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3n37 Or 3n38


Rufus The Bum

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Well I'm about to start reloading for Major 9, but have yet to decide on a powder. The general opinion on this board seems to be either 3n37 or 3n38. Would it REAllY matter if I got one or the other? OR are they basically the same powder? Having NO experience whatseover reloading Major 9, I'm just going on what all I have read here. I'd hate to get stuck with 8lbs of powder I couldn't really use (been there, done that) My barrel by the way is a Sheumann 5" 9mm with 2 small barrel ports and a 5 port comp.

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I have one of JL Hardy's Open Guns (commander length slide), and have used 3N38. It works well. With the shorter barrel, I do get some pretty significant flash from the compensator and hybrid ports. I've gotten to the point where I never notice it, but others around me usually comment on the flame thrower :D

3N38 meters well and the load seems very consistent. I am looking at other powders due to its cost though.

Carl

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3n38 works the comp a lot more than 3n37, for the same velocity.

Does require a little more charge weight. And every barrel/port setup is a little different. Something else might work better for you.

Just my opinion, if you're going to pay the high price for VihtaVouri in Open, 3n38 is the one, hands down.

Having said that I like Vectan SP2 better - 40% cheaper price.

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rufus, i have been working with 9mm major as much as anyone and there are a few reasons i don't reccommend 3n37. it has to do with about 6 or seven barrels hanging over my work bench that i have changed out for shooters. on each barrel they are missing the rifling from the chamber up to an inch down the bore. i had a lengthy discussion with wil schuman regarding this and am convinced that the reason for this wear is due to the fast burn rate and high flame temp of powders which are so fast. at the time of this conversation with wil,i was just starting to work up the 9mm guns and he agreed to make me a few of the new aet commander hybricomp barrels with the 9x19 chambers. he reccomended i try the 3n38 because it was developed specifically for small case capicity open class guns used in ipsc. it also had the proper flame temp and burn rate to help reduce the wear i had been seeing with long term use of fast powders. during the conversation he also mentioned another powder with the same charactistics. that powder was vectan sp2. as luck would have it i had an 8 lb jug that i had never opened on the shelf. i bought some 3n38 and compared the sp2 to it and found that both powders performed the same and used the same charge weights(not same charge volumes). sp2 is slightly denser. i located a bunch of sp2 real cheap and bought a bunch. due to the cost and the fact i like the way it performs it is my favorite. if i didn't have it i would be shooting 3n38 even though it is slightly more expensive than the other powders that can be used. i don't think that the extra cost involved would compel me to risk premature damage to a gun that i like. good shooting, j.l. hardy

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My experince with both as been to make major with my 5" tribrid using 3N37 was cases would stick very tightly where the gun wouldn't extract from the AET fluted chamber. My guess was high pressure. No such problems with 3N38 making major. The gun runs great and the primers show now signs of pressure.

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I just got through with a bunch of powder testing in my short Dawson .38 Super with 121gr bullets.

4756 is close to 3N38 performance-wise, but is a pain to load, being so bulky-- there's no way you're getting enough into a 9mm case. 7625 had noticeably more dot movement than N350 or 3N37. 3N37 had more 'boom' than N350, but is less bulky and a tad softer. 3N38 was snappier with less flip and nice to load, but expensive. N105 was even flatter and snappier, but bulky and pricy again.

I did discover that there's no magic powder-- they're all not that different, so 'pick one and practice' is probably better than agonizing over it.

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I agree with everything Shred just said. I've shot at least 3lbs of each of those powders.

N105 will make Major at the published load (SAAMI specs) but only in a pretty long OAL of 38super. Compressed load.

3n38 and Vectan SP2 can give you a "safe" Major load even with less case capacity. How much less, I don't know.

For how flat it shoots, 3n38 probably has the least amount of excess, or 'rocket effect'. It's a softer slap in your hand to go with the minimal muzzle rise.

It also *moves more air*. I don't know why, it just does. I find that very cool. B)

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eric, all barrels were 38 super. all according to the shooters were used almost exclusively with 3n37. the case mentioned above with brass sticking in the chamber is an example of the higher pressure i refer to. to go along with it flame temp is high. if you get a chance try loading up some different powders and going to an indoor range where you can turn out the lights and have someone else fire the gun. watch the flame colors coming out of the ports. what i saw was yellow and blue flames out of most powders except sp2. sp2 seemed to give off dark grey gas. 3n38 gave off just a little yellow flame. if you have ever gas welded then you know that the color of a neutral flame is blue with a yellow tip. i prefered to have gas and not flame coming out of the ports. my information on the powders also came from extensive conversations with wil schumann who claims to have tested the powders or has extensive knowledge of their properties.good shooting, j.l.hardy

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The 5" TriBrid mentioned in my last post was sent back to Wil because it wouldn't shoot a group and was fiercely sticking cases. He found metal from the hibrid posts had liquidified and run down in the path of the bullet. I sent the barrel with an explaination of my load work-up using 7625, 4756 and 3n37. Be said they were the cause of the problems due to such high temps and pressure.

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  • 6 months later...

ouch, gas actually melting the hybrid ports??

you using acetylene for gun powder??

i have never heard of that kind of stuff happening.

wierd.

im looking into a tribrid major 9,, 6 inch tribrid shouldnt have any trouble making major in 9mm with 3n38 and or SP2??right fellas?

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Please try IMR before you buy a keg of anything.

7625 if you like it snappy and smooth

4756 if you like it flatter.

I like 'em both.

SA

Steve,

Where are you getting your IMR? Can you give me the short version on how burn rates effect the equation?

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In referance to the Tribrid ports melting. A year and a half ago I had an open gun that had the Tribrid II 6" barrel in it and I had heard the horror stories but then started experimenting.

The barrel was chambered for 9supercomp and I was using 115 gr bullets and what I found was that the only bullet that would shoot thru that barrel without spitting pieces out of the ports was a JHP. The reason behind this is that all the other bullets would expand under the pressure to make Major and as they passed the ports they expanded into the ports thus shearing off pieces. I had a lengthy conversation with Wil about this and I am surprised that he doesn't remember that using anything other than a JHP in his barrels destroys those ports in short order. I think that is why the accuracy goes to s$%^t using FMJ's. IMHO it is not the powder at fault.

I am surprised that a 38 super barrel would be erroded the way that has been described as they operate at a far less pressure area than 9 supercomp. In 9 supercomp I used 3N38 and N-105 only and that gun still has the same barrel in it today and is still a Tack Driver!

In working up loads for my new Benny Hill STI shorty 9mm Major I found that 3N37 with a 115 FMJ was far flatter shooting and easier to make Major with than 3N38 which I would use if I choose if I went to a 125gr bullet. I could not get enough 3N38 in a 9mm case to make Major with the 115's. I also use Federal Small Rifle primers as they have a lower temp ignition and can handle the pressure far better. My gun is set up with a 3 port comp and 2 bleeder holes in the top of the barrel.

Do not try this at home unless you work up to it first. My load that works my gun is 8.4grs of 3N37, FC once fired case, FSR primer, 115gr FMJ seated to 1.155 and chronos at 1498fps and is flat as a pancake! :D

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sounds like a hot cake...many folks like a touch heavier bullet than 115, especailly if you go outside of uspsa.

124s seem to be the best major bullet made.

all JHPs,, FMJs blow apart, it seems.

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