RO cert.

[Broski]

I'm looking to get certified as an RO. Is it there anywhere I can search for classes that are being offered?

[Sarge]

NROI section of uspsa.org keeps a list of scheduled seminars.

 

Seminars are not an every day occurrence so be prepared to travel

[L3324temp]

https://www.uspsa.org/uspsa-NROI-class-schedule.php


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[CHLChris]

I've been keeping an eye out for one in my area for over a year and...nothing.  I will probably be traveling away from Oregon one of these days.  That's unfortunate.  I think more people being RO's is good for the sport. 

[Bkreutz]

1 hour ago, CHLChris said:

I've been keeping an eye out for one in my area for over a year and...nothing.  I will probably be traveling away from Oregon one of these days.  That's unfortunate.  I think more people being RO's is good for the sport. 

You must have missed it. One of my shooting buddies went to one last year in Eugene (I think, it was somewhere in west central OR) They're kind of hit and miss. A club has to want to do one, then get enough interested bodies that want to get certified, and then arrange for an instructor. Takes quite a bit of organization. I'm on the lookout for a CRO class within driving distance.

[CHLChris]

I think when I saw that one I was early enough in my search that I didn't yet realize they are so rare.  Otherwise I would have gone.  That's just a 3-hour drive, no biggie.  I just thought that every major club did one a year or something.  I am discovering that I may have to drive some distance to get to one if I want to actually take the class.  I really like keeping score, but I'd rather hold the timer now and then and yell, "Are you ready?!"

 

Let me take this opportunity in this thread to ask a question.  I've been offered many times to take a turn RO'ing and I always turn it down.  What are some steps I should take to get to the point that I feel more comfortable dipping my toe in the water at a local level 1?

[davsco]

just watch other people running shooters and take the best practices.  the #1 thing is safety - downrange is clear, shooter has eyes and ears. targets are reset and pasted.  while shooting, muzzle is always downrange.  finger is outside trigger guard unless actually shooting.  you watch them unload, drop the mag, see the empty chamber and gun in holster.  THEN and only then do you worry about their time and score.  read and learn and say the commands and only the commands.

[DKnoch]

I think when I saw that one I was early enough in my search that I didn't yet realize they are so rare.  Otherwise I would have gone.  That's just a 3-hour drive, no biggie.  I just thought that every major club did one a year or something.  I am discovering that I may have to drive some distance to get to one if I want to actually take the class.  I really like keeping score, but I'd rather hold the timer now and then and yell, "Are you ready?!"
 
Let me take this opportunity in this thread to ask a question.  I've been offered many times to take a turn RO'ing and I always turn it down.  What are some steps I should take to get to the point that I feel more comfortable dipping my toe in the water at a local level 1?

Read the rule book, get down the proper range commands and learn what is procedural penalties and what is allowable per the rules. Also make sure you know how to properly score targets (perf's, overlapping targets, etc). More than half the guys running the timer at a level 1 get a lot of all the above wrong. Ive seen guys take the RO class and still get some of that stuff wrong

Daniel K

[Edge40]

I am in the process of organizing a RO class.  When I started the process I thought the class would fill up in a heart beat.  My club is active and one of 2 in my area.  I thought when the club emails went out my email would explode and it would be filled in minutes.  unfortunately that wasn't the case.  This sport is popular but its just not to the point that these classes are in high demand.  If you see something close jump on it and tell your buddies.  

[davsco]

took me a few years to finally sign up for a class.  would much rather shoot a match sat and also sunday than both days in a class!  idpa does their class in a day.  uspsa might get a larger turnout with just a one day class.  the big prob for me was nothing really local so needed to stay and pay for an overnite near the class.

[zzt]

I think the only way to get the NROI course down to a day would be to completely eliminate the play acting and the shooting segments.  IMO, both of those are important aspects of the course, where you learn a lot.  Removing them would be just reading the book and explaining what the rules mean.  The practical aspects are more important.

 

BTW, a club where I shoot offered a RO course, and it was very well attended.  At the USPSA shoot yesterday, there were six ROs (including me) on the first squad.

[Sarge]

18 hours ago, Edge40 said:

I am in the process of organizing a RO class.  When I started the process I thought the class would fill up in a heart beat.  My club is active and one of 2 in my area.  I thought when the club emails went out my email would explode and it would be filled in minutes.  unfortunately that wasn't the case.  This sport is popular but its just not to the point that these classes are in high demand.  If you see something close jump on it and tell your buddies.  

Yeah. When I hosted one it was because 50 people were begging for one. When I did schedule it I struggled to get enough signed to break even

[jester121]

8 hours ago, zzt said:

I think the only way to get the NROI course down to a day would be to completely eliminate the play acting and the shooting segments.  IMO, both of those are important aspects of the course, where you learn a lot.  Removing them would be just reading the book and explaining what the rules mean.  The practical aspects are more important.

 

 

I bet you could get the book-reading part down to 4-6 meaningful hours, leaving 2-3 hours for the practical demo. A lot of the lecture material is just really dry and of limited value, compared with all the important stuff that new ROs need to be learning. 

 

No time for the overnight take-home exam, which is a negative, but I bet a ton more people would become certified if it wasn't a 2-day adventure.

[Sarge]

1 hour ago, jester121 said:

 

I bet you could get the book-reading part down to 4-6 meaningful hours, leaving 2-3 hours for the practical demo. A lot of the lecture material is just really dry and of limited value, compared with all the important stuff that new ROs need to be learning. 

 

No time for the overnight take-home exam, which is a negative, but I bet a ton more people would become certified if it wasn't a 2-day adventure.

The course isn't long enough as it is in my opinion.

 

This seems like a good place to plug my idea again. I think the best way to train brand new RO's is locally under the tutullage of specially trained CRO's. CROI's if you will. Provide CROI's with a lesson plan and make it self paced. Once the candidate has passed all blocks of training let DNROI send him a test to complete.

 No RMI travel costs, no hotel cost, no food cost and no $800 minimum to HQ. 

[MAC702]

23 hours ago, davsco said:

... you watch them unload, drop the mag, see the empty chamber and gun in holster.  THEN and only then do you worry about their time and score.  read and learn and say the commands and only the commands.

And be prepared to politely tell a shooter to wait for your commands, as some will quickly go through the motions, especially when they are far more experienced than the RO.  I've had many, especially the faster/experienced guys, through my stages that pop the round out, catch it, show me the chamber, drop the slide, pull their trigger, and on are their way to the holster by the time I can say, "Please do not get ahead of the commands; let's go back to 'show clear.'"  Every single time, they apologize and admit they shouldn't do that.

 

I agree with Sarge about streamlining and localizing the process.  The RO class makes better competitors in addition to better ROs.  There is nothing so special about being a local RO that should require a national instructor.

[Edge40]

I had a few people drop when they found out it was a full two day class.  Its a shame but it is what it is.

[Jerome]

Maybe there should be an online course plus local certification by a local CRO or RM. The local part could take place at a local match or two. Maybe some pre-match instruction then during match observation and instruction. One could get certified pretty much anytime there is a match and CRO or RM available.

[Batmo]

Just recently completed an RO class and passed the test. So now I'm a RRO (Rookie Range Officer)  Not quite ready for the Big Time.  I'm glad the class took two days....there is so much information that an abbreviated course...IMO would lack some important information.

I'd like to THANK  Eric and Kathy Hill for organizing the certification class and Carl Schmidt for his professional instruction of the course.

[Sarge]

1 hour ago, Batmo said:

Just recently completed an RO class and passed the test. So now I'm a RRO (Rookie Range Officer)  Not quite ready for the Big Time.  I'm glad the class took two days....there is so much information that an abbreviated course...IMO would lack some important information.

I'd like to THANK  Eric and Kathy Hill for organizing the certification class and Carl Schmidt for his professional instruction of the course.

Thanks for stepping up and becoming an RRO! That's more than most are willing to do.

[louu]

I just got mine to and now I don't think I want to shoot USPSA anymore. It made me realize that about half of the stages I shot over the last three years were illegal and half of the guys shooting were either cheating or don't know the rules. I myself am guilty of one offense, I had my SS holster about a 1/2" to low. 

[IHAVEGAS]

On 3/13/2017 at 7:06 PM, Sarge said:

The course isn't long enough as it is in my opinion.

 

This seems like a good place to plug my idea again. I think the best way to train brand new RO's is locally under the tutullage of specially trained CRO's. CROI's if you will. Provide CROI's with a lesson plan and make it self paced. Once the candidate has passed all blocks of training let DNROI send him a test to complete.

 No RMI travel costs, no hotel cost, no food cost and no $800 minimum to HQ. 

 

That would do it. 

I think a professionally done training class video would be cheap and fairly easy also. Supplement with a 4 hour live fire event and you are good to go.

Computer based training for safety and technical topics has worked well since the 1980's. It is proven and getting it done ain't rocket surgery. 

 

But I have already got my card so, whatever  .

[Thomas H]

Many people aren't good teachers, and just because someone is a good CRO, doesn't make them good at relating that information to someone else in a way in which they'd actually learn it.

 

Training class videos----don't really work.  They don't.  People don't retain much information having only heard/seen it on a video screen.  (Not to mention that once a video starts playing, most people don't pay that much attention---or they think it is a movie that you experience, as opposed to a learning event that you have to actively work with.)

 

"Computer based training for safety and technical topics has worked well since the 1980's. "

Actually, while it has been used, that isn't the same as it being effective.  There is a significant difference between "used to prove training occurred for insurance purposes" and "used to train people to effectively do something."  While some computer training (more interactive, includes practice) can work, video-based training with a quiz at the end doesn't really work in terms of actual learning.

 

There's a reason that the NRA is working on dumping the whole "video training" thing for classes.

[Sarge]

A verified CROI system would work and would save everybody serious money as a side effect.

 

There are RMI's that can't teach either. If you deny that you're just being politically correct.

 

 

[IHAVEGAS]

9 hours ago, Thomas H said:

 

Training class videos----don't really work.  They don't.  People don't retain much information having only heard/seen it on a video screen.  (Not to mention that once a video starts playing, most people don't pay that much attention---or they think it is a movie that you experience, as opposed to a learning event that you have to actively work with.)

 

"Computer based training for safety and technical topics has worked well since the 1980's. "

Actually, while it has been used, that isn't the same as it being effective.  There is a significant difference between "used to prove training occurred for insurance purposes" and "used to train people to effectively do something."  While some computer training (more interactive, includes practice) can work, video-based training with a quiz at the end doesn't really work in terms of actual learning.

 

There's a reason that the NRA is working on dumping the whole "video training" thing for classes.

 

Computer based training works for some pretty long haired technical courses at universitys, it is also the most commonly used safety training method I was exposed to in industry. 

If folks in the shooting sports do not want to use it that is fine, but the outside world is using it every day and to good effect.

 

I think there is more daydreaming and lack of focus in a traditional classroom than in self paced computer/video training, and PC training avoids all the issues of poor teachers and inconsistency between teachers. 

 

But I agree with you that any training without independent result testing and verification could be abused.

 

[tanks]

On 3/19/2017 at 4:38 AM, Thomas H said:

Many people aren't good teachers, and just because someone is a good CRO, doesn't make them good at relating that information to someone else in a way in which they'd actually learn it.

 

Training class videos----don't really work.  They don't.  People don't retain much information having only heard/seen it on a video screen.  (Not to mention that once a video starts playing, most people don't pay that much attention---or they think it is a movie that you experience, as opposed to a learning event that you have to actively work with.)

 

"Computer based training for safety and technical topics has worked well since the 1980's. "

Actually, while it has been used, that isn't the same as it being effective.  There is a significant difference between "used to prove training occurred for insurance purposes" and "used to train people to effectively do something."  While some computer training (more interactive, includes practice) can work, video-based training with a quiz at the end doesn't really work in terms of actual learning.

 

There's a reason that the NRA is working on dumping the whole "video training" thing for classes.

 

Well, I have been through quite a bit of technical training using videos and webinars and I'd say they work. Especially if one can repeat them at one's leisure. The trick I think would be to break down into easily digestible chunks for the RO training. 30 or 60 minute chunks instead of one big video that lasts hours.