1chota Posted April 16, 2017 Share Posted April 16, 2017 Irons be irons. Red dots be optics. Don't belong in irons. Kurt where are you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonytheTiger Posted April 16, 2017 Share Posted April 16, 2017 At least you get to compete against two or three people in your division this way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Sierpina Posted April 16, 2017 Share Posted April 16, 2017 23 minutes ago, 1chota said: Irons be irons. Red dots be optics. Don't belong in irons. Kurt where are you? Wynn, my friend, I'lm going to try "Optical Irons: for some matches this year. You have even admitted to going to a .308 AR when you had trouble with your M1A, which has about the best irons on a battle rifle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1chota Posted April 16, 2017 Author Share Posted April 16, 2017 that is because I am old and can't see. But, like I said, red dots are optics, and irons are irons. I hope Easter found you well. I am not going to be at He-man, but I will make RM3G. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toothandnail Posted April 16, 2017 Share Posted April 16, 2017 51 minutes ago, TonytheTiger said: At least you get to compete against two or three people in your division this way. But, but gotta keep it pure man! Without it Irons is dead just as heavy is dead. I hate to see it happen but facts are facts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Sierpina Posted April 17, 2017 Share Posted April 17, 2017 (edited) 23 hours ago, 1chota said: that is because I am old and can't see. But, like I said, red dots are optics, and irons are irons. I hope Easter found you well. I am not going to be at He-man, but I will make RM3G. I'll see you in August if all goes well with both of us. I need to sit down with you and tip a couple of cold ones. As to the real irons, Kurt Miller is the one that started allowing non magnified optics in his matches, and Kurt shoots real irons. I think Trapr and Mike Pinto may have been accomplices of Kurt's with that. Edited April 17, 2017 by Dan Sierpina Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
technetium-99m Posted April 18, 2017 Share Posted April 18, 2017 Kurt was the first person I heard talking about letting dots into the irons divisions. It's been a thing at our local matches for years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaskapopo Posted April 18, 2017 Share Posted April 18, 2017 (edited) On 4/16/2017 at 3:44 PM, toothandnail said: But, but gotta keep it pure man! Without it Irons is dead just as heavy is dead. I hate to see it happen but facts are facts Irons are dead and have been for a while. pat Edited April 18, 2017 by Alaskapopo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi-Power Jack Posted April 18, 2017 Share Posted April 18, 2017 6 hours ago, Alaskapopo said: Irons are dead and have been for a while. Once you hit 55, irons are definitely "DEAD" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad Posted April 22, 2017 Share Posted April 22, 2017 I have been the only irons shooter in our area for a while, but am trying the RDS for a couple match's. Around here non magnified RDS is in Iron class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted April 24, 2017 Share Posted April 24, 2017 (edited) I'm 58, and I can assure you irons aren't dead! I still place real iron sights in the top 10 at most matches I attend, and sometimes take home a win or two. Yes, the 3 of us were instrumental in allowing red dots into the tactical non magnified division/ limited. After a lot of testing we found that a red dot was in no way an advantage over regular aperture sights. A lot of guys had red dots on their carbines and no real place to play except in tac optics......which isn't that much of a disadvantage either!!! The thing killing limited/ tac non magnified is the piss poor target presentations at most large matches. As magnification goes up in these fancy variables, less and less thought is given to target presentation.....which frustrates the hell out of limited shooters!!! If you aren't going to take the time to make all targets visible at all times of the day to the naked eye.....DON'T OFFER THE DIVISION!!!!!! BTW I hate it when they lump red dots together with iron sights and then call it iron sight division. IT ISN'T!!!!!!! But it is limited or non magnified!!! Well at least I got the change to allow red dots in, I wonder how long it will take for me to get the name changed away from iron sight division to non magnified or limited??? Edited April 24, 2017 by kurtm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1chota Posted April 24, 2017 Author Share Posted April 24, 2017 otay I stand corrected. I just got back from the Vortex-Shooters Source 3 gun match in Cresson, Texas at which the targets were definitely visible with the naked eye at all distances, all day every day. Great match! So, go get 'em Kurt! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HRider Posted April 25, 2017 Share Posted April 25, 2017 There are a few of us left that shoot irons. I shot a pistol/carbine match this weekend with my iron sighted JP and STI Eagle. It is an "Open" match, run what you brung. There were people from three states attending, with some very experienced three gunners shooting. This was no bay match, there were only 6 carbine targets less than 150 yards, with the farthest being 400 yards. The targets were mostly visible, only a couple were hard to see in direct sunlight and most far targets were large. The shooting positions were from on top of big rocks, inside of a bus, from barricades and tank traps, etc. There were no prone shots. It was a blast, I finished 9th (9/55) against all of the scope guys, so I was pretty pleased with my finish. Irons are fun to shoot, and a new, better set of irons doesn't come out every year or two to make the old ones obsolete. More people should give them a try. Hurley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dad Posted April 25, 2017 Share Posted April 25, 2017 How do you irons guys shoot the 50yrd and closer targets? What type of sights are you using and what apature? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Mitch Posted April 25, 2017 Share Posted April 25, 2017 It does seem weird and awful to combine irons and dots, but Kurt is right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HRider Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 22 hours ago, Dad said: How do you irons guys shoot the 50yrd and closer targets? What type of sights are you using and what apature? Thanks Faster than we do the long targets. At 50 yds, I am dead on with 55gr FMJ. My rifle likes Fiocchi 77 grain SMK ammo, so I am zeroed with it at 300 yards. As a rule, any target less than 100yards gets shot with 55 FMJ, anything beyond 100 yards gets 77SMK. My sights are just a plain DPMS A2 rear sight and a YHM folding front mounted right behind the comp. I have drilled and tapped the sight base so I can screw the sight in the up position, this eliminates any possibility of sight movement and I could fold it down if I ever decided to. My front sight post is a KNS .052" ball (looks like a golf ball on a tee). I paint the ball fluorescent orange. It helps me pick up the sight. On close paper, I just look across the rear sight and plant the front on the lower half of the target, this works really good out to 15-18 yards at "2 anywhere" matches, it takes a little more care to shoot alphas or where tight no shoots are. Hurley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StealthyBlagga Posted April 27, 2017 Share Posted April 27, 2017 (edited) On 4/24/2017 at 5:50 AM, kurtm said: The thing killing limited/ tac non magnified is the piss poor target presentations at most large matches. As magnification goes up in these fancy variables, less and less thought is given to target presentation.....which frustrates the hell out of limited shooters!!! If you aren't going to take the time to make all targets visible at all times of the day to the naked eye.....DON'T OFFER THE DIVISION!!!!!! AMEN BROTHER Apparently "reconnaissance by fire" is the new "marksmanship" (I trust you acknowledge my matches to be a notable exception) Edited April 27, 2017 by StealthyBlagga Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted April 27, 2017 Share Posted April 27, 2017 Yes I do! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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