Sniperboy

Thanks for your response and sharing that. Coming from CA myself "if you know, you know..." But I was sincerely interested in the motivation.

I am just wondering if NJ matches "allow" 15 rounders for production despite the law. If NJ allows 15 rounders for production then the question is: did people quit Production because they don't want to buy 15 rounders (and possibly skirt the law) or if they are protesting against the new USPSA rules, despite having 15 rounders on hand. Or it could simply be that everyone in NJ shoots 10 rounds and production guys quit because they don't want to shoot 15 when they leave the state.. I dunno.. it's just a lot of compounding questions that is difficult to ask piecemeal, on line, instead of in person. But I am still curious of the motivation to switching to L10.

I get the feeling that ban states still silently shoot to normal capacity. The real question is if NJ participants switched to Limited 10 out of necessity in order to comply with the law (or they didn't want to compete against pre-ban 15 rounders). OR if the switch to L10 was a silent protest. Interesting data point either way.

You learn something new every day. Thank you for taking the time to explain that. I would never have found that easily with a search.

FNG here again. What does "(10.5.9) initially loading a revolver with a spurless hammer" refer to? I did try to do a search here and on the www but without having a clue to prod me in the right direction, all I found are discussions on how horrible it is to lower a hammer on an SP-01 or the unabridged history of revolver design : ).

What an interesting and charming thread. All from the philosophy of routine and even the dig about annoying the competition, which I got a good laugh out of. A snarky but very fair observation. I asked a revo veteran why they pull the trigger back slightly and spin the cylinder. As was mentioned it was to make sure that there were no high primers and the bullets were all seated properly so that there was no way for it to bind. But pragmatically speaking this only works for the first set of rounds. If you get a high primer in your reload moonclip then you're effed anyways. As an interesting side note he also mentioned that icore rules allow this, you cannot do this in USPSA since you are not allowed to pull the trigger "half cock" to be able to rotate the cylinder a full revolution?? Have not verified. Still pretty cool though and works great to annoy everyone - kind of like catching your round mid air during the unload and show clear procedure : ) I will say in the very few times I shot revolver I have this urge to make sure the cylinder locks with a click before I holster. An asinine and unneeded action but a compulsion all the same.

Just making an observation about how newer shooters at least in our ranges gravitate towards CO and LO instead of open with rare exception. Those who shoot open are typically those who already invested too much sunk cost in their gun and reloading equipment. At least in my impression. You do make a valid argument which kind of proves the point of low cap advocates. Almost to a T. "...sometimes think that everyone feels the same" - which is astute. People who shoot major like it, almost religiously. Those who like low cap and like to reload repeatedly are the same.

What's done is done I am on IHAVEGAS's team that says things should be left where they are. 15 rounds in Prod will simply blur the lines between Limited and everything else, and maybe this is what is destined to happen. 140mm minor iron sights with no modification limitation. Between the retro Mustangs trend, fanny packs, front cocking serrations, lack of finger grooves being back in fashion, I think we are naturally going back, which may not be a bad thing. It's back to a simpler time. At this rate I can see everything reverting back to 199X with just 3 divisions. LO will definitely encroach on OPEN very soon when people decide major PF is no longer in style. Optics, PCC & everything else.

Well it looks like the thread has meandered elsewhere, but if anyone still cares about the original topic at hand, here's my bit of info to add to the timetable. Our club ordered a large batch of the red/white/black Winchester primers pre pandemic and they arrived around 2021. They were fine and lit off same as the previous Blue box. However shortly after 2021 I noticed that the Winchester white box 9mm ammo labelled "Target/Practice" were incredibly hard. Even harder than CCI ammo. My Glock that had no problem with win primers for years would not light off a single round. A CZ SP-01 with 11.5lb hammer spring had a high rate of failures too. In fact winchester said they would take back this ammo when a a complaint was sent. The newer batches of red/white/black primers, true to form were harder. Something definitely changed in the recent batches after 2021.

Look up "dental elevator" you're welcome : ) they come in different flavours so you'll have to choose the right one. The angled picks work but having one with a flat point (as opposed to a needle point) really helps make it a bit easier.

The way the production questions were presented leads me to believe that the Board already made the decision to increase capacity, the only question was by how much and the second survey was simply to confirm that there would not be pushback from the general populace. If I may - if one actually cared about increasing or maintaining participation in Production then these questions would have been more logical: 1. Do you shoot Production regularly? Yes/No. (Undecided new members and those who have switched to CO answer "No".) 2. If No, then will a 15 round capacity entice you shoot Production regularly, or make you come back to Production? 3. If Yes, should capacity be increased to 15? 4. Bonus question: Should single action only pistols be allowed in Production? (Without eliminating Single Stack division). But then again, we've been beating this dead horse since they allowed external modifications in Production. Yet another example of a specialized group forced to change in the spirit of inclusivity, only to be watered down and left a bloody husk that loses purpose.

I suppose only time will tell. Changing production to 15 rounds will either: a) Attract ALL the guys who were just champing at the bit to shoot production but really wanted more than 10 rounds. b) Absolutely alienate those who remain in Production and put the final nail on this division.

Likewise I have had a 9mm Tac Sport slide in the back of the safe that I want to try using for LO. Is CZC the only game in town for milling TS slides? Locally I do not know of anyone who uses the Tac Sport for LO. Mostly it is Shadow 2s converted to SAO and 2011s. I get that the 2011 mystique has always been strong but is there something I am missing as to why people are not using the TS for LO?

It could be a bad batch of primers. These were sub minor loads : ) you are correct the primers dropped it enough to cause problems and actually make me take notice, just that as drastic as I expected.

Once upon a time the answer was "no". Mainly because people were comparing domestic regular primers (Federal, Winchester, CCI) to their magnum counterparts. In this instance its not much - if anything magnum primers give insignificant increase. With the influx of foreign primers, the answer may change. My local friends and I have recently found that Fiocchi primers may actually REDUCE the velocity. Tell you what, typically people are scared of increases in velocity, sudden loss of velocity sucks more. We all ofcourse had pet loads that we liked, we only changed the primer. (All of us used to use Fed or Winchester) Person #1 used Vectan loads with Fiocchi primers. Suddenly had 1 out of 20 jams due to light loads. Chrono shows a wide fluctuation in velocity. Then it jammed while chrono, there was a massive dip in velocity. Person #2 used titegroup with Fiocchi. Some variation in velocity. No jams. I used titegroup with Fiocchi. No variation. No jams. I used N320 with Fiocchi for the first time. Could not get past 5 shots before a jam or stovepipe. It was a fun weekend pulling 200 rounds to salvage components. Here's the data, do with it as you wish.