RN826 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 I was at a match recently where 2 RO's DQ'd a shooter for ammo at the safe area. Later in the match, he shot the classifier stage "with special permission from the MD/RM". Anyone hear of this happening before? Also the MD happens to be the section coordinator as well, and it was one of his best friends that was the shooter that was DQ'd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mach1soldier Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 This should get good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kraj Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Did he also get to use his open gun in production? If your going to make up the rules might as well go big. 10.3.1 A competitor who commits a safety infraction or any other prohibited activity during an USPSA match will be disqualified from that match, and will be prohibited from attempting any remaining courses of fire in that match regardless of the schedule or physical layout of the match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Jones Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 NROI can (confidentially) address these issues if the specifics are reported. Without an attempt to fix these things, they just get worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJH Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 7 hours ago, RN826 said: I was at a match recently where 2 RO's DQ'd a shooter for ammo at the safe area. Later in the match, he shot the classifier stage "with special permission from the MD/RM". Anyone hear of this happening before? Also the MD happens to be the section coordinator as well, and it was one of his best friends that was the shooter that was DQ'd It is the little known "Buddy Pass" rule. 10.2.2.2.2.9.9.3.4.1. It is not what you know or follow, i.e. the rules, it's who you know and are buddies with, such as the ROs or the match director. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IHAVEGAS Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Have seen a shooter pay extra fees to be allowed to shoot the classifier in more than 1 division. Not sure how this works when there is a dq in one division. Else, the shooter was punished for the dq, albeit not as thoroughly as normal. Not something high on my list of things to fret over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbarnett50 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 DQ ends your day no matter how many guns you are shooting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Round_Gun_Shooter Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 7 hours ago, mach1soldier said: This should get good. My thought exactly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximis228 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 You should name the club and MD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schutzenmeister Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 49 minutes ago, Maximis228 said: You should name the club and MD. You should NOT publically name the club and MD ... We really don't need that information. You SHOULD report eh matter, to include the MD/SC's name to your AD and DNROI. I strongly believe it will be appropriately investigated and dealt with. Praise in public, discipline in private ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximis228 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 (edited) 21 minutes ago, Schutzenmeister said: You should NOT publically name the club and MD ... We really don't need that information. You SHOULD report eh matter, to include the MD/SC's name to your AD and DNROI. I strongly believe it will be appropriately investigated and dealt with. Praise in public, discipline in private ... You are right.... Just sweep it under the rug. Edited February 21, 2017 by Maximis228 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IHAVEGAS Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 9 hours ago, RN826 said: Later in the match, he shot the classifier stage "with special permission from the MD/RM". Maybe before the Spanish inquisition goes for a nuclear option. You are saying that he shot the classifier as part of a squad and the score was submitted to USPSA, you are not saying that he was just allowed to shoot off to the side and separate from the match for no score? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IHAVEGAS Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 1 hour ago, jbarnett50 said: DQ ends your day no matter how many guns you are shooting. Good info, 10.3.1 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motosapiens Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, jbarnett50 said: DQ ends your day no matter how many guns you are shooting. correction, ends your *match*, not your day. Edited February 21, 2017 by motosapiens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schutzenmeister Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 1 hour ago, Maximis228 said: You are right.... Just sweep it under the rug. That deserves a condescending retort ... Though I won't give you the satisfaction. Reporting it up the chain, through proper channels is NOT sweeping it under the rug. It is a reasonable and appropriate way to handle the situation. Creating a kangaroo court here on a public forum is a disservice to the individuals involved and the sport as a whole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximis228 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 No reason both cant be done. I find that USPSA, as an Org, isn't very forth coming unless pressure is put on. Public discussions tend to help out quite a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RN826 Posted February 21, 2017 Author Share Posted February 21, 2017 Maybe before the Spanish inquisition goes for a nuclear option. You are saying that he shot the classifier as part of a squad and the score was submitted to USPSA, you are not saying that he was just allowed to shoot off to the side and separate from the match for no score? It was going to be uploaded, but one of the RO's called him after the match and said something, so he changed it and said that he wasn't going to submit the classifier for the shooter, and he claimed he didn't know the shooter was DQ'd which is bull because he was immediately informedSent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jester121 Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 24 minutes ago, Maximis228 said: No reason both cant be done. I find that USPSA, as an Org, isn't very forth coming unless pressure is put on. Public discussions tend to help out quite a bit. Daylight is the best antiseptic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Jones Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 You can't complain about the system not working if you don't use the system. What may or may not have been true years ago no longer applies. Make USPSA great again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schutzenmeister Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 22 hours ago, Maximis228 said: No reason both cant be done. I find that USPSA, as an Org, isn't very forth coming unless pressure is put on. Public discussions tend to help out quite a bit. Public discussion is one thing. Public excoriation is something else. It is the modern equivalent of a lynch mob. George is 100% right ... Use the system; or at the very least, don't resort to kangaroo-court mentalities until the system has been given a reasonable chance to work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IHAVEGAS Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Would be interesting to know if any rules were actually broken. As I understand it the person was dq'd , and did not shoot any additional stage except the classifier and that score was not submitted. If he shot the classifier as part of the match that would be a no no under 10.3.1 , but if he shot it separate from the match I do not know of any rule that says he can't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schutzenmeister Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 24 minutes ago, IHAVEGAS said: If he shot the classifier as part of the match that would be a no no under 10.3.1 , but if he shot it separate from the match I do not know of any rule that says he can't. I suggest you read 10.3.1 ... "[...] will be disqualified from that match, and will be prohibited from attempting any remaining courses of fire in that match regardless of the schedule or physical layout of the match." The Classifier was (presumably) a CoF in that match. I don't see how that could be any clearer ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IHAVEGAS Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Just now, Schutzenmeister said: I suggest you read 10.3.1 ... "[...] will be disqualified from that match, and will be prohibited from attempting any remaining courses of fire in that match regardless of the schedule or physical layout of the match." The Classifier was (presumably) a CoF in that match. I don't see how that could be any clearer ... I read where it says "in that match" . Aside from the match there is nothing that says the stages can't be shot as many times as desired by anyone who wants to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teros135 Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 Yeah, but who wants a MD/RM who gives special treatment to his buds - or even appears to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IHAVEGAS Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 1 hour ago, teros135 said: Yeah, but who wants a MD/RM who gives special treatment to his buds - or even appears to? I do not know that he did. It is not unheard of to see a MD/RM be nice to a stranger. Perhaps something was done that was improper, my only point is that so far I don't see the details in this thread that would allow me to know that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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