GregSmith

Who would you have take the shot?

26 posts in this topic

Let me start by saying I know very little about precision rifle. I was in a conversation the other day and it made me wonder... If you had to have someone take the shot and whatever target you wanted the shot taken...who would you pick?

Top precision rifle shooter, or top military sniper?

You can take play this like the "Deadliest Warrior" show if you want. Obviously there are a million factors involved here and some of the top PRS guys are indeed current or former military snipers.

But in what situations would you pick one over another? Bottom line, you're picking "kickball teams" for whatever shot you need taken.

Which do you pick and why?

OR

If this is easier... stationary targets at 300, 600, 800 and 1000. 25 shots at each target. Who hits the most?

Edited by GregSmith

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I like shooting. I'll take the shot!

Oh, that's not what you asked. Precision rifle competitor every day of the week and twice on Sunday.

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Most snipers spend the majority of their training learning how to stalk and not be seen or compromised. It's not an apples to apples comparison by your standards. Most are accurate and can shoot about 1MOA but are geared towards finding a better final firing position than hitting a target in the open from the open. That being said, I'd choose the PRS shooter. If they had to stalk their target all night it would be a different story.

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I read an article a while back debating this very thing. A lot of the military snipers admit that civilian PRS shooters are better for purely shooting because they may get more practice, have better equipment and handload ammo. The military sniper gets mass produced ammo handed to him, may get to make a few mods to his rifle but ultimately, it's US government property and a lot of their training is something other than shooting.

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Totally dependent on the target. If you're shooting paper I'd say top competitive shooter without hesitation. If you're talking about a life or death shot where a human life is taken then I'd default to top military sniper. The stress added when a life hangs in the balance is dramatic and a military sniper has trained and mentally prepared for taking a life and that stress is potentially going to take less of a toll on the results.

The absolute best competitive shooter in the world, skill wise, simply may not be mentally capable or prepared to take a shot on another human being.

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Edited by shooterDrew

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Trust me ,there are snipers that are not nearly as good as the ones you read about and see movies about. Think about it. There are probably thousands of qualified snipers out there both past and present. How many can you name off the top of your head?

PRS guys dump a crapload of THEIR money into their custom guns and ammo. And all they do is shoot. If they sucked at it they would cut their losses and shoot something else.

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Or pick Daniel Horner and get both.

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I agree with a lot of the above, but I have to disagree with Drew. So many of the PRS guys ARE former military, that's there are probably more of us than there are civilians. Most of the civilian PRS shooters I know are also hunters, and while it is different shooting a person, most of them have whacked enough deer to be over the killing part. We understand that deer aren't people, but don't compare PRS shooters to average joe walking down the street, because they aren't. I wouldn't run out there at 1k and stick my tongue out at them.

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stationary targets at 300, 600, 800 and 1000. 25 shots at each target. Who hits the most?

That is a target shooting mission.

Try it with one shot at a target of known size, at unknown distance - and your rangefinder is broken.

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I'd agree with #5 above.

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Based on this thread, I thought this might give some more information and provide an interesting read. I'm attaching a match breakdown like Front Sight does for nationals. The match organizer Gary Larson sent this out a couple days after the match, The Guardian. It is a charity match that is going to be held several times this year and at several different locations. This one was held at Frontline Defense in NC. One of the breakdowns was by Mil/LE vs non number of competitors in each category and then average score for the match. Obviously, it doesn't show job in the Mil/LE category and I know not all the mil are snipers or former snipers. The scoring was time based, so lower is better. Winning score was 1065 for reference.

4.2.16-Match Scorecard Summary.pdf

Edited by TRG65

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At the last All Navy, Marine Corp and Coast Guard Championships I attended, the top two shooters were retired farts using personal weapons with hand loads. Third place was active duty Navy using personal weapon and hand loads. Etc.

You had to go all the way down to #12 before you found a guy using a US Government rifle with government issued match ammo.

Being "Minute of Bad Guy" capable is one thing. Shooting bug holes is quite another.

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All of the gun games, YouTube Heroics, and "tactical" shooting classes simulate a very small (but sexy) portion of war. Most of war is about very mundane and boring tasks. Who would sign up for a competition where you got dropped off in the middle of nowhere, walked 5k in the middle of the night, sat for 2 days, saw nothing, walked 10k out, got picked back up, then repeated this process for a month before having the first target present itself.

All that being said 1000 yard shot at a 6 inch plate, competition shooter.

80 yard shot at an 18 inch target at night with zero illumination, "top" sniper

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On 4/8/2016 at 10:41 AM, T Bacus said:

Or pick Daniel Horner and get both.

Payne or Johnson would be fine too. :)

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Payne in your Johnson?? Take the shot Mark, take the shot!! :lol:

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I dunno, some things scare the hell outta penicillin!   :bow:

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KurtM, I would take the shot myself, sure. :)

That was however, an exceptional play on words my friend.

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Considering that a Texas Rancher has trained most of the top military snipers that question is a real toss up. PRS guys can throw more money at it.
With in the military the title of sniper is a loose term. The average military sniper is not that great. With only a 800m capability.
Your more elite snipers are pushing well over 1000m with tremendous accuracy.
Now, when the elite snipers get there hands on the premiere gear they hands down out perform the PRC guys.


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On 8/25/2016 at 8:29 PM, Rangerdug said:

Considering that a Texas Rancher has trained most of the top military snipers that question is a real toss up. PRS guys can throw more money at it.
With in the military the title of sniper is a loose term. The average military sniper is not that great. With only a 800m capability.
Your more elite snipers are pushing well over 1000m with tremendous accuracy.
Now, when the elite snipers get there hands on the premiere gear they hands down out perform the PRC guys.

Thats a pretty bold statement.  I might not disagree with you, but some will.

 

For my money of I had to pick one guy to take one shot, it would be George Gardner.  I've witnessed him shoot his own rifles and other peoples rifles, including military issued.  There is no better for my money, but thats just my .02...

 

Bill
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I'm not good but I will take it

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My 12 year old will take it,  classified Master the week before her 12th birthday at Fclass midrange.........hit the 3" X ring 29 out of 60 times at the last match....:)

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