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WSF For 9MM......


MikieM

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I'm going to test some WSF soon and wondered if anyone had any experience with the following load for 9mm (Minor PF), regarding accuracy and recoil:

4.5 grains WSF

124 grain PD JHP

OAL 1.150 inches

and,

4.7 grains WSF

124 grain PD JHP

OAL 1.150 inches

Thanks, Mike

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Here are a few with 125 grain coated bullets out of a Tanfo Stock 2 (4.75" poly barrel)
 
All Chrono'd on Caldwell Ballistic - 10' from sensor - 100' elevation - 80*
WSF - 125 BBI - 1.08 OAL 
 
3.8 - 873 fps avg - 121pf
4.0 - 1043 fps avg - 130pf
4.2 - 1057 fps avg - 132pf


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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23 minutes ago, bandw1dth said:


Here are a few with 125 grain coated bullets out of a Tanfo Stock 2 (4.75" poly barrel)
 
All Chrono'd on Caldwell Ballistic - 10' from sensor - 100' elevation - 80*
WSF - 125 BBI - 1.08 OAL 
 
3.8 - 873 fps avg - 121pf
4.0 - 1043 fps avg - 130pf
4.2 - 1057 fps avg - 132pf


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

How about accuracy, and recoil?

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I have loaded and shot tens of thousands of the Precision Delta 124gr JHP. Due to the shape of the bullet (i.e., truncated cone  and ogive), this particular bullet usually has to be loaded at a much shorter COL. This bullet usually contacts the lands and grooves in the barrel at a much shorter COL than the one you are proposing. 

 

In an effort to be helpful, may I suggest a couple of things that you may wish to do?

1) Make up 2 or 3 "dummy" cartridges using the COL you have asked about to see if they will "plunk and spin freely" in your chamber.

2) Consult the Lyman, Speer, Hornady, and Lee reloading manuals for information and guidance regarding WSF load data and COL when using 124gr JHP bullets.

 

Best wishes. 

Edited by mpssrh
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1 hour ago, mpssrh said:

I have loaded and shot tens of thousands of the Precision Delta 124gr JHP. Due to the shape of the bullet (i.e., truncated cone  and ogive), this particular bullet usually has to be loaded at a much shorter COL. This bullet usually contacts the lands and grooves in the barrel at a much shorter COL than the one you are proposing. 

 

In an effort to be helpful, may I suggest a couple of things that you may wish to do?

1) Make up 2 or 3 "dummy" cartridges using the COL you have asked about to see if they will "plunk and spin freely" in your chamber.

2) Consult the Lyman, Speer, Hornady, and Lee reloading manuals for information and guidance regarding WSF load data and COL when using 124gr JHP bullets.

 

Best wishes. 

 

Thanks for the info.

Reloading data from Winchester recommends a length of 1.150 with the 124 grain RN. My gun will eat everything all the way out to 1.170, or so.

What I would like are some comments on accuracy. and recoil. I've been using Titegroup, but accuracy is only so-so. Recoil is tolerable.

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The 124gr ROUND NOSE bullets will indeed chamber at a much longer COL. However, the 124gr JACKETED HOLLOW POINT bullets have such a different profile that they will not plunk and spin at longer COL. The reload data for COL with round nose bullets does not generalize to jacketed hollow point bullets.

Look at the 2nd post in this thread (from bandw1dth) and you will see that the COL he reported is 1.08".

 

 

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I use WSF in my PCC and accuracy is great. Not shot it much out of my psitol as I have a Universal load with 125 Blue bullets that is awesome.

The WSF load for my PCC is one of the milder recoiling loads. That is the main reason I use it in my Scorpion.

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As others have noted, the OAL will vary with bullet nose profile and the EXACT chamber and throat dimensions of YOUR barrel.  If this does not make sense to you, see the link below and look at figures 12 and 13.

 

http://38super.net/Pages/Bullet Design and Feeding Reliability.html

 

The PD 124 JHP has been very accurate in my 9mm Kart barrel - based on Ransom Rest results, though I have only tested a couple of loads with that bullet. How it will shoot in your gun is unknown until you try it. 

 

The rule of thumb for recoil is that gunpowders that require more weight to push the same bullet to the same speed will produce more recoil. That is explained here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recoil#Including_the_ejected_gas  and here:  http://38super.net/Pages/Recoil.html

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3 hours ago, mpssrh said:

I have loaded and shot tens of thousands of the Precision Delta 124gr JHP. Due to the shape of the bullet (i.e., truncated cone  and ogive), this particular bullet usually has to be loaded at a much shorter COL. This bullet usually contacts the lands and grooves in the barrel at a much shorter COL than the one you are proposing. 

 

In an effort to be helpful, may I suggest a couple of things that you may wish to do?

1) Make up 2 or 3 "dummy" cartridges using the COL you have asked about to see if they will "plunk and spin freely" in your chamber.

2) Consult the Lyman, Speer, Hornady, and Lee reloading manuals for information and guidance regarding WSF load data and COL when using 124gr JHP bullets.

 

Best wishes. 

 

I plunked, and rotated one with no problems.

My test ammo data comes from Winchester, albeit adjusted toward the desired power factor of 130.

Edited by MikieM
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I shoot 124 PD with 5.0 grains of WSF at 1.10 using cci primers. Very accurate and mild recoil in half dozen different guns. 

As I increased the powder charge towards 5.0 groups became smaller and the load burned cleaner. 

 

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WSF is my primary powder for 9mm pistols. Accuracy is very good and the recoil impulse is more of a push than a snap. It's a slower burning powder compared to TiteGroup. I like WSF more than N320, though that might be considered heresy.

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10 hours ago, hceuterpe said:

Yeah. Definitely double check your OAL with your barrels so they will work properly. 1.150 is pretty long for that bullet (which I also use)

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk
 

 

I have my bullet seater set to: 1.111 OAL for the 124 grain PD JHP. This is over a charge of 4.0 grains of WSF.

Accuracy is very good, and recoil is mild.

I just bought 8 pounds of powder so I'm good to go for awhile.

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4.8gr WSF under 124 PD JHP 1.09" OAL

15rds shot over Pro Digital Chrono

1041 fps avg velocity

ES 32  SD 8.2

CZ P07

 

Personally prefer WSF with 147gr and 231/HP-38 for 124/125 gr

Edited by JLeeCZ
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On April 23, 2017 at 9:21 PM, blackhand said:

WSF is my primary powder for 9mm pistols. Accuracy is very good and the recoil impulse is more of a push than a snap. It's a slower burning powder compared to TiteGroup. I like WSF more than N320, though that might be considered heresy.

What he said!  My load is 4.2 @1.060" with a 120 grain cast Lee coated lead bullet. Been shooting this load for three seasons. Extremely accurate, soft and flat shooting.

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7 hours ago, igolfat8 said:

What he said!  My load is 4.2 @1.060" with a 120 grain cast Lee coated lead bullet. Been shooting this load for three seasons. Extremely accurate, soft and flat shooting.

 

Do you. by chance, know the PF, or velocity, of your load?

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22 hours ago, Smitty79 said:

Shooting several WSF 9mm minor loads across the chrono yesterday, the ES was higher than I see with faster powders.   It was running 50 to 70.    Normally, I'm down around 30.

 

What was the standard deviation on them? (Assuming you have a sample size of 10 or more, so the data has some kind of significance)

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On 4/30/2017 at 10:27 AM, Smitty79 said:

Shooting several WSF 9mm minor loads across the chrono yesterday, the ES was higher than I see with faster powders.   It was running 50 to 70.    Normally, I'm down around 30.

Interesting.  Out of the many WSF 9mm loads I've tested, ES never higher than 30s and SD always <10 with a minimum 15 rounds per test.

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I chrono'd 4 different minor PF loads.   3 with WSF and 1 with IMR 7625.   All were loaded on the same machine.   SD on the 7625 was 8.   SDs on the WSF were 14, 16 and 20.

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