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Versamax Competition Tactical 3-gun Review


AirForce2

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Just got my Green Receiver comp model this week.


Well, maybe I'll not ditch the mossberg JM Pro just yet. Haven't shot the Rem Versa Max Competition Tactical yet, but let me just say how sh_ _ _ y it is to load a shell into the tube. Amazing that they let this gun leave the factory and I know it was fired, which means they had to load the tube. The shell is so hard to force into the tube once the brass casing hits the hump on the outside of lifter/carrier and then excessive pressure from the lip of the shell catch once you get it past the lifter, that the sh_ t_ y designed short lifter will snatch the crap out of your thumb. I only loaded 2 shells and single loading is terrible and no way could you do a load 2 or 4.



Took it apart today and did a quick grind down on the rear and sides of the foregrip for load 2/4's and this should be ok.


-Took down the ears right at the 10, 2, 4, and 8 o'clock positions right at the junction of the shell tube on the load port.


-Polished & rounded the chamber entry lip & extractor area on the barrel.


-Also made enough room on polishing down the ext/outside hump of the lifter and a hair off the inner front lifter legs that contact the bolt bottom and a slight rounding of the front shell latch corner on the inside edge and corners and now the lifter doesn't cause any drag during loading a shell, but loading a shell into the tube is still excessively hard and then the crap lifter grabs your thumb due to the shell catch lip catching on the brass of the shell. Unfriggin believable. It's a pain to load a full tube for sure, and the Remington folks that test it must know it, because I've seen reviews since last summer that the competition model gun magazine etc.. reviewers told them it was to short and they were supposed to make the lifter longer.



The lifter on this shotgun sucks worse than any gun out there because it's too short. At least other guns lifter ears would be long enough to go close to the tube opening so that only the middle of the lifter would catch your thumb. This thing is straight across but a good 1/2 to 3/4 inch to short. The trigger feels like a mushy old rusty grenade pin being pulled. I'll have to say the mossberg trigger is sweet in comparison.



Goods:


-Nice steel shell tube (not as good as the steel tube carbon arms uses) and the carbon sleeve is also the spacer for the end cap to hold the foregrip tight.


-+2 tube ext is not steel inside, so hope the carbon is good enough. It's mostly only going to house the spring and part of the follower with 10 rds loaded, so little risk to hamper feeding.


-Fit a finish of most of the gun seem good and came with 4 ext tube chokes which is nice assuming they work good and don't need to buy briley's.


-Internal parts and ext had no major jagged edges that I could see.



Bads/not impressed:


-The lifter sucks (see my comments above in this post). PO'd me off that still need to spend $50 or more to fix their crap design. It's worse than typical remington model shotgun lifters. Remington, pls tell the under 10 year olds/xbox shotgun design team that must have the old blind persons, people who've never shot or used shotguns before to please run their finished design/product thru the "NON blind" QA dept, and maybe someone who knows how a firearm should function before blessing the production. I know they had the right people to give them inputs.


-Throwup green receiver, whatever. Might have well made it glow in the dark zombie green.


-Trigger pull-feels like it's designed for a jittery 8 year old to not go off if they were having spaz attacks or stroke. Nice smooth 8-10 pds feels like. Hope it will get better and lighten up a little after some shooting.


-Also found as set up right now even w/polishing the lifter legs and the hump, I'm unable to unload any shells by pushing the lifter all the way up and releasing the shell release, the shell releases but won't come over the hump in the lifter, so all shells have to be chambered and ejected by bolt which stinks for dummy load practice or unloading live rounds.


-Shell catch-loading shells is like stuffin a round peg thru a sqround hold. You have to push so hard to get it by the shell catch and then the short lifter grabs the heck of the thumb becaue you had to force so hard your thumb goes way to far into the tube. Who friggin designed this thing "an old world beaver trap maker".


-The rubber tape or whatever is on the stock handle and foregrip-not so grippy and likely just gets in the way or slippery when sweaty or oil. Should have just made the finish rough or left alone so a $3 soldering iron & tip stippling can be done. Not sure if I can stipple the rubber areas or if the rubber can come off.



Edits: -I stopped by to show Mark at Carbon Arms the new comp model and ask his input and he was nice enough to explain the differences and what he's seen so far and to get inputs on the shell stop, carbon tube etc... Let's just set it straight per Mark says he helped w/inputs on several areas including the tube/carbon sleeve, but this is not parts by Carbon Arms. Mark said he would have done some items different in respect to a better steel tube and maybe something other than the solid carbon +2 ext due to blasts and carbon ext past the barrel.


-He helped show me some of the mods to the shell stop and lifter even though there are items online, I just wasn't quite sure which areas to work and I made mine better, but still to much drag from the shell stop on the brass portion of the comp model. I decided to use the nordic +2 ext instead of the carbon one or at least have it extra in case the blast starts breaking up the carbon past the barrel (I hear getting this stuff ingested is kinda bad for ya).



More to come in the next week or 2 when I get to the range and perfect some items. I hand racked the bolt 200+ times and disassembled and cleaned lubed the gun. I will try to post some good pics of any mods I can narrow down.


Planned actions:


-shorten stock & get LOP at 13 inches & add limbsaver low profile 5/8 inch grind to fit (shouldn't be to bad since the fact puss pad was 2 inch thick)


-have to send the lifter to C-Rums to extend it (still want the shell guide groove/hump just less of it). I bitched so much about it to Remington, they are sending me an extra lifter)


-a must to smooth out the shell catch/release section so I can load shells smoother


-rear sight is ok, but I'm going w/HiViz adj rear on rib


-grinded and smoothed front & side foregrip near the load port and it's almost narrows down to nothing so hope this works or may have to cut out a slot on rear center foregrip for load 2/4's


-maybe light trigger polishing


-stipple areas around the rubber sticker grips on rear stock and front foregrip


-match saver install on foregrip




Edited by AirForce2
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Sounds like more or less the same "issues" I had with my Vmax Tactical. It was unbelievably hard to load. Tuning the shell latch is a must imo, much more enjoyable once it's fixed up. I also added C-rums lifter and Carbon Arms tube to mine, and it definitely adds to it.

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There is a 19 page thread on the things Airforce2 was having problems with. I have a JM and the VM Comp. after the small "touch ups" to get it to load smooth ( now it sucks shells right in) a couple thousand rounds through it with zero failures, you couldn't give me a JM. These guns are tanks. The take a beating and keep asking for more, clean, dirty, wet, dry , off your shoulder, it doesn't matter they just run. Couldn't be happier. But these bugs should have never left the factory.

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Just finished one at the shop. The loading port came out great. Opened it up and undercut more. Installed extended lifter, tweaked and polished shell release, radiused the extractor cut. Loads very easy.

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Just finished one at the shop. The loading port came out great. Opened it up and undercut more. Installed extended lifter, tweaked and polished shell release, radiused the extractor cut. Loads very easy.

Did you happen to take pics? I'd love to see how your work turned out!

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6/24/14-I finally fired the gun today. I shot 30 rds at the trap range just to break the gun in (rules of the range only allow one round at a time in the gun). I then went to the pistol range that allows me to shoot shotguns and loaded the tube full w/10 +1 and put 60 rds downrange and had zero malfunctions. I shot 7.5 shot, 1 oz loads rem somthing at 1290 fps per the box and the herters targe 1 1/8oz 7.5 shot at 1200 fps. The shot pattern at 20 yds was from dead center to the right using the front fiber w/rear sight that came on the rib, so I assume needs a tweek left, but will see how slugs pattern. Recoil seemed pretty good, and a little less violent that the JM Pro, but to be fair need to shoot em both side by side. Dang that puke green receiver color is hard to love. Oh well, as long as it functions.

Items done so far:

-shell stop 2nd attempt, I took it out and radiused the back/inside curve (towards the shooter if shouldering) with a half inch wide bullet shaped polishing bit a little more while still keeping a flatish portion on the forward side and also broke the corners a little more on the back side (toward the shooter) this helped the loading of shells into the tube, but it's only about 80% of what I think it should feel like, but it's better. The crap lifter stills makes me gun shy slamming any load 2's or 4's. I gotta get this lifter extended soon.

-reduced the stock LOP w/removal of appx 3/4 inch of rear plastic, put on low profile limbsaver pad and now have 12 1/2 LOP. Note: Don't cut more than 3/4 inch off the stock or the top screw will be going to far into the rubber comb insert area, hence reducing a good stock section for screw to hold.

You could actually get a 13 5/8 LOP just by grinding down a low profile limbsaver pad and not cutting off any stock, but the screw holes a hair off so one screw hole in the limbsaver pad needs to be pushed 1/8 inch wider from the other.

-grinded down the foregrip rear and sides tapered to almost flush around the loading port, but if I need to I can cut out the bottom of the foregrip and taper if need be. The key to the rear foregrip mod for doing load 2/4 is to get a good taper down to the receiver versus just cutting 1/2 to 1 inch sections off the rear/sides leaving thick, blunt steep ledges left like I've seen some do. This was not something you could do for the JM Pro to me becasue the forend had to much of a gap and also had another plastic spacer under rear of forend. The versa has lots of just bare receiver under the foregrip, but also remember the primary mount for the barrel loackup/stability is only the carbon tube & tube nut and the foregrip against the back receiver & bottom of barrel just like Mark @Carbon arms mentioned in one of the versa topics.

I still need to open the loading port width and forward slightly (make sure to keep the same undercut or during load 2/4 the second shell might jam if you don't leave a rear upward funnel cut on the front receiver at tube junction going up and "towards" you (kinda reverse ramp versus the side load port widening. I did this on my JM Pro and luckily had enough metal left to salvage it. Still need to work on a couple little humps in the corners of the load port and the tube junction areas. I can't get any shells to come out of the tube unless I hand cycle each round to the chamber and then back out. This is because the shells don't want to come out over the hump on front of lifter and/or combo of that & the little humps at tub/receiver junction at the 10, 2, 4, 8 oclock sections. I have a spare trigger assy w/lifter to send of to triangle or rose action for lifter mod and maybe a trigger job. I'm not a huge fan of the versa foregrip, it just seems to have to many different contours and grips between front & back and prefer to have one contour the whole length of the grip. I find myself not sure to hold it on the back half or front half or right in the middle which is where it feels like 2 different contours in the middle. I will try to post a few pics of the shell stop & foregrip & stock in a few days. I'm trying to take pics of some items in a before & after if I remember to. If you know someone who needs a JM Pro in CO I have mine for sale (local only) but I will say I'm torn on wether to keep it as a spare or not, but could use the money for other gun related stuff.

I wonder if Triangle Sports will leave the hump on the comp model lifter or remove it when they extend it and can they just modify the lifter or do they need the whole gun?

Edited by AirForce2
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My only major issue with the design of this gun was the decision to use pot metal aluminum for the trigger group... It's soft as butter, and wears faster than other grades of aluminum, and polymers.

Check your lifter hinge pin for tightness often, and keep it clean and well lubed.

Edited by Headworked
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Im working on 2 more and will be posting pictures on our facebook page and our website.

One of these is probably mine can't wait to see it finished. It was really hard to load from the factory.

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So I took almost the entire "hump" or "bulge" off. I just took a file to it making sure I didn't take too much. Now it unloads without cycling the bolt as the gun was intended to...

I'll take a pic here in a sec. It is definitely easier to load now, I haven't even begun to shave the forend as I still mostly weak hand load4, sometime use my pinwheels for twins. I have new IP 2.8's in route so that might change.

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Here are a few pics of my shell stop (sorry forgot to do a before pic) on the versa comp and a pic of the foregrip tapered down to less than 1/8 inch thick at the edges and pic of my cut down LOP stock. I'm no a big fan of reaming out the the 2 half circles just behind the shell catch end to allow the shell stop to flex for now. The shell stop mod is close but not 100% yet. Doing a little at a time. I prefer a polishing wheel (kinda like a pencil eraser material w/gritty stuff in it. If you saw my mossber 930 JM Pro forum and you use a dremel or want to do good polishing buy the 50 piece kit on amazon in the orange case w/3 types of polishing grits & several shapes. These will give a much smoother and quicker finish and better contours than files & sandpaper, for me anywho.

On the foregrip, I may still cut out the top section where you see the marker outline, but I won't realy know until I get a decent lifter to use. I called a few places today on versa competition model lifter mod. I suggest you talk to Triangle Shooting and C-rums and determine options/price for which place to have your lifter extended. It seems that both places will mostly remove the hump when they extend the lifter.

More lifter info to ponder related to the versa's & competition model:

-no need to order a versa competition model lifter for your tactical model, it will be a thumb trap (you can see how short in pics below). Just weld up what you have.

-benelli lifter or after market lifters will still be to short from what I've heard for comp model ie..the nice shiny one on triangle sports page

-I think if you extend the lifter the skeleton slot/opening in middle of lifter should also be extended to equal out the weight addition a little.

-I think the "hump" on the comp model could have merit to guide the shell into the chamber and maybe prevent some of the front shells jamming into the extractor cut of the barrel, but maybe instead of the hump, some small nipples on the inside of the front edge of the lifter or a less pronounced/width of the hump. You'd think the typical underside lifter legs should be contoured to guide the shell without all of this if they are leveled and even, hmmmmm.

Next is the load port opening in the next week hopefully. I think I'm going to have to remove some of the foregrip on the bottom but not much, maybe 1/2 inch notch long by 1 inch wide.

What are people's thoughts on the remington pro bore extended chokes? Any reason to get brileys over these or are pro bore good enough?

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Edited by AirForce2
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I had a comp model in the shop with pro bore extended chokes. It made the gun shoot 7" low at 50 yards. Installed a standard pro bore imp cyl choke and gun was dead on at 50 yds.

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I just got mine back from Triangle yesterday. I sure am glad I had them do the work instead of trying to do it myself. I was not going to change out the lifter, but I'm glad they talked me into it! There is no way to catch my thumb in there now. I did about 20 quad loads last night with dummy rounds, and man what a difference! They slide in the magazine like a groundhog getting back in his hole. Another really nice thing is that I can now unload the magazine by depressing the shell latch. No more cycling rounds to unload. I'm super pleased with the work. If the Triangle folks want to chime in on costs for these upgrades, they can. I will just say that the price was VERY reasonable. i.e. A lot less than I was expecting. I'll get her out this weekend and do some live fire drills, and let you know how it goes.

Here are a few pics.

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dudyjume.jpg

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

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I had a comp model in the shop with pro bore extended chokes. It made the gun shoot 7" low at 50 yards. Installed a standard pro bore imp cyl choke and gun was dead on at 50 yds.

Interesting.. might make you wonder why a discounter/ retailer had a bunch of cheap Pro Bore extended tubes for sale :closedeyes:

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Spent 3 more hours on the versa comp today and all I need now is the other lifter that is at C-Rums getting extended. I'm proud of my work considering it's my second ever shotgun work all in past 5 months. You can't see from the pics but I also smoothed out the receiver where the shell tube meets since there were little humps at the 10, 2, 4, and 8 o'clock sections. I'm not going to do anything to the trigger since forums and experts lean that it's not a great system to lighten up much without potential for drawbacks. I put a high viz adj rear on the back of the rib also. Dang, I sent my lifter out Tues noon and just got an email fro Jeff/C-Rums my mod lifter is hitting the mail back today, that's quick. I did real good not bugering up any areas until the last part and got lazy and put a few nicks on front of trigger guard grinding down the front part of trigger housing by the rear of carrier. I was holding the lifter out of the way instead of taking it off.

I also included a pic of a very rough surface in the chamber, just forward of where a loaded shell would sit. This was exactly like this from the factory and looks the same after appx 80 rds and after a bore scrub w/brush & solvent cleaning. It seems to have a slight look of rings on a big tree if you cut a tree down. I think it's a bad cut of the barrel. I also noticed after cleaning, pushing a 6x6 strip of thin cloth from the rear, it goes from loose fit first 2-3 inches, to tight right around this rough section, stays tight until just prior to internal choke point I think, then loose again, and tight inside the last part of the choke. Should I just not worry about it?

Notice the 2nd pic is not my versa but of my JM Pro load port at the front is where I mentioned prev that DIY load port mod, you need to cut outward on the sides of the load port, but the front needs to angle back towards the back of the gun or else your 2nd round of a load 2 or 4 could jam against the top edge, well did for me anyway. I need to actually undercut the Mossberg front port back towards me more.

I would like to get a little larger profile bolt handle. I kinda liked the one on my JM Pro, not to sharp/just rough checkering. I wonder why they made the versa one rotate? Is it to keep it from being pulled out of the bolt when racking? Any ideas?

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Edited by AirForce2
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I also included a pic of a very rough surface just forward of where a loaded shell would sit. This was exactly like this from the factory and looks the same after appx 80 rds and after a bore scrub w/brush & solvent cleaning. It seems to have a slight look of rings on a big tree if you cut a tree down. I think it's a bad cut of the barrel. Should I just not worry about it?

I noticed this in my barrel too. It's right where the forcing cone would be in a standard barrel. Glad to know I'm not the only one. Anyone know if that is by design or if that area should be polished like the rest of the barrel?

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"I would like to get a little larger profile bolt handle. I kinda liked the one on my JM Pro, not to sharp/just rough checkering. I wonder why they made the versa one rotate? Is it to keep it from being pulled out of the bolt when racking? Any ideas?"

The Taran tactical bolt handle for Benelli fits just fine

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The VERSA tactical / competition bolt handle rotates because they saved $0.50 making the tactical cheese grater bolt handle a turned part (the field model is MIM) and eliminating a mill cut on the bolt handle (countersunk slot that keeps the field bolt handle from rotating).

The bolt handle is a cheese grater because they designed it to stand up to full powered hunting loads which can sometimes bend or break some of the tactical bolt handles on the market. Most of those were designed for Beneli's and the VERSA runs at significantly higher bolt velocities with heavy 3 and 3.5" loads. I guess they figured somebody might use one for home defense. They did almost sell it with a 7+1 tube you know. :surprise:

And as for cheap extended ProBore tubes, that happened because after the 105CTi and 1100G3 died before their time, Remington figured they would scrap or fire sale most of their extended ProBore tube inventory to evidently get it off the books before the end of the year or something. Imagine my surprise to discover a few years ago that they had discontinued the Skeet ProBore tubes and had 0 in inventory. And then they sold IC, Mod, and Full on there website for something in the neighborhood of $3/each.

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The VERSA tactical / competition bolt handle rotates because they saved $0.50 making the tactical cheese grater bolt handle a turned part (the field model is MIM) and eliminating a mill cut on the bolt handle (countersunk slot that keeps the field bolt handle from rotating).

The bolt handle is a cheese grater because they designed it to stand up to full powered hunting loads which can sometimes bend or break some of the tactical bolt handles on the market. Most of those were designed for Beneli's and the VERSA runs at significantly higher bolt velocities with heavy 3 and 3.5" loads. I guess they figured somebody might use one for home defense. They did almost sell it with a 7+1 tube you know. :surprise:

And as for cheap extended ProBore tubes, that happened because after the 105CTi and 1100G3 died before their time, Remington figured they would scrap or fire sale most of their extended ProBore tube inventory to evidently get it off the books before the end of the year or something. Imagine my surprise to discover a few years ago that they had discontinued the Skeet ProBore tubes and had 0 in inventory. And then they sold IC, Mod, and Full on there website for something in the neighborhood of $3/each.

So, I take it the remington brand pro bore chokes are not as good as briley or carlsons? What I'm trying to determine is if I should replace them. I'm no shotgun choke expert at all, but I'll use them if they work well, but don't want to spend $150 on 3 new chokes if these are just as good or make little difference.

One thing that bugs me is on my JM pro w/briley ext chokes & this versa 3-gun model w/rem pro bore ext chokes is the chokes come loose appx every 10-20 rds on both guns & diff brand chokes even if I tighten them pretty hard w/choke wrench. Is this common with everyone's shotguns?

Edited by AirForce2
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Sure would be nice if someone could post or send me a pic or 2 of a "properly" (not guess work attempt) modded extractor cut area on the versamax barrel for me. I'm curious to know if you angle and smooth out the inside of the barrel/extractor cut ie...ramp outwards from chamber and/or cut the whole extractor opening forward towards the front of the gun or what? In trade for my hopefully helpful posting & pics? Just want to do the mod to prevent the occasional shell from jamming into it since the extractor area is pretty large area in comparison to non rotating bolt systems.

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The VERSA tactical / competition bolt handle rotates because they saved $0.50 making the tactical cheese grater bolt handle a turned part (the field model is MIM) and eliminating a mill cut on the bolt handle (countersunk slot that keeps the field bolt handle from rotating).

The bolt handle is a cheese grater because they designed it to stand up to full powered hunting loads which can sometimes bend or break some of the tactical bolt handles on the market. Most of those were designed for Beneli's and the VERSA runs at significantly higher bolt velocities with heavy 3 and 3.5" loads. I guess they figured somebody might use one for home defense. They did almost sell it with a 7+1 tube you know. :surprise:

And as for cheap extended ProBore tubes, that happened because after the 105CTi and 1100G3 died before their time, Remington figured they would scrap or fire sale most of their extended ProBore tube inventory to evidently get it off the books before the end of the year or something. Imagine my surprise to discover a few years ago that they had discontinued the Skeet ProBore tubes and had 0 in inventory. And then they sold IC, Mod, and Full on there website for something in the neighborhood of $3/each.

So, I take it the remington brand pro bore chokes are not as good as briley or carlsons? What I'm trying to determine is if I should replace them. I'm no shotgun choke expert at all, but I'll use them if they work well, but don't want to spend $150 on 3 new chokes if these are just as good or make little difference.

One thing that bugs me is on my JM pro w/briley ext chokes & this versa 3-gun model w/rem pro bore ext chokes is the chokes come loose appx every 10-20 rds on both guns & diff brand chokes even if I tighten them pretty hard w/choke wrench. Is this common with everyone's shotguns?

I have the same problem with my chokes coming loose VERY quickly. Tried really tightening them up the last trip out but made no difference. Just starting out in 3 gun but when I shot trap I don't recall the chokes coming loose very often.

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