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Extraction issue on CTS .40


Dlister70

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I just got my gun back from being cerekoted, and now I'm having extraction issues that I didn't have before.

 

I'm not sure how changing the color of the gun could change the way it extracts, so I'm having a real issue figuring out what to fix!  The extractor spring was changed once I noticed the issue, hoping that it was just a spring problem, and now it's extracting the shells something like 8 feet out.. it's nuts.  But then occasionally, there will be one that it doesn't fully extract and the next round gets caught going up.  Once I drop the bag, the empty shell drops out freely, and it isn't bulged or stuck or anything.

 

It's a really intermittent problem.  I fired about 200 rounds this morning and it happened 3 times.  I took it home and took the extractor out and cleaned it really well and oiled the gun.  I went back and fired another 160 rounds and it happened 4 more times.  It's just infrequent enough that you think maybe it went away, and then it happens.  

 

I'm firing my own reloads.  1.135" OAL, 200 grain xTreme, 3.84 grains of Titegroup for an average of 830 fps and a power factor of 166 over the chrono today.  I actually sent the gun off twice, and the first time it came back it was having the issue too, so I went and bought some Blazer Brass factory ammo to try to rule out the ammo, and the Blazer did it too.  I'll grab some more factory ammo now that it's back a second time, and just be sure it isn't the ammo.. but it's the same loads (even some of them are from the same batch) that I shot prior to sending it away.

 

What should I look at for the cause?

 

Here's a picture of what it looks like when it jams:

 

 

Edited by Dlister70
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when they cerakoted. did they take the extractor out? is the extractor coated?

make sure there is no paint in the extractor slot or on the sides of extractor that contact top and bottom of the slot.

 

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So this was or was no occurring before the Cerkote? By the looks of the pic the extractor itself was coated as well?

Does the extractor move freely in the channel or does it drag? Just wondering if the coating in the channel and on the extractor added enough thickness to keep the extractor from pivoting freely?

I had a similar random extraction issue start last year out of the clear blue. I dicked around with springs and polishing but it wasn't resolved until I installed a new extractor.

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I'd say it's extractor related. Can you take the extractor out and see if it's hook is coated. If so I'd probably try to remove the coating where it hooks the rim of the brass or just buy a back up extractor for like 40 $ I think. My TS came with a spare one I think. If you get anew extractor and it doesn't fix the problem you at least have a spare. 

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They did cerekote the extractor, but it doesn't look like it's rubbing from what I can tell.  The inside channel and the extractor itself are the same color as the slide, so perhaps the thickness has gone up enough to make a difference?

 

It never had an extraction issue prior to being sent off.  

 

I did not oil the slide when I got it back as I could see some oil dripping out when I was just racking the slide, but I did oil it prior to the second visit this afternoon and still had the issue.

 

I was a little unclear in my original post, but I sent it off to be hard chromed a few months back.  When I got it back, there were cosmetic issues that I didn't like and it now had this extraction issue.  So I sent it back to fix the cosmetic hard chrome issues and he said he'd look at the extraction while he had it.  He changed the spring during this second visit and said it worked fine for him.  I ended up getting the gun cerekoted on the second visit instead of hard chrome due to a series of events that led to the hard chrome showing too many flaws in the frame.  Just got the gun back yesterday and took it out today to test fire and found it still had extraction issues.

 

Here is the extractor slot with the extractor removed.  I'm not sure if the spring is supposed to look like that, as I've never had it off before.  It looks like a big spring with a little spring inside it:

 

 

 

 

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One of my shooting buddies asked me to wiggle the extractor, and I can move it without a great deal of force.  It has resistance, but I can wiggle it fairly easily.  He said it should be pretty difficult to move.  I took out my M&P and I can barely move the extractor with my finger.  I don't have another CZ to compare against, so that was the closest comparison I could make.  

 

I wonder if my spring shot across the shop floor during disassembly the first time and was replaced by the wrong type of spring?

 

I'm going to go ahead and order a new spring and a new extractor and see that'll take care of it.

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The spring was indeed wrong.  

 

 

Left side is what was in the gun.  Right side is an OEM spring.  

 

The guy doing the finish said he had changed the spring, and I didn't know what it was supposed to look like, so I didn't realize it was wrong.  

 

Shot 150 rounds this morning with just the new OEM spring, and it worked like a champ using the old extractor.  I wondered why my Tek mat didn't show two extractor springs.. :)

Edited by Dlister70
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On 4/13/2017 at 9:46 PM, Dlister70 said:

One of my shooting buddies asked me to wiggle the extractor, and I can move it without a great deal of force.  It has resistance, but I can wiggle it fairly easily.  He said it should be pretty difficult to move.  I took out my M&P and I can barely move the extractor with my finger.  I don't have another CZ to compare against, so that was the closest comparison I could make.  

 

I wonder if my spring shot across the shop floor during disassembly the first time and was replaced by the wrong type of spring?

 

I'm going to go ahead and order a new spring and a new extractor and see that'll take care of it.

I still can't believe that was what we found as the spring. I'm actually more surprised it managed to eject most of the time.

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5 minutes ago, SlvrDragon50 said:

I still can't believe that was what we found as the spring. I'm actually more surprised it managed to eject most of the time.

 

This is what I found when googling for dual extractor springs.  I don't know if it's a common mod, but apparently it is a thing that exists:

 

http://www.czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=14695.0

 

Even so, it still doesn't look like what was in mine.

Edited by Dlister70
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1 minute ago, Dlister70 said:

 

This is what I found when googling for dual extractor springs.  I don't know if it's a common mod, but apparently it is a thing that exists:

 

http://www.czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=14695.0

Interesting. I don't think I've ever seen anyone do that. The outer spring looks taller than the one we pulled out so probably cut off too many coils. I wonder why it had no issue before though.

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