datguy Posted December 20, 2014 Share Posted December 20, 2014 As title says, need to replace the chewed up index pawl. Not sure which side to drive its pivot pin out.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ephlipot Posted December 20, 2014 Share Posted December 20, 2014 I just did one today. I had to put it on an anvil. I tried on my bench and it just wouldn't budge. I drove my out toward the side that has the pin sticking out for the return spring. Hope this makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brassaholic13 Posted December 21, 2014 Share Posted December 21, 2014 Hope you're replacing it with something better than stock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ams30gts Posted December 21, 2014 Share Posted December 21, 2014 It goes out the same side the other pin sticks out. That's assuming I didn't put it in backwards initially. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowdyb Posted February 3, 2017 Share Posted February 3, 2017 i am pounding the hell out of mine in that direction and getting no where.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowdyb Posted February 3, 2017 Share Posted February 3, 2017 On 12/20/2014 at 6:49 PM, Brassaholic13 said: Hope you're replacing it with something better than stock. yep, trying to get one of yours in to replace mine hahaha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowdyb Posted February 3, 2017 Share Posted February 3, 2017 and that's two punches broken and a starter punch mushroomed..... really getting pissed now....... the ffbs replacement better be amazing over my old chewed up one to warrant the difficulty I'm having installing it.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregJ Posted February 4, 2017 Share Posted February 4, 2017 I broke punches too. Finally found a small enough nail set punch znd that worked. Definately goes out one way. One side of arm seems to be machined tighter. Look at the video on FFB web site for which way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowdyb Posted February 5, 2017 Share Posted February 5, 2017 yep watched that video before i whacked on it. i have a 10 year old 1050, it's not a RL but it's not like the current Supers, kinda a transitional. mine is going to need some major pressure to get out. i might drill it out and just put a different pin in.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichJacot Posted February 6, 2017 Share Posted February 6, 2017 You're replacing the pawl so maybe some heat? ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowdyb Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 yep. did apply heat today! and bigger vice and bigger hammer. eventually came out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quirk Posted February 8, 2017 Share Posted February 8, 2017 I gave up awhile back on this for same reason. I'll try again with heat and pay attention to the direction....can't recall what direction I tried at first. Anyone have advice on where to buy quality durable punches...what I should look for to ensure it's the a properly strong punch not some cheap crappy soft metal...like I obviously had from Ace....I think strong language along was enough to make it bend... Q Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowdyb Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 (edited) heated with torch, set in biggest vice with pin so low i could rest the starter punch on the vice jaws so everything was supported and lined up. kept going through starter punches until it started to move. mine almost felt like it was bent, the pin. it took heat applied 3 different times for about 20 seconds each. it took pounding with a starter punch(es) almost non stop for 14 minutes. once it started to come out it became easier, not easy. at one point i was ready to just drill it out and or just buy a whole new arm assembly for the $40 and just be over it. rather than trying to install just the aftermarket pawl. putting in the replacement pawl and replacement stock spring was easy. i didn't bother staking the pin back in. press works better now. i also had an unsatisfactory email exchange with the customer service people from fast n "friendly" Edited February 9, 2017 by rowdyb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quirk Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 Ah. Ditto. Awhile back I emailed FFB about sending mine in to them so they could swap out the pawl, since I couldn't get it out. I would have negotiated to pay them. They don't do that, was the reply. The video they link that shows a guy effortlessly pounding out the pin for the pawl is clearly not everyone's experience. guess I'll try your heating approach... Q Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quirk Posted February 18, 2017 Share Posted February 18, 2017 With some heating and additional effort I got the pin out, and replaced the stock Dillon pawl with the FFB pawl. I needed to ream out the hole a bit with a 3/32" drill as FFB suggested with the instructions, and I filed the side of the pawl a bit to smooth out some burrs. It seems to work just fine, and time will tell if it really lasts longer with less wear. My Mark 7 wore out this first pawl pretty quick... Q Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NicoR Posted February 18, 2017 Share Posted February 18, 2017 With some heating and additional effort I got the pin out, and replaced the stock Dillon pawl with the FFB pawl. I needed to ream out the hole a bit with a 3/32" drill as FFB suggested with the instructions, and I filed the side of the pawl a bit to smooth out some burrs. It seems to work just fine, and time will tell if it really lasts longer with less wear. My Mark 7 wore out this first pawl pretty quick... QHow many rounds is pretty quick? I've had my F&FB shellplate since I got my S1050 new and put 10.000 rounds through it. I just got my Mark 7 but couldn't change the index pawl, not even after breaking my punch! That thing is almost welded... I'm thinking about getting a whole new rocker arm and pin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmz Posted February 18, 2017 Share Posted February 18, 2017 The proper way to remove the pin is by using a press, it makes the job very easy along with not damaging anything. Just a little info... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Want2BS8ed Posted February 19, 2017 Share Posted February 19, 2017 On 2/9/2017 at 9:52 AM, rowdyb said: I also had an unsatisfactory email exchange with the customer service people from fast n "friendly" On 2/12/2017 at 10:35 AM, Quirk said: Ah. Ditto. Awhile back I emailed FFB about sending mine in to them so they could swap out the pawl, since I couldn't get it out. I would have negotiated to pay them. They don't do that, was the reply. The video they link that shows a guy effortlessly pounding out the pin for the pawl is clearly not everyone's experience. Ha! Welcome to the club... both in FFB's bedside manner and in removing pins from your 1050 pawl. The first time feels like you need 3 hands and to stand on your head. By the second or third time it gets easier. FWIW, before installing the FFB pawl, spend a couple of minutes stoning the sides to remove burrs and ever so lightly relieve the tip of the pawl as well (it's much "pointier" than the Dillon pawl). Also, pay special attention to the main return spring when reassembling the arm. It's easy to either pinch it with the pivot bolt or have it slip from the small screw that captures the free end against the main casting. 9 hours ago, tmz said: The proper way to remove the pin is by using a press, it makes the job very easy along with not damaging anything. Just a little info... Never thought of that TMZ. Makes tons (no pun intended) of sense. Assume you are using an arbor press. Mind sharing how you setup the press both to remove and install the pins (i.e. using standard punches, punch holder, made a die, etc.)? Thanks, M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmz Posted February 20, 2017 Share Posted February 20, 2017 21 hours ago, Want2BS8ed said: Never thought of that TMZ. Makes tons (no pun intended) of sense. Assume you are using an arbor press. Mind sharing how you setup the press both to remove and install the pins (i.e. using standard punches, punch holder, made a die, etc.)? Thanks, M Everyone approaches things a little bit different but with this particular project I take the pawl set it on a small scrap piece of aluminum that is thicker than the pin and trace it out with a sharpie so I know where to send it back, mark where the pin is located drill a hole larger than the pinhole in the aluminum. Then I sacrifice a drillbit that is smaller than the pin that I'm driving out I cut the drill bit so it's just a smooth shank. Then I just proceed to press the pin out and reply in reverse for reinstallation. It's pretty straightforward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Want2BS8ed Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Thanks TMZ. I will give that a try next time I need to swap out the pawl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quirk Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 (edited) On 2/18/2017 at 9:41 AM, NicoR said: How many rounds is pretty quick? I've had my F&FB shellplate since I got my S1050 new and put 10.000 rounds through it. I just got my Mark 7 but couldn't change the index pawl, not even after breaking my punch! That thing is almost welded... I'm thinking about getting a whole new rocker arm and pin. Had about 100k rounds before the Mark 7, and after 10k with the Mark 7 the pawl was nicked and wore out. i actually also bought a whole new rocker arm (damn expensive at >$100) also, and that one got dinged up after another 20k rounds. make sure you pound it out the right way. Check out the video on FFB site by Forcht for that. Heat it generously...I used a heat gun, and that worked in 5-10 minutes after what seemed like hours of cold pounding. Yep I went through no less than 5 punches myself before it worked. I pound it out on a 1-2-3 block, also... havent installed new one yet, waiting for next time I clean and lube. I go about 25k rounds before full disassembly-clean&lube. Every 5k I add lube here and there and clean under the shell plate and primer slide. Q Edited February 21, 2017 by Quirk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Want2BS8ed Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 Other than function testing while waiting on the Mark7 to arrive, the 1050 was automated from day 1 with an FFB shell plate and pawl. I had problems with the FFB pawl initially (see my earlier hints regarding stoning and springs), so I swapped the OEM pawl back in. At 9K rounds the OEM pawl was pretty chewed up, so the FFB pawl was reinstalled. 5K rounds since the last swap and the FFB pawl is showing wear, but seems to be holding up better overall. M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quirk Posted February 21, 2017 Share Posted February 21, 2017 I found I had to file the edges a bit, too, as there were more than a few burrs on mine. The FFB instructions - very terse ones - suggested that wasn't necessary. Only lost that damn spring twice on the floor. I had not read the instructions fully when I assembled the FFB pawl, and was perplexed when it didn't move properly, it was stiff and clearly would not spring back properly after being depressed. Then I read that I should run a 3/32 drill bit in the hole a bit to prevent it from binding on the pin., and that made it move properly. Looking forward to getting in installed and working properly. I like the shellplate, certainly. And the pawl sounds like a good product. And I accept the fact that "they" at FFB are skilled machinists and maybe not top-tier in communication and customer-service hand-holding like some! and that's okay, it forces me to learn a bit and thankfully this forum is full of helpful folks. Q Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaylanGivens Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 I also failed to get the pin out to install a new pawl in my 1050... The video is completely misleading... I have a bit over 26,000 rounds loaded in my 1050 and the pawl is somewhat chewed up... I ended up returning my original pawl to service before I destroyed the arm trying to pound the pin out... What kind of press are you guys using to remove the pin? Is it something I can get inexpensively... Like at Harbor Freight, maybe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmz Posted February 22, 2017 Share Posted February 22, 2017 6 minutes ago, RaylanGivens said: I also failed to get the pin out to install a new pawl in my 1050... The video is completely misleading... I have a bit over 26,000 rounds loaded in my 1050 and the pawl is somewhat chewed up... I ended up returning my original pawl to service before I destroyed the arm trying to pound the pin out... What kind of press are you guys using to remove the pin? Is it something I can get inexpensively... Like at Harbor Freight, maybe? Yes they do it's called an arbor press if you look here it's about $60 There's a couple different ways you can get creative and do this believe it or not even with the a benchtop vice. Generally takes more than one person to help you hold things as you press it out but anyways here's a link for the arbor press at Harbor freight http://m.harborfreight.com/1-ton-arbor-press-3552.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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