head with every way you can make the best time and not be tempted to break that 180deg rule...

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absolutely man, after I got over being aggravated my teammates reassured me it does happen even to the best of us so I will take what I have learned here and run with it.

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your definitely right about that but nevertheless its still disappointing when you drive 4 hrs to shoot and you screw up like that, but def a lesson learned.

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I sympathize. Went to my first big match last fall with a bunch of my buddies. I'd shot pretty regular for a couple years. Not as much as I wanted but bumped it up just before the match. Checked ammo everything. First three stages I was rocking, definitely having a good day. DQ fourth stage. Spent the rest of the weekend cheering my buddies and smoking cigars. Learning lesson. 

 

The up side is you can pretend you would have shot much better than you probably would have :D

 

red

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  • 2 months later...

allowing you to break the rule if you aren't a conscientious gun handler isn't the same as inviting.

 

I wish more matches weren't so "overprotective mom" about putting barrels and noshoots anywhere someone might see a target at 182 degrees.

 

It'd make for better muzzle discipline from shooters.

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7 hours ago, MemphisMechanic said:

 

I wish more matches weren't so "overprotective mom" about putting barrels and noshoots anywhere someone might see a target at 182 degrees

 

Guess there's two ways of looking at this issue.

 

Personally, I think it's not beneficial to the sport to set targets at 179 degrees.    :ph34r:

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3 hours ago, Hi-Power Jack said:

 

Guess there's two ways of looking at this issue.

 

Personally, I think it's not beneficial to the sport to set targets at 179 degrees.    :ph34r:

 

I'm talking more along the lines of a situation like this, where it was the shooter's responsibility to back up that extra step or two inside the shooting area... or where you're running straight downrange and are expected to be mindful to engage the target before you're directly abreast of it.

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Seems like creating situations where a shooter is pointing a firearm at a 90 degree angle to down range to hit a target is creating an unsafe situation. We preach safety then design stages for shooters to press the edge of safety. How many times have we all seen people standing to the side of a bay in a safe area behind the 180  and the shooter shoots across the bay and is impacting within 15ft of someone? Do we do this to try to catch a competitor breaking 180? If not then why set targets so close to 180? Food for thought...

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I actually have video of the stage in question (please don't judge the shooting on the first few targets...it didn't go very well for me <_<)

 

Stage Video (stage starts at 2:33)

 

The two leaning paper were visible from the windows, but only because you started down-range of the ports...if you turned and looked back into the ports, then you could see them up-range from you...if you started up-range and moved into the ports, it'd be clear they were beyond the 180...none the less, I found myself doing the exact same thing that the OP did during my walk through...certainly a tendency to shoot the target as soon as you see it.

 

With respect to the general rule of putting targets at 89 degrees, I think it's cool in the context of a stage like a shoot-house where you turn a corner and there's a target at the end of a hallway, but I'm not a big fan of just setting up bunch of 180 traps for shooters.

Edited by GorillaTactical
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21 minutes ago, djj1234 said:

whats crazy is that the morning before one of the range officers got dqed for the exact same thing as what I did.

 

I believe the RO on the stage told me that it was 3-4 people total who DQed on the stage over the course of the match (RO Match Included).

 

I appreciate that this was one of your first matches, so it sucks that you didn't get a chance to shoot it all the way through.  As you continue on in competitive shooting, you'll find that there is a limitless set of circumstances that can and will go wrong while you're on the clock...from arguably the worst possible outcome short of someone actually getting injured (receiving a  DQ) up to a primer falling out of a round and seizing a trigger (ask me how I know that one), to a magazine falling out in the middle of an array, we've all experienced at least something that hasn't gone our way; unfortunately the $h*t always seems to happen more frequently at larger matches or on the big stage.  So much of shooting becomes mental with respect to what you do with those mistakes or freak occurrences and how you use them to grow (which you mentioned you are doing well with).  

 

Ultimately, no one got hurt, you realized even in the moment what you were doing wasn't good, and you are using the event to grow in the sport.  On more than one occurrence, I've seen the top shooter/s at a match...and some cases even in the country get DQed...it can happen to anyone...hope to meet you out at the Space City and/or Area 59 matches later this year.

 

 

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It happens to everyone. 10 or 12 (a long time) years ago, first big 2 day match in Oregon. Finished the first stage and was talking over my shoulder to the RO and when I went to holster, dropped the pistol. I jus put my stuff away and spent the rest of the shoot resetting and pasting. But I never dropped a pistol again.

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  • 4 weeks later...
On 7/5/2017 at 9:17 PM, Jerrymarsh said:

I have noticed lots of courses are no designed to push the 180 rule

They should not be , but sometimes a course gets set up with a possible 180 target, last night we had a stage  that as you moved forward had a low target on the right, with more targets yet to move forward on, I overran it and started to turn toward it, the brain and feet beat the arm so I didn't break 180 but everyone said I looked like a cartoon character slamming on the brakes 

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  • 4 weeks later...

That sucks, but at least you got out early. I just shot area 8 recently and a guy on my squad got DQ'ed on the last stage. It was the longest shoot I've shot, we finished the day at 8PM, and he got DQ'ed for clearing a malfunction on his open gun with his booger hook in the trigger guard. I would have been so upset with myself and how slow the day went. 

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  • 1 month later...
On 5/2/2017 at 5:16 PM, djj1234 said:

your definitely right about that but nevertheless its still disappointing when you drive 4 hrs to shoot and you screw up like that, but def a lesson learned.

 

Emotions are important. 

 

How you react to them is critical.

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  • 2 months later...
On 7/5/2017 at 9:49 PM, MemphisMechanic said:

allowing you to break the rule if you aren't a conscientious gun handler isn't the same as inviting.

 

I wish more matches weren't so "overprotective mom" about putting barrels and noshoots anywhere someone might see a target at 182 degrees.

 

It'd make for better muzzle discipline from shooters.

I discuss and argue this every time we set up our local match, 2 per month. Match director is always doing what he can to eliminate someone breaking the 180. My personal feeling and thought is, when do you put responsibility on the shooter. We are running around with loaded firearms and should maintain muzzle control. If you make the stages 180 proof you do nothing to help a shooter maintain conscience muzzle control. I see the varied view points in the thread but in my opinion making a stage 180 proof does a disservice to the shooters

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1 hour ago, ptmd said:

I see the varied view points in the thread but in my opinion making a stage 180 proof does a disservice to the shooters

 

I don't like for our local matches to leave a shooter unprepared for what they might run into some place else. My thinking is that I'd prefer to dq after making a 20 minute drive and a $20 investment than after 5 hours and $150. 

 

For tricky stuff I have been known to deliberately design a stage to challenge muzzle control skill, I make it a point to insure that the squad has a good clear view of how folks handle the stage. I tell shooters at the match briefing what I have done and remind them that they will be dq'd in the event of an infraction. This seems like it really helps the new folks learn & I'm not sure that we have ever needed to dq someone when I have done this. 

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19 minutes ago, RileyLV said:

This sport is supposed to be fun; it's not fun when targets are set to deliberately invite a DQ and it doesn't contribute to greater safety.  In a real life confrontation the 180 rule doesn't apply.

 

Actually, real life experience at matches has proven that the shooters do indeed enjoy the "training" stages, and real life experience has also been that they are safer shooters when running a normal stage.

 

The reason I started doing it is because I got tired of newer folks who did not have good muzzle awareness forcing me to dq them (and sometimes scaring the snot out of me). It really does help. 

 

Would probably not be appropriate for local USPSA as that tends to be a more experienced group, but local IDPA brings in a lot of new folks and once a month competitors.

 

I would think that tactically muzzle awareness would be a great thing, but I am a gamer. 

 

 

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32 minutes ago, RileyLV said:

it's not fun when targets are set to deliberately invite a DQ.

 

1. See target

2. Realize you need to take two steps backward in order to engage a target.

3. Do so.

4. Be a responsible gun owner.

 

“In a real life confrontiation...”

 

(You just had to go there, didn’t you?)

 

You’re arguing thay being aware of where you’re pointing your gun under stress isn’t a valuable skill to acquire? Whether you’re working within 180 or 360 degrees, I’d still rather you didn’t sweep your gun across my abdomen in the process of engaging a horde of mall-hating terrorists. 

 

Edited by MemphisMechanic
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