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Is it fair to require USPSA shooters to go prone?


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... don't recall EVER seeing a USPSA instruction to "go prone (or supine)". In freestyle stages there are always options, ..

It is quite possible to design a stage so that you have to shoot something through a very low port.

but that doesn't mean you have to go prone.

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I personally think there isn't enough prone or kneeling. The only thing that bothers me is getting up on the clock. It's hard on these old army knees but it also causes loose gun handling skills from what I have witnessed. The good thing is, it seems 99% of the time these positions are at the end of a stage.

Agree, they are at the end of the stage *if you choose to take a slightly slower stage breakdown to make them at the end of the stage. But last year's 2015 USPSA Nationals had a prone stage that would have been faster if you could "get back up on the clock quickly."

And the North Florida Sectional a few weeks ago had one, that i would have preferred to take in a different order.

IF ONLY i had Nils J's flexibility... and shooting skillls... and speed... and...

But, i'm just me, and have to deal with my limitations :(

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This is my first post. Weird to chime in on this topic as my first one. O well.

I just started shooting USPSA Pistol less than a year ago and I am old and fat. I can't compete with younger and more agile guys in several aspects of this sport when it comes to the more physical parts but I would NEVER advocate changing anything about it to accommodate anyone's limitations. Many analogies have already been put forth in this thread and they all apply.

I love this sport even though I am past my prime exactly because it challenges me to do things that are difficult. If they start changing it to make things easier I will lose interest and that would not be fair to those who have the physical ability and those who WORK HARD to get and keep the ability. I need to work to lose weight and stay in shape so the low port is not as much of an issue. It's not up to USPSA to accommodate my bad physical condition. Nothing about PP is easy.

That being said I do admit that I am always thankful when the low port is somewhere I can go to last. :D

Edited by cdasso
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I've been shooting USPSA for a few years and I've never had to go prone on a stage. I've never practiced either. And I don't recall ever having to get my butt on the ground. I'd like to start seeing it in matches every once in a while, just to mix it up. The IPSC videos I see from other countries really seem to have tougher shooting positions, and I think it would be a great challenge.

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I do believe that going prone is something that should be part of a stage now and then but also feel that it should be at the end of the stage at local club matches. This the everyday shooter can enjoy the stage and the people who shoot at the next level can still get some practice in.

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Going prone was quite common back in the 80's. The sport was young as were the majority of the competitors. As shooters age, the desire to hurt themselves seems to diminish.

Go to a local match and see what age groups are competing and what age groups are actually running the match.

To get as many competitors as necessary to make the match profitable, we will need to include shooters past their prime.

Like me, they are not there to win the match but to have fun and meet with friends.

If you want an Iron Man match, include Cooper tunnels and a lot of very low ports on every stage. Some will love it. But some will never return.

I'm not saying do away with tunnels, low ports and forced prone shooting, I'm saying be a little bit judicious about them. Keep it fun.

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getting older and bad knees so it def takes time kneeling, going prone etc and of course getting back up. i know i will and do lose time vs the younger guys, but if i wanted it easy i'd just shoot steel challenge (or clays or something). i do appreciate it though when the kneel/prone is the last array so that i don't lose time 2x.

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To get as many competitors as necessary to make the match profitable, we will need to include shooters past their prime.

Like me, they are not there to win the match but to have fun and meet with friends.

Then they aren't competitors, are they?

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In my eyes, everybody who participates in a competition is a competitor. The reason why they participate does not change that.

I'm not a very competitive person, so when I "compete", it is just to see how I cope with the challenge (whatever it is). No expectations or ambitions. On a few occasions I've done pretty well compared with others too.

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Starting tomorrow, there will be a lot of people going prone at the Mississippi Classic. I'll let you know how it goes.

68 of 217 zero'd it.

How far downrange were the middle 2 targets?

Edit: How far were all the targets?

Edited by ChuckS
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for my part,i find hard to shoot in prone position with my lower back problems. people with a limitation are at a disadvantage in this case. i wouldn't go as far as saying it's unfair, but sure enough it doesn't take physical limitations in consideration. i know some guys who shoot all A,s and regularly finish top 3 all the time but when it comes to a stage with a prone position, they're screwed....since it's only a game, i wonder why i would risk getting my lower back locked for weeks with the pain associated for a stage where shooting prone is required. then i volontarily screw up the whole stage because of that, problem solved for me. however, this topic has been brought up by the older shooters among us with limitation, and it's still a rage between these lines.... most of the time it's peoples with no physical limitations who designs the stages .

these are excellent points. Just like we have a special olympics and a senior olympics for handicapped and elderly people, we also have a version of USPSA for the handicapped and elderly. Guess what it's called.... :devil:

thanks for your usefull humor.

well,excepting the penalty i could take for not being able to perform the prone position without risking some back troubles, , i asked if it was possible for me to put some kind of buffer on the mat so my back isn't bent downward which is what cause me some problems...still waiting for an answer since i can't find any rules against

What is preventing you from going supine? It sounds like you are saying you are extension sensitive in your low back. Supine has the low back supported by the ground.

problem for me is shooting prone , you must lift your head to line up the sights on the targets correctly which applies more pressure down on the lower back. i can run and kneel as fast as when i was 25 while prone is a real bummer for me.....as i said, throwing some kind of pillow on the mat would only raise the part of my back a little higher than the rest of my old body, enough to not risk a lock up of my back....and i don't see any advantages doin so

Rules allow for accommodations to be made for handicapped shooters. I have seen wheel chair bound competitors being allowed to shoot outside of the shooting area so they can get to a port with low targets. I don't see how allowing a pillow on the ground to adjust your back position would be seen as something giving you an advantage and would seem like a reasonable accommodation for a handicap.

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I believe the partials (sho/who) were 11 yards, the prone targets were 47, if memory serves.

Thanks. You wouldn't happen to have/remember the course description?

it was set up with a barricade and walls to where the only way to engage the long targets was pretty much from prone.

So "U" shaped walls, shooting area at the bottom of the "U". Partials array on right and left of walls, open targets down the middle at 47 yards. Only available from under the wall.

Virginia count. 3 shots per paper. 18 rounds

String one: Engage any array SHO, perform a mandatory reload, engage another array free style

String two: Engage the remaining array WHO

it didn't specify prone, but it was set up in such a manner that anybody shorter than Shaq was having to go prone to do it.

I might still have the match book in my range bag. If I think about it, I'll snap a picture of the diagram/description for you.

Edited by tha1000
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I believe the partials (sho/who) were 11 yards, the prone targets were 47, if memory serves.

Thanks. You wouldn't happen to have/remember the course description?

it was set up with a barricade and walls to where the only way to engage the long targets was pretty much from prone.

So "U" shaped walls, shooting area at the bottom of the "U". Partials array on right and left of walls, open targets down the middle at 47 yards. Only available from under the wall.

Virginia count. 3 shots per paper. 18 rounds

String one: Engage any array SHO, perform a mandatory reload, engage another array free style

String two: Engage the remaining array WHO

it didn't specify prone, but it was set up in such a manner that anybody shorter than Shaq was having to go prone to do it.

I might still have the match book in my range bag. If I think about it, I'll snap a picture of the diagram/description for you.

Thanks! If you know the match staff, you may want to tell them to review rule 1.1.5.3. String one was not legal.

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Distances were at 9yds and 40yds. String 1: engage any array freestyle and any array SHO. Mandatory reload between arrays. String 2: engage remaining array WHO.

Nice. With that description, it is a legal stage. i am guessing that the far targets were taken freestyle by most everyone. ;)

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