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Diagnose Dip on the 2nd shot


Sporky

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At my last range session, I started speeding things up and I noticed that the 2nd shot was low.  I attributed that to the spring being too heavy but I wanted to ask all of you just to make sure.

 

I have no idea what the weight is on the recoil spring now so there is that....

 

Where do I start on an open gun when I am looking to try new springs?

 

Thanks

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Sounds like anticipating the shot and pushing forward. Could be your wrist is breaking down. If you are certain that isn't the problem, it could be your recoil spring. I run a 7 lb spring on my 38 SC. I do have to replace them more often than with the 9 lb spring I used before. 

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Are you running a thumb rest?  if you are you could be driving the gun on the second shot.



That is very astute, good suggestion. I have a buddy that started running one for the first time and he had problems with the second shot. He eventually gave up and removed it.



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Yep I do have a gas pedal.  

And yes to new gun, new to open, and new to thumbrest.

 

No slowmo video.........I will keep all those suggestions in mind and do some work.

 

Thanks Guys

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The thumb rest is a nice feature. But you need to adjust it so it's as forward as possible to where the pad of your thumb still reaches it. I found setting it to close causes the weak hand thumb to arch up and that causes to much down push as well as pushing to the strong hand side. Recoil. Springs as previously play a big part in dip...stronger springs exert more force to the forward slide motion. Depending on the weight of your slide, steel or polymer grip, comp weight, and load will determine the spring weight. There is no exact answer as to the best weight. You gotta buy different weights and try them. My 38SC has a 10.85oz slide, Ti comp, 170pf load, and steel grip. This setup works best with an 8lb. Reality is muzzle dip will come and go with grip too. So don't go crazy trying to eliminate it completely, just minimize it to where your happy with shot placement on double taps.


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23 hours ago, CHLChris said:

How about a crazy thought... Don't double tap.  If you're double tapping then only your first shot is getting a sight picture.  Are you even seeing the dot on your second shot?

Exactly.  Bullet goes where gun is pointed.  If you dont know if its pointed at target when you fire, fix that problem.

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Are you running a thumbrest? If so you are using it too much, tighten your grip and loosen your thumb pressure.

 

duhh... I didn't read much :-)

Edited by 3gunDQ
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Well that was a mix of helpful and @$$Hole.

I am new to open but not new to uspsa.  I Didn't have this issue with my open gun, but the follow up shot in open is much faster.  

When I was shooting limited, there were times  on close targets i would just pull the trigger as fast as I could.  Now with open, when I pull as fast as I can on close targets, I am getting a Low second shot.  I was guessing that the recoil spring is just a bit too heavy and making the dip at the end when I have to hose at the close ones.

 

 

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Sporky, try the springs in the 8lb range.   But...for me, I have noticed depending on hearing protection, you could be "finching"?    Try different hearing protection and you may will notice how the sound can be harsh or muffled, depending on what you choose.

Hearing protection with open guns, is not something to take lightly.

Where i practice, one berm is an enclosed area.    The side baffles of the comp, do make for a sound wave against the berm and I do feel a vibration, in my ear canal, if I do not "double up" on hearing protection.

As always, just a thought.

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16 minutes ago, kimberacp said:

Sporky, try the springs in the 8lb range.   But...for me, I have noticed depending on hearing protection, you could be "finching"?    Try different hearing protection and you may will notice how the sound can be harsh or muffled, depending on what you choose.

Hearing protection with open guns, is not something to take lightly.

Where i practice, one berm is an enclosed area.    The side baffles of the comp, do make for a sound wave against the berm and I do feel a vibration, in my ear canal, if I do not "double up" on hearing protection.

As always, just a thought.

Good suggestion.  I have custom in ear ones that I had made at a match last season. I can barely hear anything at all with them in.  Everyone says how loud my gun is, but it sounds just like anything else I shoot with my particular ear pro.

 

I will try some different springs this week and report back with what I find.  Does everyone use the Wolf springs you can get at Shooters Connection?

 

Thanks again

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I

14 hours ago, JimF38sup said:

You did mention what your load is. With 115 jhp and certain loads my open gun has so much gas it dips. It is not natural to have to raise the gun for the second shot.

 

I am using: Zero 125 HP AA#7 10.1 gr

 

The muzzle rise isn't bad at all, and pretty darn accurate.

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