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Tool head stabilization?


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I've noticed when going to empty the powder hopper there seems to be visual play between the tool head and the press. Is there a way to stabilize the tool head? If so does it still allow the tool head to be removed to dump the powder when finished reloading?

Thanks in advance from IGG!

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We advise to adjust dies with a fired case in station 1, and to snug the die lock rings with the handle down and cases in the dies. This allows the dies to center themselves in the toolhead, providing better concentricity and alignment than a solid head machine allows. No reason to lock the toolhead down.

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1 hour ago, dillon said:

We advise to adjust dies with a fired case in station 1, and to snug the die lock rings with the handle down and cases in the dies. This allows the dies to center themselves in the toolhead, providing better concentricity and alignment than a solid head machine allows. No reason to lock the toolhead down.

Thank you, this makes sense! Could you describe the step by step (or is this in the manual)? 

 

IE: Put a fired case in #1 adjust #1 die down to brass, finger tighten lock ring, push handle down then snug lock ring (or) just leave lock ring loose lower handle then snug lock ring? Which way?

 

Then proceed through each die the with the same process however being sure there is a case at the stage of load it should be in each die prior to the one we are adjusting?

 

Thanks!

IGG

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34 minutes ago, IGOTGLOCKED said:

Thank you, this makes sense! Could you describe the step by step (or is this in the manual)? 

 

IE: Put a fired case in #1 adjust #1 die down to brass, finger tighten lock ring, push handle down then snug lock ring (or) just leave lock ring loose lower handle then snug lock ring? Which way?

 

Then proceed through each die the with the same process however being sure there is a case at the stage of load it should be in each die prior to the one we are adjusting?

 

Thanks!

IGG

Look in the manual on page 10  http://www.dillonhelp.com/Dillon Manual PDFs/Dillon-XL650-Manual-May-2007.pdf
 

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uniquetek have a solution for the toolhead slop.

 

as dillon posted they have a reason for it. 

 

personally once i have it aligned (with a case up in the die) I then want it to be locked down tight for consistency during reloading. it could be placebo but with the clamped toolhead the press seems a little smoother to me and I also have more 'feel' as in i can really feel the brass entering the sizing ring etc.

 

you can add the clamps to your current toolhead: http://www.uniquetek.com/product/T1230

 

or do what I did and buy the whidden toolhead with the clamp kit inserted. it's a lovely toolhead too.

 

http://uniquetek.com/product/T1333

 

I've been very happy with the whidden toolhead and with the clamp kit. you can still easily remove it (just undo the 2 bolts) but to just dump powder it's probably just as easy to remove the 2 bolts on the collar that hold the powder measure to the die.

 

my solution is I run the lee auto drum which has an 'off' setting for the hopper. so you just rotate the hopper to 'off' then it lifts straight off the top of the press with no pins or bolts etc and easily empties back to a container. :)

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20 hours ago, jhgtyre said:

Thx jhgtyre! I'm going to give this another go to be sure I performed these steps correctly as suggested by the Dillon manual then reassess if necessary at that point. Thanks again for redirecting me back to the manual, I seem to sometimes stray from it unintentionally...

 

Cheers!

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On 1/30/2017 at 0:13 PM, dillon said:

We advise to adjust dies with a fired case in station 1, and to snug the die lock rings with the handle down and cases in the dies. This allows the dies to center themselves in the toolhead, providing better concentricity and alignment than a solid head machine allows. No reason to lock the toolhead down.


I had posted about how the Forester, new MEC Marksmen and Lee Cast Turret have play/cant as part of their design:

  • The Forester has shell holder and die movement.
  • The MEC Marksman has floating shell holder "patent-pending shell holder self-centers each cartridge"
  • Lee has an indexing turret that has some play that aligns to the shell holder.

Dillion Precision current design uses the same idea to make their match grade presses.
The Earlier Dillon Presses had threaded holes in the casting over the shell plate.

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13 hours ago, Livin_cincy said:


I had posted about how the Forester, new MEC Marksmen and Lee Cast Turret have play/cant as part of their design:

  • The Forester has shell holder and die movement.
  • The MEC Marksman has floating shell holder "patent-pending shell holder self-centers each cartridge"
  • Lee has an indexing turret that has some play that aligns to the shell holder.

Dillion Precision current design uses the same idea to make their match grade presses.
The Earlier Dillon Presses had threaded holes in the casting over the shell plate.

Although counter intuitive these design intents are quite interesting! 

Thx!

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46 minutes ago, jhgtyre said:

How do you know that these clamping kits are locking the tool head into the correct position?

I don't know anything about them, am just passing on information my friend.

 

In fact the advice from Dillon regarding the design intent of the press answered my question as to if the tool head is a dynamic to consider in the oal variance equation or not.

Cheers!

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3 hours ago, harleyfan said:

I tried the locked down toolhead thing. No help, just caused more problems.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
 

Yep! Makes die alignment even more critical and didn't do anything for oal numbers in my tests

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15 hours ago, Sarge said:

Yep! Makes die alignment even more critical and didn't do anything for oal numbers in my tests

Very interesting, thanks for the results. Just like Dillon said...

Edited by IGOTGLOCKED
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On ‎1‎/‎30‎/‎2017 at 7:03 PM, BeerBaron said:

uniquetek have a solution for the toolhead slop.

 

as dillon posted they have a reason for it. 

 

personally once i have it aligned (with a case up in the die) I then want it to be locked down tight for consistency during reloading. it could be placebo but with the clamped toolhead the press seems a little smoother to me and I also have more 'feel' as in i can really feel the brass entering the sizing ring etc.

 

you can add the clamps to your current toolhead: http://www.uniquetek.com/product/T1230

 

or do what I did and buy the whidden toolhead with the clamp kit inserted. it's a lovely toolhead too.

 

http://uniquetek.com/product/T1333

 

I've been very happy with the whidden toolhead and with the clamp kit. you can still easily remove it (just undo the 2 bolts) but to just dump powder it's probably just as easy to remove the 2 bolts on the collar that hold the powder measure to the die.

 

my solution is I run the lee auto drum which has an 'off' setting for the hopper. so you just rotate the hopper to 'off' then it lifts straight off the top of the press with no pins or bolts etc and easily empties back to a container. :)

 

I just installed the Whidden tool head with clamp inserts from Uniquetek into my 550B, yesterday.

After set-up and adjustment I loaded ten rounds and measured them; looking for any deviation in seated length.

Five of the ten were dead on at 1.135 inches. The other five went between 1.133 and 1.137. A plus/minus of .002 inch.

Money well spent, in my opinion.

Edited by MikieM
Fingers faster than brain...
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On 1/30/2017 at 10:13 AM, dillon said:

We advise to adjust dies with a fired case in station 1, and to snug the die lock rings with the handle down and cases in the dies. This allows the dies to center themselves in the toolhead, providing better concentricity and alignment than a solid head machine allows. No reason to lock the toolhead down.

 

+10. I loaded all my match ammo for the Long Range (rifle calibers) event at The Masters on a box-stock Dillon 550. IMO locking down any Dillon Toolhead is a solution for a problem that never existed.

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1 hour ago, benos said:

 

+10. I loaded all my match ammo for the Long Range (rifle calibers) event at The Masters on a box-stock Dillon 550. IMO locking down any Dillon Toolhead is a solution for a problem that never existed.

 

From a performance standpoint, Brian, I will agree. But like the old lady said when she peed in the sea, "Every little bit helps."

And besides, it's cold and wintry here in the Ozarks, and there isn't much to do. I've got time on my hands.

All the best. Mike.

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5 hours ago, MikieM said:

 

I just installed the Whidden tool head with clamp inserts from Uniquetek into my 550B, yesterday.

After set-up and adjustment I loaded ten rounds and measured them; looking for any deviation in seated length.

Five of the ten were dead on at 1.135 inches. The other five went between 1.133 and 1.137. A plus/minus of .002 inch.

Money well spent, in my opinion.

That is awesome however for comparison and if i undersyand you correctly we are really talking about extreme variation and in this case that is .004. This being the case l'my already there with the Dillon tool head not locked down.

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14 minutes ago, IGOTGLOCKED said:

That is awesome however for comparison and if i undersyand you correctly we are really talking about extreme variation and in this case that is .004. This being the case l'my already there with the Dillon tool head not locked down.

 

Nope. If your goal is 1.135, say, and you measure a round that read 1.133, the you missed your mark by 2 thousandths. If you measured another one and it came out to 1.137 you missed your mark again by 2 thousandths. Your extreme spread is .004, true, but that's not what you're after.

If you can reload ammo on a progressive press (any press) and come within .002 of your intended dimension, then you're doing very good indeed IMO.

Edited by MikieM
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I agree with your statement regarding the .002 from intended OAL. I specifically was bringing attention to extreme variance. Run 100 rounds @ an intended OAL of 1.150. The shortest is 1.148 and the longest is 1.152. Yes that is a .002 variance from the  intended 1.150 however the box of 100 that was just ran has an overall or extreme variance of .004. It is what it is. Now having said that I understand even .004 is still a good number for for a progressive. And I also continue to believe less is achievable. 

Part of the enjoyment of reloading for me is the experimentation of observing what results can be obtained through various methods. Another intriguing dynamic of this hobby is the pursuit of individual results through learning within a group environment such as this forum...

 

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6 minutes ago, IGOTGLOCKED said:

I agree with your statement regarding the .002 from intended OAL. I specifically was bringing attention to extreme variance. Run 100 rounds @ an intended OAL of 1.150. The shortest is 1.148 and the longest is 1.152. Yes that is a .002 variance from the  intended 1.150 however the box of 100 that was just ran has an overall or extreme variance of .004. It is what it is. Now having said that I understand even .004 is still a good number for for a progressive. And I also continue to believe less is achievable. 

Part of the enjoyment of reloading for me is the experimentation of observing what results can be obtained through various methods. Another intriguing dynamic of this hobby is the pursuit of individual results through learning within a group environment such as this forum...

 

 

I agree. We learn by doing, and we learn by reading, and the reading here is the inter-action amongst us shooters.

Dillon machines are as good as they get, but as with all things there is room for tweaking. The closer you can get to perfect, the closer you can get to perfect reloads.

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12 minutes ago, MikieM said:

 

I agree. We learn by doing, and we learn by reading, and the reading here is the inter-action amongst us shooters.

Dillon machines are as good as they get, but as with all things there is room for tweaking. The closer you can get to perfect, the closer you can get to perfect reloads.

Amen!

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