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The pressure of being watched.


kita

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Ben's teaching style is fine. I was never bashed in class for making mistakes. Plus, this is a training course. We're supposed to be making mistakes so that they can be corrected. Part of that *is* performing under pressure and your mental game. We're there to learn and learn I did. A lot.

Pressure isn't an instructor problem, it's a student problem.

Kita - The pressure is all self-imposed. When we were doing six-reload-six dry fire I was doing fine until I saw Ben walking down the line out of the corner of my eye. *I* put pressure on myself to do better when the wheels fell off and dorked the reload. I put too much conscious thought into the whole thing instead of just executing the drill.

Also, the more you're under different kinds of pressure, the easier it is to ignore.

I botched some stages at the Carolina Cup last year because of cameras on me … by the time Nationals came around a couple months later I was able to ignore that stuff. A buddy said, "I wouldn't have been able to shoot with all those cameras around." I ended up not even noticing them.

So, shoot more matches to get used to the pressure. It goes away as you focus more on the execution. Participate in more classes and accept that you'll make mistakes (esp mental one's) and you will indeed learn through experience on how to ignore the non-shooting related stuff and focusing on the fundamentals.

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This:

My goal is to shoot better. Perhaps I have turned the people who can help me most into obstacles as opposed to being auxiliary.

What does that have to do with my teaching style?

When you don't apply the best teaching techniques you usually start to become an obstacle to the learning process instead of a guide.

Oh. I see.

For clarity:

Kita was not part of the class. She only shot drills that were done in a firing line so as not to take my time away from students. Despite what she posted in the OP, I offered her zero in terms of critique or pointers. Essentially, she shot with the class but I usually ignored her. I am not going to take my time away from the students that paid to be there. I think Mink tried to help her with some stuff, I don't know. I was with students.

Kita shooting with the class was just a chance for her to shoot (as far as I and she were concerned). I made it clear I didn't think it was fair to spend my time with her when there were other people that paid to have me around.

Kita felt pressured whenever anyone was watching. ESPECIALLY Mink or myself. She told me later that she was surprised to feel as much pressure from him watching as me. Once again, in this class Kita wasn't offered ANY instruction from me. She was only around to shoot a couple of the simple drills. The rest of the time she was in her own bay doing her own thing, or fetching sammitches.

Sorry for the confusion. Kita doesn't choose her words as carefully as she probably should. I think she was trying to get over her stage fright issue. If you think she has a Ben issue that is your business dude. I guess she can't innocently ask a question on a forum without someone with an ax to grind turning it into something it really isn't.

BTW Donovan, Kita set her account to "ignore" you. However, there are plenty of other lady shooters that would love your help.

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Kita doesn't choose her words as carefully as she probably should.

That seems fair. ;)

Just going by what was said. I don't think my posts were the only ones that could be considered an overreaction, or an innocent suggestion that was turned into something it really isn't.

(Also it is very strange to see someone who you are supposedly on the ignore list of posting in one of your threads... just saying)

Edited by DonovanM
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It is possible lugnut had to be treated this way by Ben for him to learn but that Ben approaches other students with a different style.

Guys that have been in it a few years and are stuck in a certain level (like Lugnut) usually need me to push them.

Damn... yeah. I needed to be broken down. It was good for me. I didn't mean to imply in anyway that it was bad... it's just that some people can get all defensive when they realize they have been making mistakes for a while. Not me. But I wear big boy underwear.

Edited by lugnut
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This thread really caught my eye. and put a big smile on my face remembering all the times of blow shots & stages worrying about how was watching me.

I share this story at our local events when new shooters worry about how they are doing compared to the "experienced" shooters

"I shot my first competition in Jan of 1990 the only reason I was not last place at the match was that 2 shooters left before the match was over."

Think about this , Any one that mater's wants you to do as good as you possibly can. if some one does not want you to shoot your best .....They should not even be at the event.

Jamie

I am one of your biggest fans

;)

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This:

My goal is to shoot better. Perhaps I have turned the people who can help me most into obstacles as opposed to being auxiliary.

What does that have to do with my teaching style?

Thread drift. You and Donovan should get a room. ;)

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This:

My goal is to shoot better. Perhaps I have turned the people who can help me most into obstacles as opposed to being auxiliary.

What does that have to do with my teaching style?

Thread drift. You and Donovan should get a room. ;)

I don't want to get shanked.

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This:

My goal is to shoot better. Perhaps I have turned the people who can help me most into obstacles as opposed to being auxiliary.

What does that have to do with my teaching style?

Thread drift. You and Donovan should get a room. ;)

I'm in. I insist on being the power bottom though.

(That being the case, I'd be the one getting shanked. :roflol: )

Edited by DonovanM
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What if you are passionate about the observer?

Perhaps you have a different goal then? What is your goal?

My goal is to shoot better. Perhaps I have turned the people who can help me most into obstacles as opposed to being auxiliary.

I think you are all over it.

It just takes a while to learn that we always have to shoot our own game.

Once we figure out what that is.

:D

That actually makes sense. Thanks.

And it continues to be a struggle. Last year I had some health issues. Finally, after many months of not shooting, went to a match, shot one stage, my back went out, and I went home. I was so happy to be on the range I shot that stage as if it was my last, ever. Totally one with the gun and the targets -- nary a thought or expectation about anything. Turns out I won that stage in Production, and it netted me enough points that I wasn't last in the division for the match, even though I skipped five stages.

Many more months go by -- I finally get to a match and complete the whole thing. I'm so focused on recapturing the feeling of that prior match experience -- trying to live up to my own expectations, rather than just experiencing the shooting -- that I blow it horribly.

Plan your attack on each stage. Rehearse it until you can close your eyes and see yourself executing your plan. Execute your Make Ready routine -- you have one, right? Strive to hear the buzzer, and let your plan unfurl. Rinse, lather, repeat. When the match is over, contemplate how it went. Until then, just try to plan, rehearse, and execute. By focusing on the steps, you complete the race....

If it doesn't work -- and sometimes it won't, start over.....

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I was assisting with setting up stages, running errands, etc. for a Mink/Stoeger class this weekend, and had the opportunity to step in and shoot a couple of the drills with the class. Whenever Ben or Matt walked up behind me to critique and offer pointers, I fell apart and couldn't shoot. At all. If I'm going to shoot matches, other people are obviously going to be there while I'm shooting. How can I get over this "stage fright" so to speak? Does anyone else have this issue?

I would get nervous too if Ben walked up behind me. The trick to shooting in front of people or on camera is to simply change your mindset from "I hope I don't screw up' to "hold my beer and watch this $hit" The real trick is trying not to go too fast or too hard so that you can perform at the level your consistent at.

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There are a lot of good tips here. I am grateful for the input. I know that I am my own problem, it's just a matter of overcoming it. I'm selfishly glad that I'm not the only one making this an issue. :)

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Kita,

Well, having someone close to you as an instructor or mentor can cut both ways. You're married to one, and I'm assuming good friends with the other. I don't know you, but it's what I'm deducing, based on your posts.

I teach basic gun handling to folks and help them get started shooting. I'm nowhere near as good as either Matt or Ben, so finishing is left to people who are better than I am. I start people down the road quite often.

One thing I've found is that having a significant other or someone you admire/are close to as an instructor can sometimes be a bad thing . A reason is that you become conscious of their presence and want to do really well, then start to worry about it to the point where your performance degrades. The possibility also exists that this becomes a point of conflict in some relationships, because one is being critical of the other and the recipient doesn't take it well (I've seen this happen in real life--husband trying to teach wife to shoot and it caused a fight. I was brought in to alleviate the situation.).

Your choices are to either change instructors (not likely) or (don't take this as harshly as it sounds) simply get over it. Desensitizing yourself to it will probably solve about 90% of this issue over time. Put yourself in situations where you're going to be observed, and you'll get over the pressure of being watched--even if it's your husband. I don't know if you have or plan to have kids, but they'll most likely go thru the same thing at some point, whether it's with you guys as their parents or with their friends.

Everyone who's seen your video reviewing the mag pouches knows you can perform in front of people. Take that attitude to the range with you.

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 3 weeks later...

After quite a few years in the game - on a not fantastic level - I have finally embraced my nervousness prior to shooting a stage (particularly the first in a match.)
I feel nervous, and I feel the nervousness as it were, looking at it, pondering - briefly - why this should still be so, after all these years. (You could pursue this with alternate interpretations of the situation, like: This is gonna be a fun stage to shoot!)

Also, I tell other shooters, including those I'd like to beat, that I get nervous. More often than not, others also have their issues, and don't mind discussing them. Then, we both go home feeling a little less awkward.

Finally, as I often tell new shooters; whenever you shoot a match, the other competitors are busy minding their own shooting, and if they watch you make a mistake on a stage, they're indifferent. Tell a competitor about this or that stage you messed up, and he or she is likely to start talking about his or her own shooting on that particular match.

Some of us have a hard time 'not caring' that someone's watching.
Accept it, don't hold a grudge against yourself with it, and try and see the humour in it. It's not dangerous.
Keep learning new stuff.

Siphon

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  • 1 month later...

I have a video camera so I can see what kind of mistakes Im making afterwards but I feel like it puts more pressure on me since it makes me look like Im really really good with the extra gear.

I dont want to remove my cam since I find it really helpful in my improvement but Im pressured all the time.

Ugh, Im in a pickle.

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I believe Lanny Bassham talks about the conscious mind can only contain one thought at a time. Obviously you were thinking about 'them watching you' and not executing your plan. It takes mental discipline not much difference from visual patience.

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  • 2 weeks later...

x2... when I find myself thinking of the people behind me I know my head is not in the game. It doesn't happen often though. Once I'm on deck my mind goes into the zone.

I try and take BE's advice and be in the moment. For example, when I'm loading and making ready... I am loading and making ready. Not loading and making ready but thinking about a long b-zone.

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The beauty of being a fairly new shooter, for me at least, is no pressure. I have a lot yet to learn, and I'm sure if a GM would happen on my squad, I'll get a tip or two. But for now, it's all about the joy of pulling the trigger, doing the best I can, and having fun. I really feel bad for some of the other new shooters that get all nervous.

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The beauty of being a fairly new shooter, for me at least, is no pressure. I have a lot yet to learn, and I'm sure if a GM would happen on my squad, I'll get a tip or two. But for now, it's all about the joy of pulling the trigger, doing the best I can, and having fun. I really feel bad for some of the other new shooters that get all nervous.

+1 to the joy of pulling the trigger and having fun. I hope this never turns into something that I don't enjoy!! :cheers:

For the more experienced shooters - has the pressure of being watched, and wanting to perform for your peers gotten better, or worse as you've matured? I don't feel any pressure when I shoot, but since I'm new I don't have any expectations on how I should perform either.

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