Precision bullets and smoke

[njl]

The range where I shoot won't allow jacketed bullets on steel targets, so I have to load plated, coated, or bare lead if I want to shoot steel.  I mostly shoot Glocks with stock barrels, so bare (waxed) lead isn't really an option, not to mention, the wax would probably exacerbate the smoke issue.  

I was starting to think about ordering more 147gr coated bullets, but which ones?  I've shot BBI, Precision, Bayou, Black and Blue, Ibeji (not in 9mm), Missouri (also not in 9mm), and X-treme.  X-treme, I never could figure out why their 147gr would tumble from some of my guns, so they're out.  Of the coated bullets, Precision is, AFAIK, the cheapest, might be the most accurate for me, and I remembered I had a bulk box of them that I'd stopped using...so I decided to give them another try.  

My current pet load is 147gr FP Bayou or similar bullet over 3.2gr Promo.  I hadn't started using Promo yet when I stopped loading Precisions, so I loaded up 100 Precision 147gr over 3.2gr Promo and chronographed them today.  As expected, I got pretty much exactly the FPS I'd previously gotten with them using 3.5gr WST...and probably the most consistent 10-round strings (lowest ES and SD) I've ever loaded.  They were soft shooting, accurate, and avg'd just over 900fps from my G17.  A bit slower from a Sig P226.  The only issue was the clouds of smoke.  That's probably why I stopped using them several years ago.  In the past, I've loaded the 147gr Precisions with Universal and WST.  Both are smokey.  I actually had a few rounds of the 3.5gr WST load in my ammo can, so I shot those after chronographing the Promo load.  Then I shot some Bayou over 3.2gr Promo, and Zero 147gr JHP over 3.3gr Promo.  All produce smoke.  None produce as much as the Precisions.

Are there other powders that might work well with 147gr Precision bullets, aiming for ~900fps from a G17, and not put up a smoke screen? 

Precision's web site claims their new Gen2 coating produces less smoke.  Anyone compared it to the coating they were using several years ago?

[LasVegasBill]

I have been using Berry's Bullets for years.  However the Glock uses Polygonal Rifling. And is not the best for lead bullets. That being said, using the Berrt's  Thick Plate bullet is good to 1500 fs.  And will not give you any problems. Check out their Web Site.

LasVegas Bill                  

[wgj3]

To OP's original question, I know that Precision always cautioned against cutting the coating when loading/seating/crimping the bullets. Possible that more bell to ease seating or less crimp might be a remedy...?

[njl]

I'm reasonably confident that I'm not cutting the coating while loading them.  I don't have any issues with the other coated bullets I load.

[wolffy1876]

I tried precision 180 gr .40s once.  They smoked a lot.  Ended up giving them away.

[njl]

After some more googling, it seems some think slower powders make less smoke with Precision.  I have some Longshot that I experimented with a while back for 147gr plated bullets.  4.2gr with an X-Treme 147 worked well.  I may try that with my old 147gr Precisions, backing off a tenth or two of a grain.

[StevenR]

I went through a box of 124/125 gr. with N320 then WST and both were too smokey.  Please let us know if you find a good powder as the bullets good otherwise.

Thanks.

[njl]

I haven't had much luck googling for 147gr lead data for Longshot much less feedback on how smoky it is.  I think I'll just give 4gr a shot and see how it does.

[MemphisMechanic]

With costed bullets, I routinely pull a couple of bullets after loading the first few and take a look.

I want to make sure the base still mic's the same diameter as a fresh bullet, and most important that there's only the smallest impression where the case mouth was crimped.

In all 9mm loads, you should only crimp until you've removed your flaring from the mouth - just until the walls are straight enough to gauge 100% smoothly and no more. 

(I had a friend who was over-crimping and cutting the coating. He had all sorts of issues until this was resolved)

That said, even if you aren't undersizing them with an aggressively adjusted Lee FCD or crimping the bejeezus out of them... precisions still smoke. A lot.

[njl]

I'm using a Dillon die set, so no FCD.  I "crimp" 9mm to .379-.380".  I backed off to that when I was trying to figure out my issues with X-Treme 147s.

 

I did load two small test batches with Longshot.  Hopefully, I can get out this weekend and see how bad they smoke.

[TacticalJesus]

I'm running precision bullets 185gr with E3 and they don't smoke.  Also use tightgroup with the 230 precision and no issues.  I heard the newer ones(Gen2)have a better coating to them.  Ran some SNS casting bullets with just the wax ring.....man do those smoke a lot.  I'm sticking with the precision, have run 1000's of rounds with no issues so far.  

[al503]

1 hour ago, smitty0420 said:

I'm running precision bullets 185gr with E3 and they don't smoke.  Also use tightgroup with the 230 precision and no issues.  I heard the newer ones(Gen2)have a better coating to them.  Ran some SNS casting bullets with just the wax ring.....man do those smoke a lot.  I'm sticking with the precision, have run 1000's of rounds with no issues so far.  

Thanks for the heads up on the new coating.  I really liked everything about their bullets except the smoke.  I'll order up a case and see how they do with a couple of different powders, includng e3.  

[Sarge]

10 hours ago, smitty0420 said:

I'm running precision bullets 185gr with E3 and they don't smoke.  Also use tightgroup with the 230 precision and no issues.  I heard the newer ones(Gen2)have a better coating to them.  Ran some SNS casting bullets with just the wax ring.....man do those smoke a lot.  I'm sticking with the precision, have run 1000's of rounds with no issues so far.  

You mean coated SNS or plain lead cast SNS? 

[njl]

There was a decent breeze today on and off which made it hard to judge, but I think the 147gr Precisions with Longshot smoked slightly less than Promo, loaded to similar velocities.  I'll likely load a larger batch of them and do more comparisons now that I know how much to use.  Interestingly, the Longshot loads I tested today didn't seem to have the extra loud report I've come to expect from Longshot.

[TacticalJesus]

14 hours ago, Sarge said:

You mean coated SNS or plain lead cast SNS? 

the plain cast SNS.  

[Sarge]

8 hours ago, smitty0420 said:

the plain cast SNS.  

Ah that explains it. SNS coated bullets smoke just a tiny bit. Just like BBI, Bayou, etc