ChemistShooter Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 I am experimenting with Power Pistol. The top three are my normal load, 3.9gr TiteGroup using .356 Eggleston 115gr OAL 1.149. The bottom two are the same except using 5.0 gr Power Pistol. The Power Pistol primer pits are definitely bigger, maybe twice as much. No rim on the pits but definitely bigger. No question the brass is hitting the striker a lot harder. Too much? The weird thing is the kick didn't feel any different. I also noticed a bright white flash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superdude Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 1. Picture is too blurry. 2. Craters/pits too deep? Is this supposed to be a symptom of something bad? In other words, why do you think this is a problem? 3. What gun are these fired in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 2 hours ago, ChemistShooter said: I am experimenting with Power Pistol. The top three are my normal load, 3.9gr TiteGroup using .356 Eggleston 115gr OAL 1.149. The bottom two are the same except using 5.0 gr Power Pistol. The Power Pistol primer pits are definitely bigger, maybe twice as much. No rim on the pits but definitely bigger. No question the brass is hitting the striker a lot harder. Too much? The weird thing is the kick didn't feel any different. I also noticed a bright white flash. Bright white flash is a trademark of PP. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDA Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 2 hours ago, ChemistShooter said: No question the brass is hitting the striker a lot harder. ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve RA Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 I guess you mean the firing pin is hitting the primer harder ??? Are the primers the same with the two loads ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ETXhiker Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 Hmmm. If the load is 5.0 grains of Power Pistol under a 115 gr. bullet, that is a rather light load. I would expect dirty cases at that pressure more than likely. What you usually look for with primers is cratering around the firing pin strike and flattening of the primer near the edges. I see none of that in your photos. Please note, that these pressure signs are not to be relied on - harder primers will show pressure signs later, and by the time you see flattening, you are already getting up there pressure wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChemistShooter Posted March 7, 2017 Author Share Posted March 7, 2017 Fired out of an XDM 9mm 3.8 Full-Size. Not chronoed. This was the first test load to see if the charge would cycle the gun. I used Lyman lead data to estimate a load. Yeah, the brass on top is FC but Blazer with that load looks exactly the same as the FC. The PP crater difference is due to the PP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxkingxx Posted March 7, 2017 Share Posted March 7, 2017 I load 5gr Pwr Pistol for 1039-1043 fps w/124 RN. Gives 127-129 PF. For IDPA/USPSA match power factor. 5.6 is awesome accuracy which I load for longer range KD's. Bit more punch but not noticeable at run speeds. Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChemistShooter Posted March 7, 2017 Author Share Posted March 7, 2017 I used all the numbers I had developed for the TiteGroup load, which has been working fine for several thousand rounds. Everything was the same except the PP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xanatos903 Posted March 12, 2017 Share Posted March 12, 2017 On 3/7/2017 at 3:51 PM, xxkingxx said: I load 5gr Pwr Pistol for 1039-1043 fps w/124 RN. Gives 127-129 PF. For IDPA/USPSA match power factor. 5.6 is awesome accuracy which I load for longer range KD's. Bit more punch but not noticeable at run speeds. Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk Yeah, my minor load is 5.2gr PP with a 124 rn. 5.0gr is crazy light with a 115. My kind of regular load for a 115 HP was 6.0gr PP, a full grain higher than what you've got going, OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9x45 Posted March 12, 2017 Share Posted March 12, 2017 Cases are not the same, weigh them and you will see. So with two different cases, you can't compare them because the primer will seat differently. What primer? And 5 grains of PP is very very light. Here is what real pressure looks like on the right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9x45 Posted March 12, 2017 Share Posted March 12, 2017 (edited) Chem, how clean was that brass before firing? Dirty cases are also a sign of too light of a load. By the way, dem Egglestons is some ugly looking bullets, ok, they are polycoated, and not HiTek (good looking bullets). Bayous is clean. Edited March 12, 2017 by 9x45 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChemistShooter Posted March 13, 2017 Author Share Posted March 13, 2017 Cases after cleaning were clean but dull. CCI primers. Hmm, I did notice after firing the interiors of the PP cases were cleaner than TiteGroup. Point taken about different cases. I'll try it again with matched cases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superdude Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 Chemistshooter, based on the responses, have you determined the answer to your question? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
9x45 Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 Chem, you want them to be clean and shiny for reloading. Makes it easier to read a case after firing. SS wet walnut, then corn dry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChemistShooter Posted March 13, 2017 Author Share Posted March 13, 2017 19 hours ago, superdude said: Chemistshooter, based on the responses, have you determined the answer to your question? Yeah, I think so.Got a little bit of a crater but the primers are not flattened. Going to eventually make another pass with the same load and matched cases. Might set up the chrono for this one, keeping in mind you can still have overpressures even with what looks like light loads. I sorta wonder what a set-up to measure CUPs would cost. I make my living handling gadgets like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superdude Posted March 13, 2017 Share Posted March 13, 2017 9 minutes ago, ChemistShooter said: Yeah, I think so.Got a little bit of a crater but the primers are not flattened. Going to eventually make another pass with the same load and matched cases. Might set up the chrono for this one, keeping in mind you can still have overpressures even with what looks like light loads. I sorta wonder what a set-up to measure CUPs would cost. I make my living handling gadgets like that. Your load is very, very light. The odds of 5.0 gr of PP and a 115 grain bullet at 1.149" being overpressure are close to zero. 5.0 gr is just above the start load in the Hornady manual for 115 gr jacketed bullets, and they top out at 6.7 gr. The Alliant manual shows 6.7 gr as max with a 115 grain bullet. You're on the low end of pressure. With respect to CUP measurements, you might find this information useful if you don't already have it... http://saami.org/specifications_and_information/publications/download/Z299-3_ANSI-SAAMI _CFPandR.pdf#page=10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDA Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 (edited) Deleted Edited March 14, 2017 by TDA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDA Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 I give up! How do you post images on this site?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superdude Posted March 14, 2017 Share Posted March 14, 2017 24 minutes ago, 57K said: The thing about CUP testing is that it's about finding Max Pressure, while the piezoelectric transducer in the PSI systems look at the total spectrum of Pressure/Time from ignition to Max Pressure. There's been debate about which is best yet some component makers have switched back to the CUP method. One reason we have 2 different pressure standards for the 9 x 19mm. 35,000 PSI and 33,000 CUP. Their essentially the same Max pressure. Who has switched back to the CUP method? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChemistShooter Posted March 14, 2017 Author Share Posted March 14, 2017 23 hours ago, superdude said: Your load is very, very light. The odds of 5.0 gr of PP and a 115 grain bullet at 1.149" being overpressure are close to zero. 5.0 gr is just above the start load in the Hornady manual for 115 gr jacketed bullets, and they top out at 6.7 gr. The Alliant manual shows 6.7 gr as max with a 115 grain bullet. You're on the low end of pressure. With respect to CUP measurements, you might find this information useful if you don't already have it... http://saami.org/specifications_and_information/publications/download/Z299-3_ANSI-SAAMI _CFPandR.pdf#page=10 I know it was supposed to be light. The depth of the primer had me feeling a little paranoid, though. Thanks for the link. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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