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i make a 9mm load that is a 147gr plated bullet, 3.2 grains of titegroup, a cci primer and range pick up brass. the total cost for materials is with tax and shipping and hazmat figured it at 8.5c bullet, 3,1c primer, case free and 1c in powder for 12.6c a round in materials.

on my 1050 with a bullet feed and walking out to the garage with nothing ready, so including time to lube brass, load primer tubes ect ect I can make 800 rounds in a hour easily. if my time at the reloading bench is worth only $20 a hour then i have 2.5c in for labor per round.

so paying all costs for materials and paying myself to make ammo it still only comes to 15.1c a round to make a 147gr bullet that works perfectly in my gun.

a quick gunbot search for 9mm shows steel case tula 115gr 9mm going for 19c a round. if i consider my labor free, then i'm saving 34% compared to what i consider the cheapest junk ammo out there i'd choose to never shoot in my gun. let alone looking at a more direct comparison of 147gr to 147gr.

now let's compare to ammo i think is equal to what i make, say atlanta arms 147 and their ammo is 44c a round. or about 3.5 times as more expensive as mine. even freedom munitions, which i'm not a fan of as a match round at all, is 24.7c a round or double what i make mine for.

so yeah, i could get cheap junk close to what i make my own for, but definitely not something comparable.

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1 hour ago, rowdyb said:

i make a 9mm load that is a 147gr plated bullet, 3.2 grains of titegroup, a cci primer and range pick up brass. the total cost for materials is with tax and shipping and hazmat figured it at 8.5c bullet, 3,1c primer, case free and 1c in powder for 12.6c a round in materials.

on my 1050 with a bullet feed and walking out to the garage with nothing ready, so including time to lube brass, load primer tubes ect ect I can make 800 rounds in a hour easily. if my time at the reloading bench is worth only $20 a hour then i have 2.5c in for labor per round.

so paying all costs for materials and paying myself to make ammo it still only comes to 15.1c a round to make a 147gr bullet that works perfectly in my gun.

a quick gunbot search for 9mm shows steel case tula 115gr 9mm going for 19c a round. if i consider my labor free, then i'm saving 34% compared to what i consider the cheapest junk ammo out there i'd choose to never shoot in my gun. let alone looking at a more direct comparison of 147gr to 147gr.

now let's compare to ammo i think is equal to what i make, say atlanta arms 147 and their ammo is 44c a round. or about 3.5 times as more expensive as mine. even freedom munitions, which i'm not a fan of as a match round at all, is 24.7c a round or double what i make mine for.

so yeah, i could get cheap junk close to what i make my own for, but definitely not something comparable.

Add in time spent grubbing for range brass and a lot of incidentals, estimate how much you have spent on reloader/bench/lighting/accessories, and probably for a 5000 round per year shooter who is happy with lower price range ammo then reloading 9mm does not make sense?

I enjoy reloading and burn through a lot more ammo than 5k per year, so for me it does make sense. 

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I'm a cheap old geezer..... just to set the stage!

 

I reload on a lee loadmaster that cost $240 delivered off ebay with 9mm dies included.  Coated 135gr bullets are 7 to 7 1/2 cents delivered. Primers are 2-4 cents (federal match are 4).  so 100 rounds is $10-12. And recoil is about 1/2 - 2/3 of factory ammo.  So reloading saves about 50-75% on ammo depending on practice or match ammo.

The toadmaster is....ok. it takes a lot of fiddling, farting and f-ing around to get it running and keep it running. But, I can go out and make 300 rounds an hour without breakng a sweat. It's done 1000 -1200 rounds in the last 7 days and had 2 primer issues. It ran out (and I failed to see it) on one and inserted the other sideways. Those were the only failures.   it runs about 15,000 rounds a year supplying me and the kid.  I'm 200% sure a dillon is better (way better), but for the money, lee is ...ok.  Unless a person isn't a mechanically inclined fiddler, then it can be a nightmare. Lol.  Sadly, there is no budget for a better press, but this one does get the job done.

 

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for a 5k a round year shooter reloading makes no sense. at least not how i do it. buy 3k of practice cheapo ammo and 2k of good match ammo and call it a day. you're in it for far less than 2k a year buying ammo if all you do is truthfully only shoot 5k rounds a year.

there have been months where i shot 5k, so my press and such has more than returned on my investment.

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21 minutes ago, rowdyb said:

for a 5k a round year shooter reloading makes no sense. at least not how i do it. buy 3k of practice cheapo ammo and 2k of good match ammo and call it a day. you're in it for far less than 2k a year buying ammo if all you do is truthfully only shoot 5k rounds a year.

there have been months where i shot 5k, so my press and such has more than returned on my investment.

In the short run, you may be right...but I doubt that any shooter asking about reloading is planning on stopping shooting after one year. The cost of the press is spread out over the life of the shooter, not just a single year.

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I never understood making a distinction between "practice" and "match" ammo.  I personally would never want to see different accuracy results whether I was practicing or competing.  (I'm not attempting to start a discussion on that... just stating my opinion.)  That said, if you stick with something like a Dillon press you can sell it for the same money you bought it for many years down the road.  The only thing you did for all that time was save money on ammo.  Also, you've gained the consistency of shooting the same, customized ammo all that time.    Easy decision for me.

 

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4 hours ago, Glock26Toter said:

I never understood making a distinction between "practice" and "match" ammo.  I personally would never want to see different accuracy results whether I was practicing or competing.  (I'm not attempting to start a discussion on that... just stating my opinion.)  That said, if you stick with something like a Dillon press you can sell it for the same money you bought it for many years down the road.  The only thing you did for all that time was save money on ammo.  Also, you've gained the consistency of shooting the same, customized ammo all that time.    Easy decision for me.

 

I don't speak for everyone. But for me the distinction is purely whether not the rounds have been quality checked. I don't chamber check all my ammo. Its too much time spent. All my ammo is the same formula off the same press with the same components, but I chamber check and visually check a certain amount as designated "match" ammo and keep it separate from the rest. Occasional failures in training are acceptable to me while ANY failure is 100% unacceptable during a match.

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  • 1 month later...

I also do not like reloading.  I love shooting.  For that reason I bought the fastest reloading machine I could afford.

I have a super 1050 with Mr. Bullet Feeder and I reload a 1000 rounds nearly each time I reload.  It takes about 1.5 hours per 1000 when you count cleaning brass, loading primer tubes and adjusting your machine.  I have boxes full of ammo so I can practice at will.

If you are only shooting 5-7 k per year I would consider buying factory and just save your brass.  Someday if you decide to shoot more get a Dillon 650 or 1050.

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  • 4 months later...
On 11/1/2016 at 9:25 PM, js1130146 said:

I don't speak for everyone. But for me the distinction is purely whether not the rounds have been quality checked. I don't chamber check all my ammo. Its too much time spent. All my ammo is the same formula off the same press with the same components, but I chamber check and visually check a certain amount as designated "match" ammo and keep it separate from the rest. Occasional failures in training are acceptable to me while ANY failure is 100% unacceptable during a match.

I have major match, match, and practice.

Practice is generated from ammo that didn't pass the Hundo perfectly, or I have some reservation about for whatever reason. Major match is much more carefully checked and monitored during reloading than regular match. Regular match ammo I crank as fast as possible and toss anything that doesn't pass into the practice bin.

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On 10/27/2016 at 4:41 PM, GrumpyOne said:

In the short run, you may be right...but I doubt that any shooter asking about reloading is planning on stopping shooting after one year. The cost of the press is spread out over the life of the shooter, not just a single year.

Everyone's situation is different. There's plenty of stuff I wouldn't have paid for anyone to do for me ten years ago that I gladly do now. It's just priorities for some people, if you can afford not to reload and that gives you more time with family, then by all means.

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  • 6 months later...
On ‎8‎/‎31‎/‎2016 at 7:37 AM, narleyskier said:

 

Has anyone found ammo that was comparable to reloading myself?

It's just so time consuming and I would rather shoot than reload.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

I can load 100 rounds very easily in 6 minutes on a 650 dillion and you get a great cost difference if you can find a good deal on bullets.  I have not found factory ammo cost wise any where near close

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On 9/1/2016 at 7:32 AM, rowdyb said:

No. Nothing I could buy can compete in price and quality for what I can make myself. The ammo I make would sell for 3x commercially compared to what I have in making it.

 

 

What would you say are the variables that make your handloads superior to good commercial ammo? Are they limited to choice of powder and bullet or are there others?

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On 9/1/2016 at 2:30 PM, ano said:

 (I have multiple 1050 and mark7)

 

How do you like your Mark7, how long did your original setup take and do you have to fiddle around with it or does it just keep cranking out ammo?

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the mark7 automates the 1050

 

if your 1050 is perfect and runs perfect, it runs perfect with mark7 ;)

 

99% of my issues/stops has been issues with the 1050, like sticking case plunger, to much lube in primer circuit getting stuck on prep machine and primer slide etc. 

 

so yes Im happy, currently own 3 mark7s, the LTE, the X and the pro. I feel the X is where the value is at, the pro is cool though. 

 

In general I have few stops, on the 40 machine I will have one every.. hmm 2-3k rounds, like a toppeld bullet, I havent bought bulletsense yet.

 

for prepping, it pretty much runs flawless now, had a crank bolt back out, but red loctite has seem to solved it, I removed entire priming system as well, and loosend case feeder, it can now run thousands without stops. 

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Not sure I would call the individual components superior to commercial ammo at the "good" end of commercial ammo. But I consider it superior in a cost/per round view. There is no ammo out there that is 11c a round for 9mm that will cycle in my gun, be perfect for power factor and shoot the same group.

 

Right now on gunbot LAX, which I used to shoot a ton of, and Freedom, of which I've just shot a bit, are the cheapest 9mm ammo at 19c a round. American Eagle and WWB are around 25c per round. Are those rounds twice as good as mine? Nope. Group shooting shows me otherwise as I just recently played with this.

 

I have one 1050. Right now it's set up to load .40. But I needed some 9mm for a match as I only had 100 rounds of my nine left. (due to wanting to shoot 40 all of 2018 i just let my 9 supply dwindle) So my dilemma, buy factory 9 or spend a few days switching my set up back to 9, loading a few thousand and then switching it back to 40. So I took twenty of my rounds and twenty cci aluminum case and 20 wwb and shot groups with them at 15 yards free style. My ammo yielded groups half the size of the factory ammo.

 

I ended up just buying some 9 off the shelf, but I know it isn't as good as mine when it comes to what I value in a round.

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I'm not wild about loading, but I really enjoy load development. Never shot any factory that could combine the light recoil and accuracy that my minor loads deliver. I don't believe I could shoot anywhere near as much paying commercial prices. If hobby money weren't an issue I'd probably still load, but not 99% of what I shoot like now.

 

I'm slow, and my press is far from optimized for production, no feeders, 400 an hour is pretty attainable, leaving it set up means I can sneak away and crank out a match worth or more almost anytime my wife and kid are occupied, or let the kid pull the lever, he loves it, but it gets very slow.

 

What's really time consuming in my process is casting and coating my own bullets, gonna try to marathon it a couple times this winter and have a year's worth stocked. If that goes well I'll load 'em up and only have to touch the presses for rifle or try something new. 

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13 hours ago, RileyLV said:

What would you say are the variables that make your handloads superior to good commercial ammo? Are they limited to choice of powder and bullet or are there others?

 

Good commercial ammo (Atlanta Arms) is about $0.44 a round and they'd still have to make it special for my gun (I don't even know if they would) which likes them at 1.20" OAL where as their "long" ammo is 1.175 which will cause malfunctions (ask me how I know ;) ).

 

Costwise I am at $0.15 for my rounds using coated lead bullets from Black & Blue bullets. My rounds feed, and meet the PF (168.8PF at Nationals Chrono). So, it is cost and reliability that makes a difference for me. Not to mention being able to adjust the recipe as needed.

 

Time wise I am at 5 minutes per hundred with a bullet feeder on my 1050 and a RF 100 if I take it slow and steady. I usually run enough rounds until I run out of brass in the case feeder, then I refill all the components and be done until next time. I case gauge while watching Netflix so it doesn't take extra time.

 

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  • 2 years later...

I know it's an older thread but...

 

Reloading for me is enjoyable and generally not a chore at all except for in the summer when it's hot down here. In cooler weather I consider it a pastime so I load a LOT of ammo in the winter. 

 

Some friends of mine have claimed some very fast reload times to make ammo but they don't factor in primer flipping, tube loading, and initial press setup stuff and minor stoppages like changing out empty primer tubes, refilling powder measures, flipped primers, culling bad brass and refilling bullet trays in reload time, it's not just about pulling the handle or about burst mode production. Well that is with my two 550's and 450 anyway 🙂

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by gnappi
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Hey there, Gnappi!  Interesting thread, even if it is old.  I enjoy reloading also, and am fortunate enough to be able to reload in the house where it's nice and cool.  For me it's not all about speed, I'm more interested in making the best ammo I can for consistency and accuracy, and so far I'm pleased with what I can do.  I do have 2 Dillon 550's and 2 Load-Masters, and since I like to tinker the Loadmaster is getting my 9mm work, and is working perfectly, including priming.  I find reloading to be a hobby I can enjoy in itself.  By the way, one of my 550's is an "updated" 450.  

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  • 4 weeks later...
On 8/5/2020 at 2:48 AM, gnappi said:

 

 

Some friends of mine have claimed some very fast reload times to make ammo but they don't factor in primer flipping, tube loading, and initial press setup stuff and minor stoppages like changing out empty primer tubes, refilling powder measures, flipped primers, culling bad brass and refilling bullet trays in reload time, it's not just about pulling the handle or about burst mode production. Well that is with my two 550's and 450 anyway 🙂

 

 

 

 

 

 

It is if you are set up right. Bullet feeder, case feeder and a primer collator are the best things ever. I could never manually load a primer tube again after getting the DAA primer collator

 

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If I stopped reloading or handloading I would never shoot again.  Range time per week 4 hours reloading time per 25 hours.  That's between pistol, rifle, shotgun and reading or loading up data.  In winter more time casting bullets for next year.  Between grandson, his dad and me, we use about 25,000 rounds a year.  Tried case and bullet feeders and just didn't like them.  To old to change the habit of loading case and bullet by hand.

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  • 3 months later...
On 8/28/2020 at 6:26 PM, dannyd said:

If I stopped reloading or handloading I would never shoot again.  Range time per week 4 hours reloading time per 25 hours.  That's between pistol, rifle, shotgun and reading or loading up data.  In winter more time casting bullets for next year.  Between grandson, his dad and me, we use about 25,000 rounds a year.  Tried case and bullet feeders and just didn't like them.  To old to change the habit of loading case and bullet by hand.

That’s a ton of hours and loads.  I’m not sure if I could do that.  But like you, I do enjoy the quality and the process.

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31 minutes ago, Bigdeal929 said:

That’s a ton of hours and loads.  I’m not sure if I could do that.  But like you, I do enjoy the quality and the process.

 

My leather work is more repetitive than reloading just finished sewing a holster took about 5 hours.  :)

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