lowball020 Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 Ok... So I've been searching and reading and doing my best to figure this out myself, but I still can't get this to work 100% and don't want to call it an ammo problem just yet. I think I just have the wrong combo spring/firing pin setup for 100% ignition. Here's what I know. New to me in December, so anything I didn't replace myself will be listed as Unsure, but could be stock. Limited Elite .40 Recoil Spring - 10# Trigger Return Spring - Standard Trigger EGD Semi Flat Henning Firing Pin Stock Hammer Hammer Spring - Unsure (13# absolutely didn't work) (I have 14 and 15# Wolff in the mailbox) Extractor Spring - Unsure Reem - Unsure Polished any metal/metal contact - by me... not mirror, but smoother than when I got it. I have been using Freedom Munitions NEW 180gr HP and have never had an issue with their ammo in the past when I was running 9mm. I have all the stock parts, but looking to see if any combo of what I have will help. I'm not opposed to spending some money to supplement the parts I already have, I'm just trying to avoid buying everything then have a bag of parts sitting around. Again... my apologies for starting a new thread on this, as there's a lot of info out there but nothing seems to fit the SAO Limited. Oh.. and as a bonus... a friend of mine runs a chrome business... so I can have any or all of this gun/parts chromed for free so that is on the table as well!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryridesmotox Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 (edited) In this order... Put original firing pin in. Hammer springs won't effect pull weight in single action as much as double, run a stock spring. Plunk test the ammo to make sure it spins and falls freely from the chamber after putting a round in the chamber and tappin it with your finger, if it doesnt, ream the chamber. Lastly, freedom uses rather hard primers, from my seperience. I've seen it not ignited by glocks... Which is ridiculous. Try some Winchester white box. Those primers are much lighter than FM's xtreme primers. That's where I'd start anyways. Edited February 13, 2017 by ryridesmotox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatriotDefense Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 In addition to the above go ahead and pull the FPB out of the slide as well, with your gun being SAO its one less thing to worry about if your FP is dragging across it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowball020 Posted February 13, 2017 Author Share Posted February 13, 2017 2 minutes ago, PatriotDefense said: In addition to the above go ahead and pull the FPB out of the slide as well, with your gun being SAO its one less thing to worry about if your FP is dragging across it. Already Gone (done before i got it)!!! 7 minutes ago, ryridesmotox said: In this order... Put original firing pin in. Hammer springs won't effect pull weight in single action as much as double, run a stock spring. Plunk test the ammo to make sure it spins and falls freely from the chamber after putting a round in the chamber and tappin it with your finger, if it doesnt, ream the chamber. Lastly, freedom uses rather hard primers, from my seperience. I've seen it not ignited by glocks... Which is ridiculous. Try some Winchester white box. Those primers are much lighter than FM's xtreme primers. That's where I'd start anyways. The only known hammer springs i have are the 13-15 wolff springs.... I'm guessing at the rest. I think the stock one is in there now.... but unknown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryridesmotox Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 (edited) I think your problems are primarily firing pin and primer related. I've heard, unconfirmed, that FM uses com-block primers from wolf rebranded as 'Xtreme primers"... Again, unconfirmed. Which, can be hit or miss as far as ease of ignition. Start with those two areas. By all means, run them through for practice or whatever. But switch to a known lighter primer like CCI, federal, or Winchester. As long as you aren't running a 10lbs spring, it should light off most garbage primers with a 12lbs in single action. I've not had a single failure to ignite in single action with my gun setup the way it is... Even with a 12lbs spring. Some of my factory ammo wouldn't go off in the first hit of double action. So I went with a heavier 14lbs spring. But it really didn't help because the factory primers weren't seated properly. Edited February 13, 2017 by ryridesmotox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowball020 Posted February 13, 2017 Author Share Posted February 13, 2017 Thank You!!! Putting the Stock FP in, going with the 15# Hammer Spring. - to help with the freedom reliability. I have another ammo source that loads his for appx 170pf and it came out of mine at 165.4pf and 167.1pf in two separate 4 round averages. He's going to be my source once the freedom is gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MemphisMechanic Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 @ryridesmotox is spot on. Do what he said. Also my gun showed 1/3lbs of change in single action pull weight going from a 13 pound to a 16.5lb EGD Medium spring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryridesmotox Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 44 minutes ago, lowball020 said: Thank You!!! Putting the Stock FP in, going with the 15# Hammer Spring. - to help with the freedom reliability. I have another ammo source that loads his for appx 170pf and it came out of mine at 165.4pf and 167.1pf in two separate 4 round averages. He's going to be my source once the freedom is gone. If you ever get chrono'd that's not enough cushion. You may ask him to reload them a bit hotter. And confirm he is using a softer primer. And seats them well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi-Power Jack Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 49 minutes ago, lowball020 said: 165.4pf and 167.1pf in two separate 4 round averages. I usually fire 20 rounds over the chrono, and I personally prefer that all 20 rounds are at minimum PF (for OPEN, at least 165). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronArcher Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 I would try 1 thing at a time.First I'd put in the heaviest spring you have.Test If not 100% change firing pinTest Also, be sure the firing pin channel (and pin) is well polished.I believe, that with the Stock Heart shaped hammer, Hennings pin is better than a stock pin.With a Titan, the PDO is going to be king for sure.I never had the EGD pin, so I can't comment on how well it may or may not with with the stock hammer.Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnbu Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 I would just order wolff 17# hammer spring and use the factory firing pin, the Patriot Defense pin and optimized trigger return and sear springs. Bang every time and will still be 3# pull with even a cursory polish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowball020 Posted February 13, 2017 Author Share Posted February 13, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, IronArcher said: I would try 1 thing at a time. First I'd put in the heaviest spring you have. Test If not 100% change firing pin Test Also, be sure the firing pin channel (and pin) is well polished. I believe, that with the Stock Heart shaped hammer, Hennings pin is better than a stock pin. With a Titan, the PDO is going to be king for sure. I never had the EGD pin, so I can't comment on how well it may or may not with with the stock hammer. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro I have a love hate relationship with troubleshooting.... I like changing 1 thing at a time, as I know for sure what the problem was... but then I want it fixed now.... LOL Good thing is I can strip this thing down at a match and replace just about anything I need on the fly. Single sided safety is awesome to allow access to everything at the rear of the gun without too much trouble!!! Oh... it's the Henning Pin... EGD Trigger. Heaviest known spring I have is the 15#. I think I'll pencil test them each... I know it won't match against the "official" test, but I'll at least be able to see the difference. Thanks for all the help guys... now to just apply it!!!! Edited February 13, 2017 by lowball020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronArcher Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 Based on my testing (of only my gun... YMMV) the Henning pin is my best choice.Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowball020 Posted February 13, 2017 Author Share Posted February 13, 2017 9 minutes ago, IronArcher said: Based on my testing (of only my gun... YMMV) the Henning pin is my best choice. What hammer spring do you use? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMcGowan Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 I use a 15 pound wolf in my limited to set off Tulas. These were loaded on a 1050. Agree with what was said above, I have used 16 pound hammer spring with not much difference in pull weight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronArcher Posted February 13, 2017 Share Posted February 13, 2017 What hammer spring do you use?Pretty much everything #13 up to #15.5. Next spring on the way is 16.5Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryridesmotox Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 Archer... Before you fix someone's gun over the internet... Did you get that safety working yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronArcher Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 Long ago. XFPBWas there some bit of advice you found dangerous? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryridesmotox Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 No. And I didn't say your advice was dangerous, I was merely being a smartass about your inability to get a simple aspect of your gun to work properly. But don't come in and muddy the waters with some asinine advice about a Henning firing pin being better. I've tried one in 3 different guns, At no point did it work better than a stock pin. It works far worse. Many others have tried them and gone back to a tanfo pin with much more reliable ignition. But hey, order a 20# wolf spring for that hammer... You're going to need it dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronArcher Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 Funny, I have tried the Henning, Stock, and PDO pin with various different springs. The Henning over all, in MY gun, worked best.I'll try them all again with the next spring, but at worst it was no worse than any other pin.... in my gun. At best, it was the best pin... in my gun.Based on that evidence (and literally about 300 DA rounds fired and 500 SA rounds fired only in testing), what advice would be logical for me to give?That the pin that has performed the worst should be his next step?Please do take this as antagonistically as it may sound.I'm not the most versed with these guns and components.But I have done more testing than most.My match on Sunday, I had a different pin in.Had FTFire on my first 2 stages. One was SA!I forgot to put the Henning pin back in after testing on Saturday. #15.5 and a heavy pin didn't do it.Put some shims in between stages, and then it ran 100% for the rest of the match. (And won the rest of those stages ).Sorry if I don't see the disadvantage to the Henning pin.Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryridesmotox Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 I'm not going to go back n forth with you about this. I have much better stuff to do with my time. I have 2 guns that both run better with lighter springs on any day of the week. Of the last 4 I tuned, all got tested with the 2 Henning pins I have, none of them ran as well as a tanfo pin. You're gun has issues that need to be solved. After you do, let us know how you did it, but until then, you need to stop muddying the waters with false info. Am I the end all be all for tanfos, hell no. But both of my guns run. Anyways, I'm done with this for the night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronArcher Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 False info?I am pretty sure I have repeatedly emphasized that MY gun runs better with the Henning pin.Yours may run better with the stock pin.I don't know what hammer you are running, or other mods done to your gun.I know that some of the stuff I have in mine was designed for the Titan hammer. I am not running the Titan hammer (much like the OP), hence the need for heavier springs.My tests are repeatable, and always show on MY gun, the Henning is better than the stock pin.I would like to know the "false info" I "need" to stop muddying the waters with.Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCTaylor Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 17 hours ago, IronArcher said: Based on my testing (of only my gun... YMMV) the Henning pin is my best choice. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro 10 hours ago, ryridesmotox said: No. And I didn't say your advice was dangerous, I was merely being a smartass about your inability to get a simple aspect of your gun to work properly. But don't come in and muddy the waters with some asinine advice about a Henning firing pin being better. I've tried one in 3 different guns, At no point did it work better than a stock pin. It works far worse. Many others have tried them and gone back to a tanfo pin with much more reliable ignition. But hey, order a 20# wolf spring for that hammer... You're going to need it dude. Ry simmer down bro. He clearly said in HIS GUN. Each gun is different, I asked if there was a secret in another thread with the answer an emphatic no. There appears to be 2 divergent schools of thought on setting up a Tanfo - A) Light & Fast (Henning Pin & Delta Hammer) and 'B) Heavy & Hard (PDO Pin & Titan Hammer). This petty bullshit is just stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MemphisMechanic Posted February 14, 2017 Share Posted February 14, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, SCTaylor said: There appears to be 2 divergent schools of thought on setting up a Tanfo - A) Light & Fast (Henning Pin & Delta Hammer) and 'B) Heavy & Hard (PDO Pin & Titan Hammer). There's another divide present too: Are you after the lightest possible trigger pull with designer ammo, or are you after a gun that eats anything you feed i? Edited February 14, 2017 by MemphisMechanic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowball020 Posted February 14, 2017 Author Share Posted February 14, 2017 Well coming from an M&P I was able to get my trigger pull down to 3.5. I've had this thing as low as 2 (with a damaged trigger return spring. Right now it's at appx 3.2 with a stock trigger return spring. I didn't have an increase going from a 13# hammer spring to the spring that came installed. As long as I'm around the 3# and can feed it anything, I will be happy. But right now... when I have a 16 round stage and have 3 LPS's... It doesn't matter how light the trigger is, my HF sucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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