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Black Bullets International 9mm Accuracy


Frieday

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1 hour ago, Sandbagger123 said:

You are belling way too much. Also it looks like you are doing seating and crimp with the same die?  

 

I am using the Dillon die set for 9mm.  Seating in station 4, and crimping in station 5.  

I am leaning towards what TDA mentioned about the seating die actually compressing the bell before the bullet is seated all the way.

Maybe that, in conjunction with my seating die not 100% concentric to the case, is causing some bullets to tilt enough to get shaved during seating.

 

I wonder if I am belling too much for the seating die??

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You're definitely ruining those bullets while seating them.  My guess would be one or more of the following:

 

Not enough flare.

Not seating the bullets straight enough when you place them on the flared case.  You can get away with being sloppy here with jacketed bullets...but plated/coated/lead are much more delicate.

When you tightened the lock ring for your seating die (or any of the other dies), was the shell plate full & ram up, and a cartridge with a bullet inside the seating die?

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4 hours ago, Gun Phan said:

Get this:

https://www.shootersconnectionstore.com/MrBulletFeeder-by-DAA-Powder-Funnel-for-Pistol-P2708.aspx

 

It flares more of the mid area of the brass, and not over flares the mouth.  Fix the lead shavings.

 

I'm curious what Dillon's position is on this.  I assume in using the Mr. Bullet Feeder funnels, you're giving up some degree of neck tension in exchange for easier bullet seating.

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49 minutes ago, Frieday said:

 

I am using the Dillon die set for 9mm.  Seating in station 4, and crimping in station 5.  

I am leaning towards what TDA mentioned about the seating die actually compressing the bell before the bullet is seated all the way.

Maybe that, in conjunction with my seating die not 100% concentric to the case, is causing some bullets to tilt enough to get shaved during seating.

 

I wonder if I am belling too much for the seating die??

what i think is happening is that it a combo of longer 9mm cases and your seating die down a little too much .  turn the seating die out a maybe half a turn or one turn and reset the seating depth.   as stated before set the bell to .380 with a case in the middle range of lengths .  you will be surprised how much 9mm varies in length.   set the crimp to .378./9  

try this and get back to us with the results . 

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1 hour ago, njl said:

.380 at the case mouth is not enough bell for 9mm.  AFAIK, Dillon recommends 0.010-0.020" of bell...which would be .390-0.400.

a sized unflared case measures .370/1.  so .380/1 is enough bell i have found in my experience.  i loaded  thousand fmj/plated/coated and have not had any issues. bell too much and one might see setback issues 

 

here is what dillion says

 

https://www.dillonprecision.com/proper-amount-of-bell-9mm_350_16_3423.htm

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UPDATE:

 

I think I may have found a solution.  TDA was right on the money!  My Dillon seating die was compressing the bell during seating, causing some bullets to be shaved.

The Dillon seating die that I have does not have an adjustment for seating depth that is independent of the actual die height.  Meaning the distance between the part of the die that makes contact with the top of the bullet and the bottom of the die (where the case engages and is compressing my bell) is fixed.  The only adjustment is to raise and lower the entire die to change seating depth.

 

My solution is to use my Lee seating/crimp die.  The die has a two part adjustment.  One for seating depth and the other for crimp.  I set this die up in my 650 in place of the Dillon seating die.  I set the height of the die so that it would not crimp and then I set my .seating depth.

 

I ran a bunch of rounds through.  Belling to .380 with the M die, and crimping to .378.  The M die does a really nice job.  When I place the bullet on the case, I can get a nice concentric placement as deep as the lube groove.  So I know the bullet is straight.  I pulled apart 10 after using this set up and found no shaving of lead or coating.

 

I'm going to try some accuracy testing later today.  Thank you all for your input.

 

Here are some pics of the Dillon Seating Die and then the Lee combo seating/crimp die in the press for reference.

 

IMG_2587.jpg

IMG_2588.jpg

 

IMG_2586.jpg

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Buy a Hornady NEW DIMENSION (not their American series) seating die, then crimp separately.  

Personally, I size at station 1, bell at station 2 with Redding expander (which is a clone of the Lyman M-Die), powder charge at station 3, seat at station 4, and crimp at station 5.

 

The only machines I trust to verify powder charge are the ones in my eye sockets. ;) 

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Just wanted to update on accuracy after replacing the Dillon seating die with the Lee.

Granted this Dan Wesson is leaps and bounds better than my Spartan, but these groups are excellent.

This is that 160gr Bayou load at 7, 15 and 25 yrds.

 

IMG_2589.jpg

IMG_2590.jpg

IMG_2591.jpg

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