Ready for a progressive Press

[Graham Smith]

Here is a point of view from someone who believes that frugal is not a dirty word.

There is a really fundamental decision you have to make, do you want auto-indexing or not?

If the answer is yes, then you pretty much have three choices:

--Dillon SquareDeal

--Hornady LnL

--Dillon 650B

The SquareDeal is a good press, but it's pistol only and uses proprietary (but very good) dies. You can easily do all your pistol stuff on this and still have money left over to get a turret press for rifle stuff. Unless you are doing large volumes of reloading, this is a perfectly good option and if you decide in a few years that you need more, then you can move up the food chain at that time.

The Hornady LnL is a very good press. While most people here are True Blue, few will say otherwise.

The Dillon 650B is about as good as it gets, short of a commercial grade press. But it is quite expensive.

-----------

If you don't need auto-indexing, then the Dillon 550B is more than up to doing everything you want it to do. Personally, I really prefer a non-indexing press. It forces me to remain much more focused on what I am doing and once you develop a good routine is quite fast.

As to what to get, if you want Dillon anything, call Brian and discuss it. He will help you determine what you really need.

[daves_not_here]

The 550 "As it should be" package is worth it. The empty case bin, roller handle and bullet tray will increase reloading rate. They're the three places you touch for every cycle of the machine.

DNH

[98sr20ve]

The Hornady LnL is a very good press. While most people here are True Blue, few will say otherwise.

I will say otherwise. Hollow ram that flexes when seating primers, primer punch setup with poor stroke, indexing at all the wrong times (throws seated bullet off case when going faster). I could go on. It has some nice "features" but when it comes to actually loading and pulling the handle it's not even close to as good as a 650. And Yes I have owned all the above plus a couple extra.

[CocoBolo]

The Hornady LnL is a very good press. While most people here are True Blue, few will say otherwise.

I will say otherwise. Hollow ram that flexes when seating primers, primer punch setup with poor stroke, indexing at all the wrong times (throws seated bullet off case when going faster). I could go on. It has some nice "features" but when it comes to actually loading and pulling the handle it's not even close to as good as a 650. And Yes I have owned all the above plus a couple extra.

I think this qualifies me to speak on the matter http://www.sashooter.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=746

Well maybe that ram flexes when seating primers its never occurred to me to put a dial indicator and check that since it works very well. Admittedly it takes a bit more strength to seat a primer on the LNL versus the XL650.

Since I load 9 major on both machines I've mastered the art of smoothing out the indexing so I'm not wading thru powder to get to the loader. On the LNL it is just a matter of setting the tension on the shell plate so there is a hint of drag on it. There are lots of posts on the XL650 so won't go into that.

I run a bullet feeder on the Hornady now and no it don't throw bullets all over the room.

Is the LNL equivalent to the XL650 when it comes to pulling the handle and cranking out rounds? Equally equipped with case feeder and a properly configured to perfection they are pretty close.

Where the LNL shines is its versitility and it has a superior powder measure. Able to change calibers for less money, and it is faster. It is a simple design with few parts and only 2 adjustments, index and primer slide. The Dillon on the other hand has lots of adjustments.

Where the Dillon shines is the case feeding mechinisms are better, fewer exceptions, and in case feeding no finikie adjustments.

I down sized had two 650's sold one kept the Hornady. Enough said.

[98sr20ve]

No way my LnL with a case feeder could ever load as fast as my 650. So it depends on your criteria. People who love their LnL's often load slower then me in my experience.

[Bob DuBois]

Loaded on two 550's for a long time before moving to a 650 and more often than not Lee dies are in the tool heads.

The 550 will bolt up fine to a solid bench without the strong mount, I used cardboard boxes for a long time till I picked up a stainless steel bowl to put bullets in. The roller handle is an outstanding option that saves the palm if your into long loading sessions. Try and mount the press level it will help out on the operation.

650 really works better if you have the strong mount and bullet tray just makes servicing the machine easier.

[Mav3rick]

Thanks for the continued input and suggestions. You all have given me quite a lot to think about. FYI-I spoke to Brian and he explained everything to me so I have a pretty good understanding of what I need.

[470nitro]

You will not go wrong getting Brian's advice and buying the press from him. About everything I've learned about progressive press reloading I've gotten from him or his videos. Video on reloading is great if you're just starting out with a progressive.

Started with 550B only and later added strong mount, bullet tray and roller handle and glad I added every one. Wish I would have started that way IMHO. I sit when I reload on my Rock Chucker and my Redding Ultra-Mag but prefer to stand when running my Dillon.

[saibot]

Just thought I'd add a little food for thought. I've been using a XL650 for a while and it's been a great machine. But since I load 223 on it I have to manually swage my brass to get rid of the primer pocket crimp. This takes a lot of extra time and in hindsight a 1050 would have been a better choice since it swages the brass as you load it whereas the 650 doesn't. I know it sounds trivial, but that little step equals HOURS of extra work for me. So you might just consider that when making your decision on your press model.

And just FYI, I posted a while back about my 223 brass processing system that streamlines the process of loading for 3Gun/PR:

http://www.recoilsports.com/2011/03/dramatically-reduce-your-case-prep-time/

I hope this helps! And I know this goes without saying, but do try to buy from Brian. He service is unparalleled and it helps support this site.

[vossman]

I had pretty much the same thing as you except for W231 for powder so I could load all pistol with the one powder. The 550B keeps me more than happy shooting 1000 rounds a month or so. It does well with .223 and H335 powder.

I kept the RockChucker for .270 and my .223 varmint gun.

[ksshooter223]

Go Blue you won't regret it!

[g mac]

red or blue press will both work either way with your current situation...beats loading with single stage, especially when you need lots of ammo to practice and compete. Go to youtube, both red and blue presses has videos about them. I have the red (Hornady LNL), it was cheaper, but works for me. It came with free Hornandy bullets (500rds). I had been doing single stage reloading with RCBS, until I started to shoot USPSA competitions. Most guys in my club told me to go with dillion, but with limited funds, I went with the Hornady LNL. It was so easy to setup for me, and I have no problems whatsover with it. I only load pistol rounds, 9mm, .40 cal, .45 acp, .38 super,.357/.38 special. It's so easy to change dies, just twist n turn. Changing shell plates takes a little longer, need to use allen wrench to change. I don't have to load really fast so it works for me. I usually load only 300-500 rds at any given session. Anyway, good luck, and progressive is way to go for volume reloading. Cheers!

[rooster mcbee]

My Dillon 550 does everything you have asked for. I load the same calibers you mentioned quickly and easily. One of my new shooting buddies bought an Hornaday loader and is suffering from extreme buyers remorse. Do yourself a favor, go blue.

[forddriver]

I have a 550b and it is a great press.

After about 20k rounds loaded on it I realize i should have gotten the 650.

I am not knocking the 550 because i love mine, just wish i had that extra stage and the auto indexing of the 650. But i bet if i got the 650 i would be saying i should have gone with the 1050.

[Lifeislarge]

For most of us shooting is a lifelong endeavor. Unlike a car, a Dillon press doesn't require regular and expensive maintenance, won't depreciate at any rate near that of a new car, comes with amazing support, and will offer years of solid use without any major upgrades. I have a 550, and a 1050, have yet to load a single round on either of them (still amassing parts and supplies), but have decided to keep both. If I reload for the next twenty years, the cost of the equipment is negligible. Most of our guns cost more than the press, and we have several. Don't let the cost be the deciding factor. I would rather regret the things I did, than the things I didn't do.

[TerryYu]

I'm just with the bandwagon here.

Call Brian, ask him about the 550B. Buy whatever he recommends.

Don't think about the cost, it will all even out in the long run. What you gain in piece of mind knowing that your bullets are being made on a quality piece of machinery is well worth the extra couple of hundred bucks in the short term.

I went from loading on Lee progressives to "save money". The 550b, while costing 4x more than my old reloader, has saved me at least that much in future blood pressure meds. When I step into the garage to load, my press is my loading buddy, not something I have to fight.

As someone that has recently got into shooting sports, I'm not ashamed to admit sinking about 15k into this hobby in the last 2 years. My reloading setup has cost less than 10% of what I've spent so far. In the long run, ammo and match fees are going to be your main costs.

Just added it up (thanks Mint.com).

12k of shooting:

4500 worth of guns

1500 worth of loading stuff

6k for ammo and fees

Edited September 1, 2012 by TerryYu

[PJones1911]

I have had a 550 for a couple of years and purchased a 650 and would never go back. Get the 650. The additional cost will be forgotten soon.

[insane04]

dillon 550 all the way.ive been pleased with mine

[Lifeislarge]

Did you get a press? If not I have EVERYTHING you need. PM for details if interested.

[Crydaddy]

I have reloaded on both LNL and 650xl. I'll break down the points between the two.

Dillon:

Pros

-solid feel when cranking lever

-positive primer seating feel

-almost trouble free casefeeder function.( experience binding at times although rare.)

-less time fine tuning the press and more time spent cranking out ammo

Cons

-expensive

-takes longer to switch calibers even with the tool head

-expensive caliber change kit

-primers fall off with when indexing without a case.

-harder to take case off with buttons when checking case.

-looks too closed in. Narrow field of view of the cases.

- without casefeeder it's more involved as you have to load case with right hand and bullet with left hand.

-without the primer chute option, spent primers at times miss the cup

LNL

Pros:

-cheaper press only purchase

-ezject feature is convenient especially when checking cases.

-more open sight view

-quick caliber change with the die bushing feature

-smoother indexing feature

-primers do not fall off the seating ram

-accurate powder dispenser

-left hand does both bullet and case placing.

-spent primer chute leads primers to a bottle away from press.

Cons:

- expensive case feeder

-needs to properly tune indexing

-problems with cases falling off the feeder ( mods needed with PVC pipe to eliminate issue)

-primer seater must be kept clean otherwise jams would ensue.

-shell plate loosens frequently when hand tightening. (Hornady recommended)

-9mm cases at times tips causing some binding with the sizer die.

These are my points. May be different with others.

Both customer service are great!!!

I use the dillon exclusively for 40 sw loads. LNL for multiple calibers. I really do not see myself parting with either press.

Hope this helps

Edited October 27, 2012 by Crydaddy

[jester121]

Crydaddy, that seems like a very fair breakdown, based on my experience owning an LnL, and using a friend's 650 a few times. I've never had a bit of trouble with primers, and the main thing I like is never taking my right hand off the handle -- even not having a bullet or case feeder, yet.

[shopgun]

Whichever press you get, 550 or 650, you would do well to consider Dillon sizer dies for your straight wall cases. They have a radius at the mouth of the die which eliminates cases hitting the edge of the die when the ram is raised. I had that problem loading 38 spcl cases with a RCBS size die. It didn't happen on every case but enough to be a real pain in the rear having to hand align it into the die. I don't know if it WILL be a problem with shorter cases like 9mm or 45 acp since I went blue on those calibers when I started loading them. I loaded on a 550 for a few years before upgrading to a 650 in 1994!!! I have no idea how many tens of thousands or rounds have come off that machine and some of the parts are still original. So if you do want to "buy once, cry once" the 650 will not disappoint.

[CocoBolo]

-less time fine tuning the press and more time spent cranking out ammo

I totally disagree with CryDaddy on the less time fine tuning, that is not true at all for me. Fact is and this is a repeating story. I have my 650 set for 9 major, I run 2 or 3K let it set for a couple days get back on and now case rims are getting clipped by the sizing die, so I stop adjust the pusher block, next about 500 in having trouble with primers not being lined up, stop and adjust the primer cam and so on. Yes after a couple years you get to know what need to be fine tuned but still way too much and too many.

LNL - 4 years ago I set the indexing it was off from the factory, I also set the primer slide adjustment. Those were the last adjustments I made to the press except for shell plate tension when changing calibers.

Now on the LNL case feeding that is a whole nother story, when you compare that to the Dillon then yeah, you got the same amount of adjustment post caliber change. The feeding mechanism takes lots of fine tuning, normally I have it right by the end of 200 rounds. Case tipping is a problem when you have the pusher block adjusted improperly, most times this comes from the case touching the shell plate before it hits the groove so you slow the pusher down a tick and no more tipped cases. A sturdy level bench stops the falling of the block.

[roostershooter]

Assuming you don't want to throw money at a couple of presses to find out which one you like best ... I'd go with the 550, as others have stated.

Although I've not owned a 500 I will tell you my story.

I was reloading on a Lee Single Stage press for umpteen years, until I decided to get into the 'Progressive' game. I looked and looked and decided on a Lee Loadmaster, and loaded on it for 2 or 3 years until I decided to save up the scratch and get a Dillon 650XL. Now I load exclusively on the 1050 and 650. On the rare occasion, as with 45-70 and 7.62x54R, I will go back to the Lee Single Stage to crank out 100 rds. or so. Other than that ... I do everything on the Dillon rigs.

With that being said ...

If $$$ is tight for you, and you don't mind 'learning' on a Lee Loadmaster, they can't be beat for the money. A lot of people complain about the Loadmaster, but I find it is due to their lack of following directions that causes their problems. Once you get the Loadmaster dialed in ... you can crank out several hundreds of rounds an hour with zero hiccups.

Now, with the Dillon 650XL ... I have yet to have a problem out of it that wasn't operator induced. I have loaded 20,000+ rounds on it, and am in my second set of dies on a lot of calibers. From my experience, the dies wear out before the machine does.

In not owning the 550 I would still recommend it due to the high praise that it receives from a lot of people. From my understanding of it, you can run it in either single stage mode or progressive mode with little room for error, as long as you are paying attention. Furthermore, the 550 will allow you to take your time, and not worry about advancing until you are ready. No need to get into a hurry when reloading. Granted, you won't reload thousands of rounds in one setting, but you will get the basic fundamentals down for being able to on another machine.

Hope this helps.

[ben b.]

My experience has been such that I say that Crydaddy wrote a very good summary of LnL AP vs 650. I would happily start over with either, but since i have space for one press to load everything, the LnL AP has the advantage. I do like the Dillon casefeeder a bit more.

i would not buy a 550 for loading multiple caliber. The auto index is important and most of the squibs I see are from 550s. Cue the "blah-blah I check every case with my eyes"...I've heard it several times from guys with bullets stuck in their barrels, or sometimes with blown-up guns.

Edited October 29, 2012 by ben b.